Wasp (Hope Van Dyne) (6/26/18)

jamesh

So, is there any reason the new 5* Wasp should lock out the 4* Wasp?

On the film side, they are independent characters: I haven't seen the new film yet, but the fact that they cast a well known actor for Janet would indicate they co-exist.

The comic cover shows Nadia Pym/Van Dyne, who works along side the Janet Van Dyne Wasp.

There doesn't seem to be a "only one hammer" or "one was depowered when the other gained their powers" excuse here like for Thor or Hulk.

bluewolf

jamesh said:

So, is there any reason the new 5* Wasp should lock out the 4* Wasp?

On the film side, they are independent characters: I haven't seen the new film yet, but the fact that they cast a well known actor for Janet would indicate they co-exist.

The comic cover shows Nadia Pym/Van Dyne, who works along side the Janet Van Dyne Wasp.

There doesn't seem to be a "only one hammer" or "one was depowered when the other gained their powers" excuse here like for Thor or Hulk.

The reason is the character name is the same, just “Wasp”.  They are obviously different people since Janet Van Dyne in the film is Hope’s mother.  But the game has it set up so that the main cause of locking out characters is if they have the same main character name in game.

If they had named Miles “Spider-Man” as his main name and “Miles Morales” as his secondary name, he could not coexist on the same team as any of the Peter Parker variants, who are all “Spider-Man”.

TPF Alexis

I have to say, she is fantastic in one regard: the art. Probably my fave so far this year in terms of visual design.

jamesh

bluewolf said:

jamesh said:

So, is there any reason the new 5* Wasp should lock out the 4* Wasp?

On the film side, they are independent characters: I haven't seen the new film yet, but the fact that they cast a well known actor for Janet would indicate they co-exist.

The comic cover shows Nadia Pym/Van Dyne, who works along side the Janet Van Dyne Wasp.

There doesn't seem to be a "only one hammer" or "one was depowered when the other gained their powers" excuse here like for Thor or Hulk.

The reason is the character name is the same, just “Wasp”.  They are obviously different people since Janet Van Dyne in the film is Hope’s mother.  But the game has it set up so that the main cause of locking out characters is if they have the same main character name in game.

If they had named Miles “Spider-Man” as his main name and “Miles Morales” as his secondary name, he could not coexist on the same team as any of the Peter Parker variants, who are all “Spider-Man”.

I understand the technical aspect that the game doesn't let two characters with the same primary name be part of a team.  But it is the game developers who gave the two distinct characters the same name, so I was wondering whether any thought went into the decision.

When it has happened in the past we've usually been given storyline justifications about why two individuals are mutually exclusive.  Granted, they didn't give any explanation when 5* Ghost Rider was released, but I can always hope.

Mujo5

There is only one spirit of vengeance

Chrono_Tata

Mujo5 said:

There is only one spirit of vengeance

Robbie Reyes isn't possessed by the Spirit of Vengeance though.

bluewolf

I suspect that since they have a lot of steps involved for approval through Marvel, naming is very high on that list. So some names may be Marvel-directed, and others may be simply that they need to go with the character’s most recognized name.  Also, looking at the font size on the Roster screen, using more than 2 words in the name doesn’t seem possible.

ZeiramMR

bluewolf said:

I suspect that since they have a lot of steps involved for approval through Marvel, naming is very high on that list. So some names may be Marvel-directed, and others may be simply that they need to go with the character’s most recognized name.  Also, looking at the font size on the Roster screen, using more than 2 words in the name doesn’t seem possible.

Kraven the Hunter. ;-)

broll

mega ghost said:

Unless they're releasing a 5* Ant-Man next that, when paired with her, makes all of her abilities shine while also generating AP for them, 

This would make me so happy!  5* Ant-Man with a Giant-Man phase!

mega ghost

broll said:

mega ghost said:

Unless they're releasing a 5* Ant-Man next that, when paired with her, makes all of her abilities shine while also generating AP for them, 

This would make me so happy!  5* Ant-Man with a Giant-Man phase!

Yes! It looks like we're getting Ghost next, but I've still got my fingers crossed.

ZeiramMR

Looks like you all have your answer about Swarm tile generation and a missing piece of the puzzle. A Support showed up that has a chance to make Swarm tiles when placed on this Wasp. Not a satisfying answer but there you go.

Although it is much more interesting to me is that this Support doesn't have 5 tiers like the others do, but has a larger damage increase as Rank 1 than other Supports have had. I would guess this one gives a little under 40 damage increase to Blue matches when unleveled if it scales like the other Match Damage perks, and possibly 110 damage at level 50. This means it is much easier to use this Support to change the strongest color for a character with Blue as one of their three colors.

Sm0keyJ0e

ZeiramMR said:

Looks like you all have your answer about Swarm tile generation and a missing piece of the puzzle. A Support showed up that has a chance to make Swarm tiles when placed on this Wasp. Not a satisfying answer but there you go.

Although it is much more interesting to me is that this Support doesn't have 5 tiers like the others do, but has a larger damage increase as Rank 1 than other Supports have had. I would guess this one gives a little under 40 damage increase to Blue matches when unleveled if it scales like the other Match Damage perks, and possibly 110 damage at level 50. This means it is much easier to use this Support to change the strongest color for a character with Blue as one of their three colors.

I really, really hope the new game design is to not release an obviously bad character, who can then be made marginally better by equipping specific supports. Feels like unneeded gated DLC to chase. Just release a good toon and make supports have more universal utility.

fork1977

Tensuun said:

There really aren't that many 5-star team-healers, are there? But if you don't insist on an all-5-star team, sticking her with CarDusa will make things start getting real nutty, real fast.

THIS.  I hated Wasp when first using her, but CarDusa was the answer.  It's that black passive that makes her, and I would recommend a 4/5/4 build.  That gets you the full yellow benefit, 2 black swarm for the passive heal, and 2 blue swarm for the CD.  Since Medusa generates blue for Wasp, you can possibly drop her CD tiles twice before the swarm becomes the power.  Then, her goal is to make massive match damage before blowing up the board.  That said, the damage is lackluster, but Medusa is the key to her build.  Unless, they make a 5* Ant Man that also heals her passively.  

I was ready to write a book on how bad she was, but Tensuun is correct.  The swarm tiles add up fast, lock the board, and increase her match and board shake damage.  Is she top tier? Heck no.  But she is a better third for a CarDusa team than Grocket.  She is definitely not trash, even if she is not an upper tier toon like the last three 5* releases.

whitecat31

Wasp is one of my favorite characters in the marvel universe.   So I had to have her. I blew a giant horde, I got a 5/1/5 and extra covers.  I did practically everything in my power to get Antman to level 300 so I could get that second yellow cover.  I burned three covers to get the third yellow.  Used the antman level 280 cover to champ +1. Now to test.

She is warm slimy garbage. Her match damage is typical for a five star.   You need at least 4 swarm tiles on the board, to increase match damage, and that damage is 10% for each swarm tile.  Her Blue ability will steal randomly, up to 4 AP, but if the AP chosen has less than 4 AP, you get what they have.    The count down tiles, like other countdown tiles are easily destroyed and rarely generate the swarm tiles. Also they might be bugged, to stop producing, if some swarm tiles are on the board already.

The difference between 4 blue cover and 5 blue cover is just 1 AP stolen. 

The yellow is useless if she is the last one remaining and there are less than the required swarm tiles. Otherwise the invisibility thing is rather costly and not very helpful, because it is just temporary for one character.  Sure it might nice to protect Thor, but otherwise, it is way too costly.

The difference between 4 yellow and 5 yellow is 1 turn for that ally to be invisible.

Black is not true healing and is costly  it is also limited by how many swarm tiles you have on the board, because if there are more than 3 swarm tiles on the board, it can't be used for healing.  It is automatically Call the Swarm.

Once you have those 4 swarm tokens, you want to keep them, because of the match damage increase.  The time it takes to get that match damage level is too long to be really be useful. 

The Call to Swarm cost 12 and destroys swarms tile that help your modified match damage, so that bites, because she is actually working against herself, and when used it does not do that much damage.

So to sum it up, costly abilities that do little, are unpredictable, with no desirable active passives.

She makes Doc Ock and banner look sexy.

She may be the worst 5 star ever made. 

fork1977

whitecat31 said:

Wasp is one of my favorite characters in the marvel universe.   So I had to have her. I blew a giant horde, I got a 5/1/5 and extra covers.  I did practically everything in my power to get Antman to level 300 so I could get that second yellow cover.  I burned three covers to get the third yellow.  Used the antman level 280 cover to champ +1. Now to test.

She is warm slimy garbage. Her match damage is typical for a five star.   You need at least 4 swarm tiles on the board, to increase match damage, and that damage is 10% for each swarm tile.  Her Blue ability will steal randomly, up to 4 AP, but if the AP chosen has less than 4 AP, you get what they have.    The count down tiles, like other countdown tiles are easily destroyed and rarely generate the swarm tiles. Also they might be bugged, to stop producing, if some swarm tiles are on the board already.

The difference between 4 blue cover and 5 blue cover is just 1 AP stolen. 

The yellow is useless if she is the last one remaining and there are less than the required swarm tiles. Otherwise the invisibility thing is rather costly and not very helpful, because it is just temporary for one character.  Sure it might nice to protect Thor, but otherwise, it is way too costly.

The difference between 4 yellow and 5 yellow is 1 turn for that ally to be invisible.

Black is not true healing and is costly  it is also limited by how many swarm tiles you have on the board, because if there are more than 3 swarm tiles on the board, it can't be used for healing.  It is automatically Call the Swarm.

Once you have those 4 swarm tokens, you want to keep them, because of the match damage increase.  The time it takes to get that match damage level is too long to be really be useful. 

The Call to Swarm cost 12 and destroys swarms tile that help your modified match damage, so that bites, because she is actually working against herself, and when used it does not do that much damage.

So to sum it up, costly abilities that do little, are unpredictable, with no desirable active passives.

She makes Doc Ock and banner look sexy.

She may be the worst 5 star ever made. 

Bigby confirmed black is a true heal

whitecat31

fork1977 said:

whitecat31 said:

Wasp is one of my favorite characters in the marvel universe.   So I had to have her. I blew a giant horde, I got a 5/1/5 and extra covers.  I did practically everything in my power to get Antman to level 300 so I could get that second yellow cover.  I burned three covers to get the third yellow.  Used the antman level 280 cover to champ +1. Now to test.

She is warm slimy garbage. Her match damage is typical for a five star.   You need at least 4 swarm tiles on the board, to increase match damage, and that damage is 10% for each swarm tile.  Her Blue ability will steal randomly, up to 4 AP, but if the AP chosen has less than 4 AP, you get what they have.    The count down tiles, like other countdown tiles are easily destroyed and rarely generate the swarm tiles. Also they might be bugged, to stop producing, if some swarm tiles are on the board already.

The difference between 4 blue cover and 5 blue cover is just 1 AP stolen. 

The yellow is useless if she is the last one remaining and there are less than the required swarm tiles. Otherwise the invisibility thing is rather costly and not very helpful, because it is just temporary for one character.  Sure it might nice to protect Thor, but otherwise, it is way too costly.

The difference between 4 yellow and 5 yellow is 1 turn for that ally to be invisible.

Black is not true healing and is costly  it is also limited by how many swarm tiles you have on the board, because if there are more than 3 swarm tiles on the board, it can't be used for healing.  It is automatically Call the Swarm.

Once you have those 4 swarm tokens, you want to keep them, because of the match damage increase.  The time it takes to get that match damage level is too long to be really be useful. 

The Call to Swarm cost 12 and destroys swarms tile that help your modified match damage, so that bites, because she is actually working against herself, and when used it does not do that much damage.

So to sum it up, costly abilities that do little, are unpredictable, with no desirable active passives.

She makes Doc Ock and banner look sexy.

She may be the worst 5 star ever made. 

Bigby confirmed black is a true heal

I don't care what @Bigby may have claimed.(I can't find that claim here, perhaps you can link it) She is not true heal in the game when I use her healing ability.  You get the green health bar.  Not to mention when Call the Swarm is active, her match damage increase is not shown based on the amount of swarm tiles generated.

Waddles_Pines

whitecat31 said:
I don't care what @Bigby claimed. She is not true heal in the game when I use her healing ability.  You get the green health bar.  Not to mention when Call the Swarm is active, her match damage increase is not shown based on the amount of swarm tiles generated. 

As for the damage increase, there are a lot of powers where the number shown graphically isn't the same as what's taken off the enemy's health bar (eg PunMax strike buff).  If the damage done doesn't reflect Wasp's damage increase, then that's a bug.  In that case post it in the Bugs forum cause it's more likely to get noticed by Brigby or developers on that forum.  

HoundofShadow

It's not true heal, but burst heal. I do agree 5-Star Wasp is weak. Weak damage all around. Make it a true heal but increase the black AP needed might be better.

I think she is the 2nd character that has a self-healing ability that is not a true heal.  Normally, team-healing is temporary healing and self-healing is true healing.

AXP_isme

I can’t see myself chasing wasp covers at all so at least it should help strengthen my will to hoard. 

//Removed Non-Constructive / Insult -Brigby

Jaedenkaal

HoundofShadow said:

I think she is the 2nd character that has a self-healing ability that is not a true heal.  Normally, team-healing is temporary healing and self-healing is true healing.

Poor Ragnarok...