Latest Legends 5-Star Cover Exchanges *Updated (6/15/18)

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  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    pheregas said:


    TLDR: A 5:1 exchange rate is way too high.  At max it should be 2:1 because even at pulling one LT a day, you'll rarely ever champ a 5* ever again at 5:1.  Even a long time vet with a full roster won't be able to champ any more 5s without extreme RNG luck.
    A long time vet with a full roster is making WAY more than 1 LT pull per day, though - more like 4-5.
  • pheregas
    pheregas Posts: 1,721 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Bowgentle said:
    pheregas said:


    TLDR: A 5:1 exchange rate is way too high.  At max it should be 2:1 because even at pulling one LT a day, you'll rarely ever champ a 5* ever again at 5:1.  Even a long time vet with a full roster won't be able to champ any more 5s without extreme RNG luck.
    A long time vet with a full roster is making WAY more than 1 LT pull per day, though - more like 4-5.
    Maybe I should have said "This" long time vet.  My pulls come in fits and spurts.  I pulled nothing today, for instance, and won't again until a real PVE shows up or until I seriously start PVP.  I'll often pull 3-5 in a single day, then nothing for days after.
  • Huntah86
    Huntah86 Posts: 221 Tile Toppler
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    bluewolf said:
    This isn't meant to be conspiratorial but just an honest question.  Would the average player feel better if they knew swaps exist for super whales but not anyone else?  Like, imagine you have a 0/5/1 Okoye and pull 6 Yellows after that.  Does it make you feel better or worse to know that some guy who spends a ton can just swap his covers?  Maybe you're OK with it, others would be mad.

    I wouldn't be surprised if 550 dudes can still get swaps.  It makes good business sense.

    I'm probably in the minority here but for me personally, I'd be perfectly fine with this.  I feel like if you're spending a lot of money then getting a few perks with that only makes business sense. 
  • randomhero1090
    randomhero1090 Posts: 396 Mover and Shaker
    edited June 2018
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    I'll just chime in with my agreement that a better ratio should exist for 4* & 5* covers.  I think the hit rate and bonus rate are high enough on 3* to allow the bank to be a simple bank as someone waits for the needed 13th cover.

    I think 3:1 for 4* and 2:1 for 5* sounds right to me.  And it sure sounds like the player base agrees too.

    However...  I absolutely love this idea/concept.  Was thinking about this exact same thing just the other day.  So big kudos!


  • thedarkphoenix
    thedarkphoenix Posts: 557 Critical Contributor
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    PenniesForEveryone said:
    pheregas said:
    If I can summarize, I think many people would be on-board with this if it weren't for the 5:1 ratio.  Especially in the 5* tier.

    Let me give some real personal numbers.  For background, I'm day 1563.  I basically operate F2P anymore, though I have taken advantage of some of the clearance level bundles.  I have every single 3* champed (and only 4 away from all max champed.)  I have all but Black Widow, CW: Spidey, and Wiccan champed in the 4* tier.  I have all but 8 of the 5*s champed (3 of which are currently in latest).  So between placement, progression, and champ rewards, I earn about 1 Latest LT a day.  I very rarely hoard (only ever did it twice, and never more than two weeks).  I've only ever had four 5* Bonus Heroes so using that for this system is not really a viable option.  (I know this isn't the same for all players, and that I may be an outlier, but keep reading because if things aren't going to work out for me, who are they going to work out for?)

    Given all this, let me tell you how my non-feeder 5s are setup.

    In no particular order:

    Ghost Rider lvl 451            - two swaps from CS
    Archangel lvl 456               - two swaps
    Gambit lvl 456                    - two swaps
    PP Spidey (prefeeder) 453 - two swaps
    Star Lord (prefeeder) 453 - two swaps
    Thor lvl 454                        - two swaps
    Doc Oc (prefeeder) 450     - one swap


    That's 7 characters with a total 10 swaps that Customer Service had to deal with.  I can see why they wouldn't want to be burdened with so much.

    But lets look closer...  I never cash in classic tokens.  Which means that of the above, in the timeframe for which they were available in latest tokens, I was able to successfully get more than 5 covers exactly twice.

    Had the 5:1 ratio existed back then, I would not have been able to champ any of those characters.  For each duplicate cover pull, you now need 5 pulls to offset it.  I would have had to pull 4 more covers of either Archangel or Gambit to even champ them.

    My highest 5* (Thanos) is 462 and OML (460).  Those were the days before massive 5* dilution and both now have feeders.  

    TLDR: A 5:1 exchange rate is way too high.  At max it should be 2:1 because even at pulling one LT a day, you'll rarely ever champ a 5* ever again at 5:1.  Even a long time vet with a full roster won't be able to champ any more 5s without extreme RNG luck.


    Time out, let's look at this a little closer......

    AA, Gambit, Spidey, SL, and Thor all got 2 swaps, but are also all at 454 or higher, or now have a feeder.  So if you hadn't been able to get those swaps, and had to bank them......you still would have likely pulled the covers you needed, champed, and be at the same 454+ that you are at today.  Only Ock and GR would still be unchamped - both finished with a feeder eventually.

    Stop thinking of 5:1 being the replacement exchange rate for the old 1:1 swaps - you likely won't ever use that.  Instead it's just going to take you a little longer to champ the Latest 5*s.

    To be clear - for Latest tokens this is absolutely unquestionably worse than the previous swap system......but it's not 5:1 worse for the vast majority of us that haven't been completely obliterated by RNG.  And for the 150 other characters that aren't the 3 latest ones this new system is infinitely better than what we had before.  I think I'm OK having the 3 latest characters take a little longer to champ if it means a benefit to the 150 other characters on my roster......
    Probably, but with the character at a lower level. I had the same thing happen where I would of had 2 or so cover "expire right around the time I pulled more covers to either cover it or I was able to champ the 5 in question and the cover i pulled afterwards would have been covers that would have been unusable without a swap.



  • killerkoala
    killerkoala Posts: 1,185 Chairperson of the Boards
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    instead of programing "saved covers", why not code colorless covers.  it would alleviate cover exchanges and i think would made the whole community a lot happier. then it would be a race to to earn iso or in ur best situation, people would buy iso.

  • jtmagee
    jtmagee Posts: 158 Tile Toppler
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    What a kick in the pecker.
  • Daredevil217
    Daredevil217 Posts: 3,916 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I don’t think the 2:1 option is as great as people think. Making the bank even bigger (7:1? 10:1?) would allow us to store more covers and apply them as champ levels later. Of course there’s the risk of wasting those 9 other covers to get the 1, but I feel it would be SUPER rare that that happens and more often than not you’d be saving covers. I think 2:1 swaps would happen more frequently and you’d lose more covers in the long run. Is this wrong?  Math nerds? Help me out!
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited June 2018
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    Assuming that 5:1 has been turned into 1:1 or 2:1, this will lead to complaints about lack of iso-8 to champed characters in time, thus covers getting wasted, which render Saved Covers useless to that group of players. Ultimately, it will be back to colourless cover or unusable covers with no expiry date plus at least 50-100% increase in Iso-8 earnings per day.

    End of the day, it's all about:

    1) more Iso-8 and
    2) covers that don't expire or colourless covers that don't expire

    That will make the players happy and not spend a single penny anymore.
  • Player1575
    Player1575 Posts: 253 Mover and Shaker
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    I feel like the only thing more controversial than losing 1:1 LL swaps would be if they finally nerfed gambit, so I'm assuming that's the next step for the devs at this point.
  • Spudgutter
    Spudgutter Posts: 743 Critical Contributor
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    Player1575 said:
    I feel like the only thing more controversial than losing 1:1 LL swaps would be if they finally nerfed gambit, so I'm assuming that's the next step for the devs at this point.
    i don't, a lot of people have been asking for him to be nerfed.  even those of us that have him and use him
  • Toweliesox
    Toweliesox Posts: 7 Just Dropped In
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    broll said:
    Toweliesox said:
    I never ever post complaints about this game but here we go. 

    1. 5 covers for 1!!!!!! You have literally now just forced people to mass pull before the deadline, and then forced everyone to hoard until they have 0 over the latest 5*'s or have champs they dont mind increasing. 

    2. Why don't you just do colourless for latest?! Then you keep everyone happy, and make it so nobody is contacting CS! 

    I do not understand why you guys do this......it's so god damn frustrating. 


    1.  They did nothing of the sort.  I and many many other won't be mass pulling from Latest before the deadline.  In fact I'm actually thrilled to do a mass pull from Classics as soon as the new system comes into play.  The mindset of focusing on Latest is instilled into people, but there's no requirement to stick to it.  I suspect there will be a lot of people that will focus more heavily on Classics vs Latest and feel less need to hoard than ever before.  I sure do.

    2.  Anyone who thought colorless covers was ever going to happen was dilution.  Everyone would have been happy for a month until they either undid the system or closed down the game because they could no longer actually make money.  Cover stress forcing sales is a larger driver of how the game stays in business.  The fact that this is only 5:1, you get the extra champ levels if you don't trade them, and that there's no HP, ISO, or CP cost to us it is WAAAYY more generous than I expected.

    You understand because you're not seeing it from both sides.  

    1. You mean the guy who already has a fully cover bearded cap, JJ, won't be pulling before the deadline? Im shocked.....(no I'm not). You have no need to mass pull as you won't be needing cover swaps. However you will eventually therefor you will need to hoard otherwise wasted covers will come. There is no requirement other than the amount of 5*'s in the classics is far too much compared to latest. It would take so much luck, and so much pulling to get a fully covered from 0 classic. So lets not act like this is a real option. It is for someone like you who's got 2/3 latest fully covered. 

    2. I never once said it was going to happen. However it's a lot better option than a 5 to 1 swap. You saying "This is more generous" going from 1 to 1 to 5 to 1 is funny. Setting the expectations is the problem. 2 years of 1 for 1 then changing 5 to 1 is insane. If you don't think so then you would be the one who's delisional. 

    I do see it from both sides. I've played the game for 3 years now almost 4. This is by far the worst thing they have done to the players. 
  • PorkBelly
    PorkBelly Posts: 526 Critical Contributor
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    It's already been said but it bears repeating that 5:1 for the 5* tier is absurd.
  • captainheath
    captainheath Posts: 240 Tile Toppler
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    While I'm not a 5-star tier player yet, I do wonder if there is something else coming down the pipe.  Perhaps mass 4 to 5 rewards?  

    Even so, I think this is a perfect thing to include for VIP.  VIP should get reduced ratios.
  • pheregas
    pheregas Posts: 1,721 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Brigby said:
    Update: For players that have a Latest Legends 5-Star character maxed out at level 550, we will still be offering cover exchanges from the maxed out Latest Legends character to another Latest Legends character. The same is true for if players have all 3 of their Latest Legends 5-Star characters maxed out, and wish to exchange their extra Latest Legend covers for any other character cover of their choice.

    In addition, we would like to offer all players a one-time exception service of breaking down duplicate 5-Star characters into their respective covers. This is not limited to a single character, however you must request all of your character breakdowns at the same time. This offer will have the same deadline as the Latest Legends Cover Exchange (June 27th at 11:59pm PDT)
    Just 5s or 4s as well?

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