The Simulator: April 29 - May 6

Frubzy

Got the same generic reshuffled response....



D3P Customer Support (D3Publisher)
Apr 30 20:00

Hello!

Thank you for your report about the enemies in simulator levels.
This scaling is working as intended, based upon your PvE matchmaking rating. This rating is influenced by several factors, and the level of your roster is not the only factor.
I am sorry if you feel that these fights are too difficult, but the levels and scaling are correct.
If you have any other issues or questions, please feel free to contact us again.

D3Publisher Support Team

Unknown

Frubzy wrote:

Got the same generic reshuffled response....



D3P Customer Support (D3Publisher)
Apr 30 20:00

Hello!

Thank you for your report about the enemies in simulator levels.
This scaling is working as intended, based upon your PvE matchmaking rating. This rating is influenced by several factors, and the level of your roster is not the only factor.
I am sorry if you feel that these fights are too difficult, but the levels and scaling are correct.
If you have any other issues or questions, please feel free to contact us again.

D3Publisher Support Team

That's a pretty good answer actually. At least we know the level of our rosters plays a role

Xeonic-Ice

I thought that IceIX had previously stated that roster wasn't a factor at all. But I could be wrong of course.

Unknown

Xeonic-Ice wrote:

I thought that IceIX had previously stated that roster wasn't a factor at all. But I could be wrong of course.

He did.

Unknown

MikeyMan wrote:

Xeonic-Ice wrote:

I thought that IceIX had previously stated that roster wasn't a factor at all. But I could be wrong of course.

He did.

I'm more willing to believe IceIX than a random CS with canned answers. The answers are supposed to be generic and believable. If the majority of the player base think the roster levels are to blame then they will believe you when they say it. Rosters are going to be a piece of the puzzle but if have a team of level 15's and add 100 levels to 1 character your pve levels wont automatically jump, thats been proven. You need to play matches then things start to happen.

It is far easier for levels to scale rapidly out of control if you have a high roster, that much is true.

Unknown

MikeyMan wrote:

Xeonic-Ice wrote:

I thought that IceIX had previously stated that roster wasn't a factor at all. But I could be wrong of course.

He did.

He has also said that they are continually tweaking scaling event-by-event, so what held true at the time may not be exactly accurate now.

Unknown

gobstopper wrote:

MikeyMan wrote:

Xeonic-Ice wrote:

I thought that IceIX had previously stated that roster wasn't a factor at all. But I could be wrong of course.

He did.

He has also said that they are continually tweaking scaling event-by-event, so what held true at the time may not be exactly accurate now.

Yeah, except that people with high level rosters are getting really low level opponents.

Frubzy

Has to be the spidey factor...., i only unleashed spidey at the end of the hunt when i noticed the increased difficulty. It all went downhill after that, level 300 + since then.

Unknown

So is this canned diarrhea 8 or 12hr reset this time? Want to time my join time to play as little as possible of this first node-age. Still find it odd/sad that NOT playing is such a huge pet of the meta of a game...

Edit: if nobody replies I will assume 12.

Unknown

I assume all events are 12 hour refresh, but I only play once a day so who knows. 8 hour refresh on 2.5 day subs seems excessive. On 2.5 days your going to need to grind the nodes hard to catch up even if you only join on the last refresh. I approach the simulator much more gradually.

But when was the last 8 hour refresh cycle? the Hulk?

Mawtful

Just going to chime in on the Roster weighting discussion.

Frubzy, I'd say our rosters are probably close to equivalent strength - you've got 2 L141's, but I have more 3*'s over L100.

Just checked my subs; easy nodes look to have an average level anywhere in the range 50-70, hard nodes average is in the range 70-120. So far I have only completed each node once, about 12 hours ago. Nodes were probably 20 levels lower in easy, 20-40 levels lower in hard, on average.

I only finished in the 1 Falcon cover range in the last PvE (top 50, iirc), not sure how much that would contribute to lower level enemies.

uuddlrlr

When do the subevents end?
Also, what are the subevent rewards? (some contradictory posts about it)

daveomite

Mawtful wrote:

Just going to chime in on the Roster weighting discussion.

Frubzy, I'd say our rosters are probably close to equivalent strength - you've got 2 L141's, but I have more 3*'s over L100.

Just checked my subs; easy nodes look to have an average level anywhere in the range 50-70, hard nodes average is in the range 70-120. So far I have only completed each node once, about 12 hours ago. Nodes were probably 20 levels lower in easy, 20-40 levels lower in hard, on average.

I only finished in the 1 Falcon cover range in the last PvE (top 50, iirc), not sure how much that would contribute to lower level enemies.

That's what I don't get - I don't have even one 141 yet. Highest I have is 115 Torch. Yet, my starting nodes where more in the 80's-upper 90's in easy - then 100's -190's in hard, before playing anything. However, I did place 21st in my bracket for the Hunt, and 1st in my bracket in Top Gun, and 4th right now in Season 1. So, not sure what, if anything, actually counts towards what causes us all to have such differences in node levels - I can't believe it's that's just reliant on roster strength, and apparently, not just MMR... and not just on if you use Spidey or not, etc. It's some other magical combination of variables that I'm not quite sure anyone has put their finger on yet.

EDIT: - forgot to mention, regardless of my roster - my Bullseye 1,2 & 3 were all 395, Ares in Florida was 395, and at least 2-3 other nodes spread across were that high or just below. By the 6th day, virtually all of my Hunt nodes were 285-395 - and the last two days, basically nothing below 300. Yet, I did not grind any node - played once per refresh. Did not even touch/use Spidey once before running into my first 395 node, and only after losing that node the first time I played it without him even in my roster.

Unknown

Trust me its not roster based. I have four 141's and many others in the 100's. Top 10 Hunt, Top 2 Unstable Iso, Top 100 Hulk. top 2 other hunt? Is that a thing? Probably missing a couple in there. Heroics are meh.

Easy unlock node was at 42, now its 54. Hard mode was at 48 now its 62. The highest node in either sub is currently 102, the 2k iso reward node.

Half of that increase was overnight from doing nothing and half of it was when I did my clear today.

daveomite

Chimaera wrote:

Trust me its not roster based. I have four 141's and many others in the 100's. Top 10 Hunt, Top 2 Unstable Iso, Top 100 Hulk. top 2 other hunt? Is that a thing? Probably missing a couple in there. Heroics are meh.

Easy unlock node was at 42, now its 54. Hard mode was at 48 now its 62. The highest node in either sub is currently 102, the 2k iso reward node.

Half of that increase was overnight from doing nothing and half of it was when I did my clear today.

then it can't be roster based as the generic email replies may indicate. I still can't quite figure out how they are tabulating your MMR, meaning, from WHAT are they getting it?

I'm assuming it's not just PvE, not just PvP, not just LR's, it's some kind of combination of all of them, then thrown into a blender, and pureed into a grey mush...which they then proceed to force feed it back to you like we're stuck in the movie Saw.

Unknown

daveomite wrote:

Chimaera wrote:

Trust me its not roster based. I have four 141's and many others in the 100's. Top 10 Hunt, Top 2 Unstable Iso, Top 100 Hulk. top 2 other hunt? Is that a thing? Probably missing a couple in there. Heroics are meh.

Easy unlock node was at 42, now its 54. Hard mode was at 48 now its 62. The highest node in either sub is currently 102, the 2k iso reward node.

Half of that increase was overnight from doing nothing and half of it was when I did my clear today.

then it can't be roster based as the generic email replies may indicate. I still can't quite figure out how they are tabulating your MMR, meaning, from WHAT are they getting it?

I'm assuming it's not just PvE, not just PvP, not just LR's, it's some kind of combination of all of them, then thrown into a blender, and pureed into a grey mush...which they then proceed to force feed it back to you like we're stuck in the movie Saw.

Roster is not the only factor, is what they stated. In all honesty, it could be factors like : (how much damage is take, how long fight took, time between fights, damage dealt in what amount of time, how many healthpacks server is registering you use and what kind of healing you are doing between and during matches, average roster strength, which node you are fighting at, how many times you completed the same node, etc.) ~I sent preferred mathematical symbol~ (subsets average roster strength, how many times that particular node as been completed up to that point, total amount of damage received by the selected community, average time spent on the node by the selected community, total amount of healthpacks used thus far by the collective, etc.) = your determined challenge level for the selected mission.

This just an example of what it could be, albeit a complex one perhaps, but it's amazing how much that 64 bubble board has that can be utilized to figure a matchmaking rating value.

However, it would be unwise for them to reveal how it works like everyone wants to know. Not only can it then be exploited by those who have the means and time to do it, you also eliminate a balancing/fairness mechanism in place to prevent just such a means of giving any one or more persons an edge over the rest of the playerbase.

Unknown

I'm pretty sure roster determines your base level scaling. You're not going to have a guy with level 50 characters that start off with level 80 enemies. That'd be pretty insane. How you win games determines how fast that goes up.

I find that if I don't send Magneto or Spiderman out, the rest of my characters have no problem taking a ton of damage, and I guess I might as well use my backups until the opponent gets hard enough to require one of the big two. Well, I always use Magneto on the Falcon missions, but that's because my Falcon is way undercovered and needs the help.

ClydeFrog76

Holy ****, people have 395 on the opening nodes?! You poor SOBs I had 155 for both and thought something was amiss but that is just ridiculous.

I didn't even place that high nor grind that hard in The Hunt either. If this is "scaling working how it should" then I don't know what to say.

Bowgentle

Well, I guess that's just CS with the instructions to tell everyone who tickets in about scaling to say 'yes, it's working as intended.'
I can't believe 395s from the start are intended, unless they really want you to sit out a complete PVE - and even then why is there such a wide spread between people who apparently used the same tactics in The Hunt?

I swear, this whole 'beginners must be able to compete' is driving both the devs (who need to constantly tweak the most Byzantine rules) and the players (who must meta game n the weirdest ways) insane.

Meanwhile, in 1* to 2* land, players are happily bouncing through their first PVE experience, using whoever they want, in whichever way they want. Having a _lot_ more fun than the rest of us.

daveomite

Skyedyne wrote:

daveomite wrote:

Chimaera wrote:

Trust me its not roster based. I have four 141's and many others in the 100's. Top 10 Hunt, Top 2 Unstable Iso, Top 100 Hulk. top 2 other hunt? Is that a thing? Probably missing a couple in there. Heroics are meh.

Easy unlock node was at 42, now its 54. Hard mode was at 48 now its 62. The highest node in either sub is currently 102, the 2k iso reward node.

Half of that increase was overnight from doing nothing and half of it was when I did my clear today.

then it can't be roster based as the generic email replies may indicate. I still can't quite figure out how they are tabulating your MMR, meaning, from WHAT are they getting it?

I'm assuming it's not just PvE, not just PvP, not just LR's, it's some kind of combination of all of them, then thrown into a blender, and pureed into a grey mush...which they then proceed to force feed it back to you like we're stuck in the movie Saw.

Roster is not the only factor, is what they stated. In all honesty, it could be factors like : (how much damage is take, how long fight took, time between fights, damage dealt in what amount of time, how many healthpacks server is registering you use and what kind of healing you are doing between and during matches, average roster strength, which node you are fighting at, how many times you completed the same node, etc.) ~I sent preferred mathematical symbol~ (subsets average roster strength, how many times that particular node as been completed up to that point, total amount of damage received by the selected community, average time spent on the node by the selected community, total amount of healthpacks used thus far by the collective, etc.) = your determined challenge level for the selected mission.

This just an example of what it could be, albeit a complex one perhaps, but it's amazing how much that 64 bubble board has that can be utilized to figure a matchmaking rating value.

However, it would be unwise for them to reveal how it works like everyone wants to know. Not only can it then be exploited by those who have the means and time to do it, you also eliminate a balancing/fairness mechanism in place to prevent just such a means of giving any one or more persons an edge over the rest of the playerbase.

logical points and view. I realize that there are a lot of factors involved, and realize roster is probably one of them. I also realize I play a lot, and try to be active in most PvE and PvR events that come up. But basically, because I play a lot, and try to place well, I get smacked in the face like other people are.

Scaling "working like it should" should not punish someone for playing often, playing smart, or for playing competitively in events. So now, because I'm playing not only for me, but to better my alliance mates, I also run the severe risk of screwing myself if I don't follow a very strict guideline that, as you said, no one knows... and no one probably ever will know specifically.

The even bigger concern to me me is this type of "bait and switch" tactic they seem to be doing. What I mean, if you play too often, or too many events...scaling goes up. Check. Count how many events/subs happening right now. Sim, LR, AoO, Shield, Season 1. Including the Sim subs, that's five fully playable PvE/PvP - two of which tied to Season 1 (which is not playable), and the other the main event for Sim, which just unlocks the subs.

Then...character related scaling increases...mainly OBW and Spidey. In the Hunt, OBW was buffed, and now, in Sim, Spidey and OBW aren't buffed, but allowed of course. My question is how is it logical to buff or allow a character, meaning, making it more likely to be used, yet, punish you for doing so? That's like telling someone to do something, then punching them because they do. It makes zero logical sense.

They are all tactics to entice more and more sales of HP, health packs and ISO. Especially for those newer players. There are other ways they could make money, but are going about it in a way that is making some players back off from the game, playing it less, hence, making less longer term "commitment players" and keeping them engaged.

I know this is not the thread for this discussion. I'm certainly not trying to distract the main purpose of it. But, this event, and the scaling in it, is what prompted this whole conversation between us to begin with.

I agree with what points you made as they are logical, thought out assessments of the situation. Take my comments regarding it as added points and some of my own assessment as well.