New Gambit nerf

jackstar0

If Gambit getting knocked on his butt re-adjusts the meta to allow for more variety, then I am completely in favor of it.

If it is coupled with a buff for Banner (C'mon, please!), all the better.

Warbringa

Tony_Foot said:

We know it’s coming, they already told us officially on the forum it was being worked on. It’s just waiting to see how bad the beating is. 

They said they didn’t want to stop him being the best, I have a feeling they will take Lucille to him as usual when they nerf.

Where was this at on the forums?

evade420

I feel like they will nerf him just enough that he is still viable but not a must have for PvP .
As compensation it would be cool if instead of straight up selling him in exchange for 5* tokens they would let us keep him champed , but give us back his champion levels to exchange, I know a lot of people (such as myself) would have stopped pulling tokens once he was champed if he wasnt the best of the best at the time.
So if the nerf is bad enough that I'm not going to be using him in pvp anymore, then I want those champ levels back but I still want him at lvl 450 for pve

Jaedenkaal

evade420 said:

I feel like they will nerf him just enough that he is no longer viable as a must have for PvP .

Viable as a must-have. Interesting concept. I'm assuming you mean, viable, but not a must-have.

Sadly, traditionally that zone is a very small and difficult target, and combined with the human tendency for hyperbole leads to basically all nerfs declared overkill and the character written off as dead.

evade420

Jaedenkaal said:

Viable as a must-have. Interesting concept. I'm assuming you mean, viable, but not a must-have.
 

yes that one

babinro

Jabrony_Geoff said:

If they nerf Gambit in a bad way you will see mass game uninstalls like never before.
#justsaying.

We've had several meta defining characters nerfed over the years. 

They know exactly what to expect by now.

We have no reason to believe the mass uninstalls will be any worse than those that happened with Rags, Spidey, Mags, Sentry XF, Thor, OML's and now Gambits.

The game will live on and in most cases it will do so for the better.

On Topic:

The proposed Gambit nerf as I understand it (and I don't have all the facts) seems to be a reasonable one.   You could say its going a bit too far but this will still be a character who self generates AP and that's extremely powerful.

I suspect PvP will open up in terms of options allow a LOT of underappreciated teams fight for wins since Gambit completely shut them down.   This is GREAT news for anyone looking to do the wins based pvp goals over points.

As far as competitive pvp is concerned I think we can expect to see Thor all day long.   He's the new meta and in some ways he's already the current meta but Gambit suppresses your offensive options.

Thor/JJ

Thor/Okoye

Thor/DD

These teams should thrive in a post game nerf meta.  

Does that mean Gambit will be gone?  

Not in my opinion.  In fact, the few people who have Blackbolt champed can probably enjoy a resurgence as Gambit/Bolt is probably going to be the new best defensive team in PvP.

Gambit/Thanos still compliment each other wonderfully too so I don't see that duo dying off...particularly when the featured character has a lower health pool.

If nothing else, a gambit nerf opens up your offensive options when it comes to grinding out wins.  So even if the game becomes all Thor and friends....MPQ will be far better off.

Qubort

GrimSkald said:

Gambit is roughly 20%-50% better than any other character.  He really is.  Sure, you can beat him with a good team more than 50% of the time, but Gambit wins against a non-Gambit team, what, 99% of the time?  Maybe 99.5%?  I've been playing Gambit since November of last year - I wipe to Gambit teams probably about 5-10% of the time - rarely, but it does happen.  I think I've wiped to a non Gambit team once or twice in that same time period - out of literally hundreds if not thousands of matches.

The nerf is coming, he's gross.  No character released since comes even close to his power level.  Frankly, it's long over due.  At this point it's only a question of when and how much. 

If you were thinking of entering the 5* tier, I'd wait until it's done.  If you don't have Gambit, you will be meat for the Gambit teams.  If you do have Gambit (and don't have two other top tier 5*s,) if he gets nerfed badly you'll be in bad shape afterward.

I like you completely ignore half of the game. Gambit is slow on PVE compared to other 5s. He is tops for PVP but not by that much. Someone using a half health Thor can drop him before he gets off a single power.

BlackWidower

I don't have Gambit fully covered and will be really disappointed  if they nerf him.  It's honestly the only reason I can think of that I am still playing.

I believe, like some others, that they should start making other 5's actually good and not completely laughable, like Steve FA, Bruce Banner, Phoenix, Spiderblack, Doc Ock, Widow, Archangel, they could all use buffs to bring them up to competitive 5* levels.  It seems like a better option than dragging a 5*s down to a buffed 4* level.

What is the point in striving to get a 5* if they are inevitably going to weaken them? They are starting to improve a bit with JJ and Oyoke and Thor before that.

At the same time, though, if they nerf Gambit, I will lose a lot of interest in the game (as I won't have anything to strive for). 
On the positive side, I will suddenly have a lot more time and money.  So, I dunno.  In a way, I don't really care... but I do.

Qubort

babinro said:

Jabrony_Geoff said:

If they nerf Gambit in a bad way you will see mass game uninstalls like never before.
#justsaying.

We've had several meta defining characters nerfed over the years. 

They know exactly what to expect by now.

We have no reason to believe the mass uninstalls will be any worse than those that happened with Rags, Spidey, Mags, Sentry XF, Thor, OML's and now Gambits.

They stated previously that Gambit was the most requested character and there is already hordes of people leaving the game each season for a variety of reasons. It won't be the death of the game, but there is reason to believe that an over nerf could drive more away than previous nerfs.

wymtime

I have been on the nerf Gambit train for a while and I have had him championed 6 weeks after he was released in packs.  To me the biggest reason is Gambit is suppressing he Meta for too long.  Okoye is strong and good, Jessica Jones is really good, there are a lot of really good 5* in the game right now, but they don’t see much time in PVP because of the meta.  By merging Gambit the devs will change the meta, and the players will then decide what the new meta will be.  You might say they can do this with a buff to lesser 5*, but the problem is by buffing a new 5* you would just give Gambit another character to pair with.  His issue is AP destructiom and AP generation as Passive powers and that makes him like the Hood Meta.  The difference with the hood Meta and the Gambit meta is Gambit is not at low level health where you can match embed kill him quickly.  Hood was nerfed by giving all the other 3* characters significantly more health and Hood, Loki, patch, Daken were left as low health characters.  5* already have huge health pools and giving them more will not solve the issue.  The easiest solution is to nerf Gambits black and see where the Meta goes.  Changing the meta is good for the game, next time hopefully it will be because of a buff or a strong new character, but right now the best option is a nerf.

huktonfonix

There are plenty of ways to kill Gambit, but I challenge anyone to name a team that can reliably and sustainably climb in PVP against similarly leveled Gambit teams that doesn't include either your own Gambit or Thor.

They've created an impossible barrier for entry to 5* PvP right now, as those characters are absolutely critical and are completely unrealistic to cover via classic token pulls.  I'm glad to be past that point myself, but I don't see any reason a 4* player without a well-covered Gambit and/or Thor would continue to try to advance their roster right now.  Without those players the game will die, so something has to give.

GrimSkald

Qubort said:

GrimSkald said:

Gambit is roughly 20%-50% better than any other character.  He really is.  Sure, you can beat him with a good team more than 50% of the time, but Gambit wins against a non-Gambit team, what, 99% of the time?  Maybe 99.5%?  I've been playing Gambit since November of last year - I wipe to Gambit teams probably about 5-10% of the time - rarely, but it does happen.  I think I've wiped to a non Gambit team once or twice in that same time period - out of literally hundreds if not thousands of matches.

The nerf is coming, he's gross.  No character released since comes even close to his power level.  Frankly, it's long over due.  At this point it's only a question of when and how much. 

If you were thinking of entering the 5* tier, I'd wait until it's done.  If you don't have Gambit, you will be meat for the Gambit teams.  If you do have Gambit (and don't have two other top tier 5*s,) if he gets nerfed badly you'll be in bad shape afterward.

I like you completely ignore half of the game. Gambit is slow on PVE compared to other 5s. He is tops for PVP but not by that much. Someone using a half health Thor can drop him before he gets off a single power.

You know, that's fair, I was primarily focusing on PVP, but to be honest, other than the 5* node PVE is just plain not a serious challenge to a 5* player.  Gambit is quite literally a little too much horsepower for PVE - you don't need your attacks to be that big so you'd rather have someone super fast like half-health Thor, Dr. Strange, and Thanos.  Gambit is on the slow side for PVE, so if you're concerned with speed, he's often not your best choice.

I will say this - when I have actual trouble with the 5* node, I hit it with GamThor.  Particularly if CoulHawk is a bad option for whatever reason (I'm looking at you, 1st Sub of DPvsMPQ.)

Regarding the second thing you said - someone with a half-heatlh Thor and... say, a half-health Daredevil will probably kill Gambit before he gets off a single power... probably between 20 and 40% of the time.  Less than half the time, certainly.  Your win/loss % will be okay, though I suspect worse than pretty much any other team.  Now flip the teams - play Gambit/whomever against Thor/DD.  I bet the Gambit team will win a much higher % of the time even counting the offensive advantage of starting Thor and DD at half-health.  Gambit is significantly more powerful than any other character.

Jaedenkaal

Of course, we do also have to face 5* gambit in PVE Simulator, as we're all about to be reminded. Those are NOT my favourite nodes. And they aren't skippable. I guess the only consolation there is that he;s not automatically level 550?

WEBGAS

Supposed that you all "asking for Gambit nerf" will be pleased and the nerf will go live : what's the next?
Will be there a massive request for a GThor Nerf?
And Then?
Okoye ?  JJ ?  DD?

Why, for Heaven's sake, players have to ask for a nerf?
Couldn't it be way better to ask for a buff to other unplayable characters like Banner or  Ock  for example?

Why don't ask for a good counter?

My Gambit is only champed since a couple of months and I admit to using him a lot but is this a reason to break him with a nerf?
Just like they did with OML, Thoress, Sentry, Spidey, XFW and so on?

No Nerfs please, but only Buffs

Treras

Gambit will be over nerfed sooner or later.  Soon enough there will be another char worthy of hoarde busting and digital day extravaganza. 

JHawkInc

WEBGAS said:

Supposed that you all "asking for Gambit nerf" will be pleased and the nerf will go live : what's the next?
Will be there a massive request for a GThor Nerf?
And Then?
Okoye ?  JJ ?  DD?

Why, for Heaven's sake, players have to ask for a nerf?
Couldn't it be way better to ask for a buff to other unplayable characters like Banner or  Ock  for example?

Why don't ask for a good counter?

My Gambit is only champed since a couple of months and I admit to using him a lot but is this a reason to break him with a nerf?
Just like they did with OML, Thoress, Sentry, Spidey, XFW and so on?

No Nerfs please, but only Buffs

Look man, when you've got a field of grass, and one blade is sticking out too far, and you want them to be even, you don't invest energy in trying to grow the entire rest of the field except for that one blade to make them even. You get out your little pair of scissors and do some trimming.

I agree that buffs are better than nerfs, but I'd rather it not take two years to buff every character to Gambit's level.

Further, Gambit is really good. If you buff everyone to his level, we'll eventually reach a point where people stop playing the game, because using Gambit and two other 5*s will be so easy it won't constitute enough activity to consider it "playing" the game. There's actually a benefit to nerfing him in that it leaves room between the max character ability and the max difficulty for actual gameplay in the middle. Make characters too good, squeeze out the gameplay, you might as well spend money on Marvel action figures.

Magic

Buffs will not happen - they don't generate money with the dilution of the Classic tokens. So the nerf is a quick and easy solution for devs. Creating a counter just would generate money but would just put another over-powered character in the game to have the same "NERF" outcries in a few months. 

What they could do is change the MMR and make sure that if you don't use Gambit you seem him less in the queues. Is it possible? How would I know.

DeNappa

WEBGAS said:

Why, for Heaven's sake, players have to ask for a nerf?
Couldn't it be way better to ask for a buff to other unplayable characters like Banner or  Ock  for example?

Why don't ask for a good counter?

I can only speak for myself, but I'd like to see him 'nerfed' because the current Gambit uses a fundamentally broken game mechanic (passive unconditional AP generation). I'd probably even call it 'fixed' (unless they overdo it like they completely nuked 3* Gambit into trash tier)

Full disclosure, I'm not really affected by it myself, I'm a 4* player that focuses mainly on PVE and my Gambit is sitting at 4/2/2.

DyingLegend

Gambit may seem like he needs a nerf, but i don't think that is the case. Nerfs are never truly good, i think the game would benefit from increasing the power of under preforming 5 stars then knocking down one. Much like what happened with OML, it's not easy to build up a 5 star and when you nerf its usefulness, it leaves you with a ton of time and effort wasted.

I think some characters could be buffed to counter Gambit. Take Archangel for instance, how about he has a passive that when the enemy fires and ability, dodge the damage and send the character who cast the ability airborne for x amount of turns. Or just give AA the ability to send people airborne either passively or activated.

Maybe introduce a character that stuns the enemy when they cast a power.

I don't like Nerfs, i prefer buffs. Buffs add more variety, nerfs knock off one character only for another to takes it  place as OP, then you call for that one to gets nerfed and the cycle of nerfs continue. 

WEBGAS

DyingLegend said:

Gambit may seem like he needs a nerf, but i don't think that is the case. Nerfs are never truly good, i think the game would benefit from increasing the power of under preforming 5 stars then knocking down one. Much like what happened with OML, it's not easy to build up a 5 star and when you nerf its usefulness, it leaves you with a ton of time and effort wasted.


I don't like Nerfs, i prefer buffs. Buffs add more variety, nerfs knock off one character only for another to takes it  place as OP, then you call for that one to gets nerfed and the cycle of nerfs continue. 

Exactly what I'm saying. Nerfs are like a kick in the @ss for those who have spent time, efforts and money over this game.

If a nerf ever happens, I will keep my vallet sealed and never give a single cent anymore. I'll be a pure F2P , I'll take what I could get
and when the servers will be shutted down, BYE BYE and no regrets   
p.s. : this is not a treat, but a promise.