MCU: Avengers | Infinity War ***SPOILERS***

GiantDuck

I don't really get this 'we know the dusted characters are coming back so I don't care' attitude.
When you're watching the vast majority of movies and TV shows, you know the hero is going to be ok and win at the end.

When you watch a Bond movie, are you thinking 'this fight is pointless, I know Bond can't actually die'? No, you enjoy the spectacle and seeing how he will ultimately win.

HoundofShadow

IW just beat the record for the biggest opening: 630million USD. 

Would there be any surprise for us?

Dragon_Nexus

GiantDuck said:

I don't really get this 'we know the dusted characters are coming back so I don't care' attitude.
When you're watching the vast majority of movies and TV shows, you know the hero is going to be ok and win at the end.

When you watch a Bond movie, are you thinking 'this fight is pointless, I know Bond can't actually die'? No, you enjoy the spectacle and seeing how he will ultimately win.

It can be immersion breaking when you know a character has plot armour.
It's what's taken me out of later GoT seasons when suddenly important characters feel too invincibe because they're liked by fans or they're important to the later plot, so they survive damn near everything because they need to be in the finale.

It sucks all the tension and drama out of a situation.

However...the idea of "They're all coming back, so why care?" misses the point. The point of all that was that the combined efforts of Iron Man, Doctor Strange, Captain America, Vision, Scarlet Witch AND SO ON...ALL of them...couldn't beat Thanos.

So how the hell are they going to beat him with even fewer heroes? THAT'S where the drama is that I think people are ignoring or just missing.

DarthDeVo

I thought for sure that this movie was going to be the end of the line for Cap. Now my hunch is that in the next movie, some sort of sacrifice will be required in order to restore things, and Cap will be the one to willingly pay the price, though that will somewhat undermine the debate he had with Vision on the subject. 

I wouldn't be so quick to assume Korg, Miek, and Valkyrie were just killed off screen without so much as even a line of dialogue acknowledging their deaths. It is a little annoying their absence just plain wasn't addressed one way our another, though. 

Having said that, I still liked the movie, and was surprised by who turned to ash by the time the credits rolled. I'm also one of those people not terribly worried about it though, since sequels have been announced already for many of those characters, but @Dragon_Nexus had a good point that what will be interesting to see is HOW they win with even fewer heroes in the fight. 

And I really appreciated how they handled Thanos as a villain and his motivations. He was truly convinced what he was doing was not just right but necessary, even when he did things he didn't want to, like sacrifice Gamora. He didn't want the power for the sake of the power alone, didn't want it for accolades and adoration or even to be feared. He was convinced it was the only way to save the universe from itself. 

broll

LeaveMyCookies said:

scottee said:

Also, my guess for the next year is:

The Antman movie doesn't interact with IW events much, maybe taking place beforehand?

I had an idea on this, what if characters disappear at the end of the Antman-Wasp movie? I mean they get the job done and then people start being erased, coinciding with the end of IW. I think that would be neat

I fully expect that to be one of the post credits scenes.

One thing I keep thinking in regards to the "we know they're coming back, they have a sequel".  They made it abundantly clear this takes place 2 years after Civil war.  I can't remember them ever being more clear about a time line in a Marvel movie.  We also know the Marvel movies aren't released in sequential order, heck Captain Marvel is gonna take place ~30 years ago (wow is the 90s that long ago, I feel old...).  It's technically possible that the next 2 Spider-man movies and the GotG 3 happen in the 2 years between.  

That being said we know they're really coming back, but it's technically possible that they don't.  As far as a I know the 3 above the only ones to have confirmed movies in the works.  It's also been said that GotG 3 will be the last with the current crew and the Sony deal is limited.  Just saying...

Crnch73

My question is: how will they possibly resurrect the fallen characters? Some of them seemed too popular to stay dead, especially panther and possibly strange. We all thought cap was a goner but now his two “replacements” are gone. We all knew some had to die, both for dramatic effect and movie progression (i.e. guardians were done), and for actors to move on IRL. But others were surprising. 

Could Adam Warlock possibly use the soul gem to access the pocket dimension? Can he even resurrect people from there? Will thanos, in an attempt to recover from his “fatal” wound, reverse time to save himself, thus undoing the “snap” of the Fingers? Or will they all basically stay dead? That’s what I need to know next. 

crackninja

Seems like I'm standing alone on this one...usually I leave the theater and can't wait to see the movies again, but this one I left feeling very much the opposite.  Just felt very Logan-esque for me...I do not read the comics, and I go to the movies for an escape/fun.  There were good moments throughout the movie, but the overall result for me was just not something I would want to see again, much like watching Professor X stumble around like an elderly grandparent that you grew up respecting so much.  I wasn't naive to what was coming, but actually seeing it play out and the heroes repeatedly fail either by lack of skill and in some cases idiocy, I'll pass.
For the record, I promise it doesn't have to be puppies and rainbows for me to enjoy a movie.
On the bright side, I'm glad everyone else enjoyed it, and of course I'll be there to see what happens next.

Ragnoluce

Here's a few hot takes:

-Having the dust clear on just the cast of Avengers 1 (minus Clint) was more of a contrived moment to me than the temporary nature of the deaths.

-I was very impressed with the tweaks they made to Thanos. In the comics, his first few appearances were as your classic vain & evil genius trying to get a date, whose vanity was typically his downfall. This guy...he's bordering on sympathetic, which is jarring. The way he kept trying to comfort various heroes as he dismantled them was the best writing in the film. I am hoping that the young Gamora character becomes sort of the Mistress Death analogue, with him seeking her validation and never getting it.

-For a movie that was this much of a downer, they did have a tremendous amount of fun with the jokes and banter. Mantis saying "We kick names...and take tinykitty" might be my favorite. That or Tony trying to give Spiderman a sitrep at the beginning "They're aliens... and they're here to steal a wizards gem? I guess?"

-They totally tricked us on the Hulk's arc in this movie, they had that one scene of him running towards the screen in all the trailers when that never happened at all!

scottee

crackninja said:

Seems like I'm standing alone on this one...usually I leave the theater and can't wait to see the movies again, but this one I left feeling very much the opposite.  Just felt very Logan-esque for me...I do not read the comics, and I go to the movies for an escape/fun.  There were good moments throughout the movie, but the overall result for me was just not something I would want to see again, much like watching Professor X stumble around like an elderly grandparent that you grew up respecting so much.  I wasn't naive to what was coming, but actually seeing it play out and the heroes repeatedly fail either by lack of skill and in some cases idiocy, I'll pass.
For the record, I promise it doesn't have to be puppies and rainbows for me to enjoy a movie.
On the bright side, I'm glad everyone else enjoyed it, and of course I'll be there to see what happens next.

Yeah, I thought similarly at the end, where I was wondering how many people would see it multiple times, which is what it takes to break records.

I'd probably see it once more just for the action and tidbits, but there's no way my wife would watch it again.

Lots of people would watch Black Panther over and over because of what it represented. I know someone who's not into the MCU who watched BP four times. I think the only people who watch Infinity War multiple times are the committed Marvel fans.

Daredevil217

TPF Alexis said:

Also, Thanos doesn't understand how population growth works. Assuming an average population growth rate of 1% across the universe, he's going to have to do this again every 70 years or so.

As much of an inconvenience as snapping his fingers once every 70 years may be, I think he’s up to the task. 

kk3thess said:

I watched on the midnight premiere here in Brazil. The audience gasped only once and that was when Tony faced Thanos and almost died. It's probably just me, but I think that the entire movie should've engage the crowd like that, not just a scene.

If your theater only reacted to that one scene then that’s on those bunch of heartless robots!  The snap, Quill shooting Gamora, Thor coming to kick butt, Red Skull reveal, Spidey death, how the movie just ends, Loki’s death to kick it all off, there were so many “moments” to react to. Not to mention the smaller more nuanced things like Tony’s hesitation to contact Rogers or Thor breaking down with Rocket. So so good. 

GiantDuck said:

I don't really get this 'we know the dusted characters are coming back so I don't care' attitude.
When you're watching the vast majority of movies and TV shows, you know the hero is going to be ok and win at the end.

When you watch a Bond movie, are you thinking 'this fight is pointless, I know Bond can't actually die'? No, you enjoy the spectacle and seeing how he will ultimately win.

Fully agree. Plus I’m glad they didn’t let the release schedule deter from the story they want to tell. That to me is great writing and even better acting to make (well some of) us care even if we know they’re coming back. I still very much was entranced the whole time. Reminds me of smarky pro wrestling fans who can’t enjoy the product because they read the spoilers, dirt sheets, etc. then whine about it being too predictable (or “making no sense” when they do get swerved) all the while missing the story that the performers are trying to tell. 

Doc L

A few thoughts, some in-line with what others have already said:

- unamused by the lack of Valkyrie, Korg and Miek, though I actually imagine they survived somehow (convenience!) due to their popularity

- the heroes were incredibly stupid often, but I guess they had to be to make it a story

- Ant-man and Wasp is certainly in the time between Civil War and Infinity War, and I agree with Broll, they'll be in the post credits scene. Indeed, Sebastian Stan mentioned he'd filmed with Michael Douglas and Michelle Pfeiffer, so I imagine that was for the final Avengers film.

- I expect Hawkeye to have survived and Ronin it up in the next film too.

- I predict Captain Marvel to end (post credits) with her being recalled to Earth in someway.

- I'd like to see Nova now as a hero; maybe start the next film with the end of Xandar?

- I want a montage in the next film where the original Avengers get ready to fight with their theme playing.

- And most likely, half will die off completely there. 

- And Nebula will be put in the state of life/death from the comic, and probably be the one to (initially) steal the gauntlet (before she fails to control it)

Now for some more random (as if that wasn't already) thoughts:

- Surely Starlord is half-celestial, and so one of a kind? Population control seems kind of ridiculous for him.

- Same for Drax and Gamora.

- And what about all the Asgrdians? Is Thor like the only one left?

- How will Stark get back to Earth in the next film?

- Where is CRAGLIN?? (seriously, we need the Ravagers)

- Why does Thor now have the power of the bifrost because he has a magical axe/hammer/tool?

- And seriously, have they not made Thanos now the meta/OP? I don't quite see how they can weave in him not using the gauntlet to fight the Avengers in the last film, when he can kill them with a wave of a hand? I get the gist of what will happen to reverse the story, but I can't see how, without Mephisto or Lady Death, something similar could happen. Will they show the Watchers (as seen in GotG Vol 2)? Or Eternity? I don't know, I'm just worried they're building to something that will be semi-ridiculous. Maybe Gamora's soul will appear to him, as a substitute for Mephisto? I had hoped the Defenders TV series would introduce him, as a demon at the head of the Hand. 

Right, that's pretty all over the place thoughts. Not saying the film isn't well done, and isn't surprisingly controlled for all the things going on, but man. So many thoughts.

Scofie

Everyone is hating on Star Lord for blaster whipping Thanos but why didn't Strange use his portal to cut his hand off? Or form a sword to cut it off? He had loads of time before Quill lost it.

TPF Alexis

Daredevil217 said:

TPF Alexis said:

Also, Thanos doesn't understand how population growth works. Assuming an average population growth rate of 1% across the universe, he's going to have to do this again every 70 years or so.

As much of an inconvenience as snapping his fingers once every 70 years may be, I think he’s up to the task. 

It was more the fact that there was never any indication that this wasn't a permanent solution. Also, for all Thanos's claimed brilliance and logic, he seems to be ignoring a whole lot of other possible solutions that might be doable with the power of the Infinity Gauntlet.

Bryan Lambert

TPF Alexis said:

Daredevil217 said:

TPF Alexis said:

Also, Thanos doesn't understand how population growth works. Assuming an average population growth rate of 1% across the universe, he's going to have to do this again every 70 years or so.

As much of an inconvenience as snapping his fingers once every 70 years may be, I think he’s up to the task. 

It was more the fact that there was never any indication that this wasn't a permanent solution. Also, for all Thanos's claimed brilliance and logic, he seems to be ignoring a whole lot of other possible solutions that might be doable with the power of the Infinity Gauntlet.

Well, he’s not called the Really Thought All Of This Through To Its Logical Conclusion Titan.

TPF Alexis

He does explicitly claim his plan to be the only logical solution. At the very least, it seems like someone else might have brought it up. Y'know, just to try defeating his plan with discussion instead of punching.

Eddiemon

Doc L said:

A few thoughts, some in-line with what others have already said:

- unamused by the lack of Valkyrie, Korg and Miek, though I actually imagine they survived somehow (convenience!) due to their popularity

- And what about all the Asgrdians? Is Thor like the only one left?

- How will Stark get back to Earth in the next film?

- Why does Thor now have the power of the bifrost because he has a magical axe/hammer/tool?

- And seriously, have they not made Thanos now the meta/OP? I don't quite see how they can weave in him not using the gauntlet to fight the Avengers in the last film, when he can kill them with a wave of a hand? I get the gist of what will happen to reverse the story, but I can't see how, without Mephisto or Lady Death, something similar could happen. Will they show the Watchers (as seen in GotG Vol 2)? Or Eternity? I don't know, I'm just worried they're building to something that will be semi-ridiculous. Maybe Gamora's soul will appear to him, as a substitute for Mephisto? I had hoped the Defenders TV series would introduce him, as a demon at the head of the Hand. 

Right, that's pretty all over the place thoughts. Not saying the film isn't well done, and isn't surprisingly controlled for all the things going on, but man. So many thoughts.

Thanos only kills half. I think it is even mentioned somewhere possibly by Thor that half were killed. Dunno where Thanos shoved the survivors. So you can have the gladiators and valkyrie in that half.

If you remember, Stark and Co were ambushed by Starlord and co. So the Milano is on Titan.

Because the dwarf said Stormbringer would have the power to summon bifrost, similar to Heimdalls sword.

Thanos isn’t OP because he chooses not to be. He doesn’t crush, murder and maim his opponents. He does just enough to win. Combine that with the fact that you need to actively usecthe gauntlet and it gives the heroes a chance. Because he doesn’t pre-emptively vaporise his opponents.

Eddiemon

Crnch73 said:

My question is: how will they possibly resurrect the fallen characters? Some of them seemed too popular to stay dead, especially panther and possibly strange. We all thought cap was a goner but now his two “replacements” are gone. We all knew some had to die, both for dramatic effect and movie progression (i.e. guardians were done), and for actors to move on IRL. But others were surprising. 

Could Adam Warlock possibly use the soul gem to access the pocket dimension? Can he even resurrect people from there? Will thanos, in an attempt to recover from his “fatal” wound, reverse time to save himself, thus undoing the “snap” of the Fingers? Or will they all basically stay dead? That’s what I need to know next. 

The fallen characters didn’t die per se. They ceased to exist, which is a form of death without the actual dying bit. Which means the gauntlet should be able to make them exist again without having to rewind time past a death moment.

Thanos doesn’t have to rewind time, with all 5 gems he can permanently alter reality with the reality gem. So he just changes reality so he isn’t wounded.

Eddiemon

aesthetocyst said:

The only criticism I had was the flagrant abuse of the Sophie's Choice* trope. 

I lost count of how many times characters were forked into a choice of resisting the progress of Thanos' plan and harm to someone they cared about.

• Thanos threatened Loki with harm to Thor.
• Witch refused to risk harming Vision by destroying his stone.
• Thanos threatened Gamora with harm to Nebula.
• Thanos used Gamora against Starlord.
• Gamora forked Starlord into promising to kill her.
• Strange 'bought' Stark's life by giving Thanos a stone.

* Probably not the right term for the trope of a villain using someone's personal sentiments against them, demanding that that someone facilitate a much greater harm in order to 'prevent' that villain from inflicting a personal harm against them, e.g., "Hand over the X or your wife gets it!"

I think that’s kind of the point with Thanos as a ‘villain’. He didn’t care about hurting people, or beating people. He just did exactly what he needed and the minimum he needed to achieve his objectives. Like you expect a bad guy to get what he wants and then say ‘kill them anyway’. And yet he honoured every commitment.

The funny thing though is you left out the culmination of the theme, in that the soul stone put Thanos in exactly the same bind and he chose opposite.

I wonder if, with the Mind stone having been Vision and the soul stone’s catch 22, if the stones are going to turn on Thanos.

Non sequiter: I was rewatching Avengers at the gym, and I realised that when Thanos sent Loki to fetch the Tessaract for its stone, Loki was carrying the mind stone in his sceptre the whole time. Why didn’t Thanos help himself way back then?

Eddiemon

Scofie said:

Everyone is hating on Star Lord for blaster whipping Thanos but why didn't Strange use his portal to cut his hand off? Or form a sword to cut it off? He had loads of time before Quill lost it.

Because Strange looked into the future and saw the one path to victory.

Even if you could remove the gauntlet from Thanos and even defeat him, the only two who could expect to wield it would be Starlord or Nebula and they would both want the time stone to go back to save Gamora. Which might be worse...

purplemur

I have been thinking about the movie pretty constantly since watching it. Everybody, I mean everybody is talking about it. Now after digesting the visual feast and perusing reviews, listening to opinions and I can say as an objective fact that Avengers | Infinity war is a good movie. Moreover: I Love It!
First I feel ya on some complaints: 
-Wakanda. The battle formations. It is hard in contrast to what we JUST SAW in the last movie to accept this as anything other than white man writing colonial Africa AGAIN! Hand to hand w/spears right after laser guns. See the movie ZULU! for reference, it sure seems like they did. Wakanda has earths equivalent of advanced alien space weapons. Straight up-the Wakandans shoulda opened a big ol can-a. The plot/pacing needed a grand battle/showdown but this one was a weak point in that it was dull in a brilliant (both definitions) setting.
-"Everyone can't be dead, I just saw a trailer". I think it's a contradiction that is intended to create continued speculation. If in a media vacuum you saw everyone die; it might make one think that; it's hard but that's that, dead is dead. Doesn't drive interest in the next movie. By the audience knowing that there is a possibility and What If? we start building hopes,  starting discussions and thus investing in the outcome and ensuring we go to Avengers 4 to see how they did it. E'rbody knew Jon Snow wasn't dead because the actor couldn't say that he was yet still doing a lot of press. They tuned in to watch the season premiere and you can believe dat ima be there May 3, 2019  April 26, 2019.
-I did not envy parents with youngish children trying to explain why Gamora wanted Starlord to kill her so badly. Death is the main theme of the movie and is tough for parents: one of the big three "Talks". This movie is for pg13 but it's too naive to believe there aren't so many kids, still wearing superhero pajamas aged, who saw this movie and were like WHAT! Is Spider-man really dead mom? 

So much to LOVE!
+I was fortunate to see this on IMAX and learned today that it was shot entirely on their cameras, They chose an odd ratio though) Whereas in Civil war only the Airport was. This movie is rich in color and depth: The skies of Titan, knowhere, T'challa entering the verdant green, to the valley where Thanos watches his sunset are so immersive.The facepaint/costumes on The Children of Thanos was believable and looked natural in the environment(except for Proximas blood; was that Gack?). The texture of the Crimson bands, Spidey swinging under the bridge,the debris of the moon Thanos pulls down and hurtles at Iron Man capture scale and dimension that gave a sense of place in the action rather than a Google earth feel.  If you can see it in an actual IMAX It is almost like being on a rollercoaster, there are times where you feel the action right in your stomach. OMG that scene with Thor!

+The acting was great. Even when the character was flat: Starlord. Chris Pratt changing his voice to mock Thor! Who I thought did great, He cried but wasn't all weepy Pierce Brosnan in 007, or the.one.slow.tear like everyone else in the movie but like a man(angel pirate) who is deeply to the core: hurting; defeated but determined and strong. I like me some Drax and Mantis deadpanning, they do "straight" so well. Downey Jr. brings it: He is so hammy as Tony Stark but really delivers grit as IM, sometimes just face and voice. him and the batch had good chemistry and made me think of how cool the Illuminati "discussion" would be.

+The pacing. This was no Bay-ham. There were times I was completely caught off guard in the action and times where I didn't quite know where to look because so much was going on but it wasn't dizzying for sake of cut scene. They didn't pause halfway for a melodramatic romantic scene before the big fight- there was that brief exposition by Gamora to Quill, otherwise it had a tight progression that didn't jump unnecessarily to be clever (M.NightShamalamadingding) or cameo needlessly(Tobias Funke or is that Dr. Manhattan?) everybody who had a role(there were some notable absentees) played a part and the plot mostly made enough sense while being presented in a way that audiences could keep up with. It totally reminded me of an old skool crossover comic book arc. And for three hours didn't feel long at all.

+The story: As a fanboi I got few complaints. They had my confidence after civil war that they can pull from all of the broad marvel universes and I appreciated some of the nods they gave and the creative license they took for Infinity. I like this Thanos as a villain 8000% more than the Lemire reboot; sometimes cinema is better than trades. I am willing to roll with whatever Adam Warlock comes out being or doing. I have no idea what the Nova? but think they'll do them justice. I have faith that Dr. Strange isn't going to pull an Egg McGuffin or ghost in the machine to wrap it all up.  Tony Stark will play some integral part: maybe create an AI Ghost of himself in case he doesn't come back? 
I  think it would be cool if banner re zaps himself and we get grey hulk who is instrumental in defeating Thanos but then transitions into WWH?    While we are talking about zapping Banner to make him stronger .......