New Feature: Bonus Heroes! *Updated (3/1/17)

killerkoala

"if" they were to do anything to change characters in tokens. it'd take more that a hot fix. it'd take time to code and we'd have to wait for a big patch day so minimum it be 3 weeks since next patch is next week.

astrp3

Magic wrote:

We are clearly carrot people in the forum...

Carrot people? Darn you, Magic, you've let the cat out of the bag. Say your goodbyes now.

"You still don't get it, do you, boys? There ain't no countries anymore, no more good guys. The carrot people are running the whole show! They own everything, the whole tinykitty planet. They can do whatever they want!" (classic movie reference alert)

Wonko33

Sorry if someone said this but 39 pages man!

It would be great if the favored heroes were added to the current pool as well, I think it would eliminate all the vault complaining.

Maybe they could limit how many heroes we can favor to compensate or something.

Crowl

firethorne wrote:

Yes. If you have something that is only marginally less janky, and you can hammer out in a week, versus a much more healthy solution that would take a few months to figure out, by all means, take your time. It would be better to take your time and really think everything though thoroughly instead of throwing something out that seems half-baked. That's why you're in this situation in the first place.

I think the big priority in this thread is letting you know reducing the rate of old character acquisition to one out of 20 draws is completely unacceptable to many players, and trying to get some sort of understanding on why you didn't think it was a problem.

Given they rushed through the change with no apparent thought of the consequences on most players, why not a quick fix of two types of each LT, one like it is now and another how they were under the old system, this would be an ideal short-term fix while they decide if something more elegant is required. They have even split the LT onto two pages so there is easily enough room for a change like this.

whycantwesyncpc

Crowl wrote:

firethorne wrote:

Yes. If you have something that is only marginally less janky, and you can hammer out in a week, versus a much more healthy solution that would take a few months to figure out, by all means, take your time. It would be better to take your time and really think everything though thoroughly instead of throwing something out that seems half-baked. That's why you're in this situation in the first place.

I think the big priority in this thread is letting you know reducing the rate of old character acquisition to one out of 20 draws is completely unacceptable to many players, and trying to get some sort of understanding on why you didn't think it was a problem.

Given they rushed through the change with no apparent thought of the consequences on most players, why not a quick fix of two types of each LT, one like it is now and another how they were under the old system, this would be an ideal short-term fix while they decide if something more elegant is required. They have even split the LT onto two pages so there is easily enough room for a change like this.

I'd image it would be that easy if it were just legendary tokens that were that way, but I'm sure the other tokens probably would be a bit more work although I know I'd be happy if those went back to the way they were before the change, although I'm sure some coding would have to be done to get them to work with the bonus hero stuff. Bottom line I think it's more work than any of us realize

DesertTortoise

I don't really hate the vaulting, but I'd prefer if it were rolled back or we were given more freedom regarding it. Thanks to Brigby and Cthulhu for letting us know that the variety of feedback in this thread is being looked at.

DarthDeVo

Jaedenkaal wrote:

Daredevil217 wrote:

We the players have been discussing solutions all weekend and the one that seems to be getting the most universal praise, and that will help solve the problem you were trying to address (dilution) without impacting your bottom line (financially speaking) is to add the older vaulted legends to the classic packs and leave the newest in the latest packs. This will allow those who complain of dilution and want to catch up faster a route to do so by buying latest packs that have a smaller pool to draw from. Those who don't mind dilution and want to work on covering older characters can do so with the classic packs. Both customers can utilize the very occasional bonus heroes (universally loved without the vaulting, by the way) to fill in the gaps.

If they do this, be prepared for Classics to cost 25 CP as well.

I'm not arguing that they should, I'm just saying. The argument in favour of this solution is that the older characters are at least as valuable to us as the new ones, so I'd get ready to pay as much for them.

I think the 25/20 split still makes sense. In theory, buying from the Latest store includes a pool of characters that, for many players, are newer and therefore you're more likely to draw a cover for a character or color that's undercovered. Consider it paying a little bit of a premium to be less likely to have a wasted cover.

Drawing from Classics includes characters that have been around longer, therefore the chance of drawing a dupe is more likely, which could be wasteful (unless you have a healthy stable of champs).

Crowl

whycantwesyncpc wrote:

I'd image it would be that easy if it were just legendary tokens that were that way, but I'm sure the other tokens probably would be a bit more work although I know I'd be happy if those went back to the way they were before the change, although I'm sure some coding would have to be done to get them to work with the bonus hero stuff. Bottom line I think it's more work than any of us realize

There is no need to do it for all tokens, leaving the other ones how they are would result in marginally more covers for the new characters, it is not like they are overly generous with 4*s for most people anyway, whereas the LTs are going to be the primary source of such covers for most people.

fmftint

On the subject of dilution, imo only having the newest 12 characters in the pool doesn't provide enough variety. Maybe the newest 12 plus 5 characters that you select giving each character (17) a 5% draw chance

I'd like to see:
5 15%
Agent Coulson 5%
Mordo 5%
Riri 5%
Medusa 5%
Agent Venom 5%
Blade 5%
Gwenpool 5%
Cage 5%
Spider Woman 5%
Wasp 5%
Peggy 5%
Player choice 1 5%
player choice 2 5%
player choice 3 5%
player choice 4 5%
player choice 5 5%

whycantwesyncpc

Crowl wrote:

whycantwesyncpc wrote:

I'd image it would be that easy if it were just legendary tokens that were that way, but I'm sure the other tokens probably would be a bit more work although I know I'd be happy if those went back to the way they were before the change, although I'm sure some coding would have to be done to get them to work with the bonus hero stuff. Bottom line I think it's more work than any of us realize

There is no need to do it for all tokens, leaving the other ones how they are would result in marginally more covers for the new characters, it is not like they are overly generous with 4*s for most people anyway, whereas the LTs are going to be the primary source of such covers for most people.

I was hoping they would undo the vaulting for the 3*'s as well

Ayasugi-san

The vaulting of 3 s was at least promised to be rotating, and there are a bunch of strong ones in the current pool. Possibly too many; I hope that when they rotate, they leave some of those strong ones in. Getting some solid answers on how often the 3 s will be rotated in and out of the vault and how they'll choose would also be nice. For the 4 s they at least gave us solid statements. **** ones, but we knew just what would happen.

Wumpushunter

Brigby wrote:

Magic wrote:

@cthulu and @Brigby who is lurking at the forum while I write this.

Please make sure that the development team doesn't rush into any decisions. I hope they will focus on multiple angles while trying to sort out this storm.

-snip-

Hi Magic. Rest assured, we will definitely be taking the appropriate amount of time to analyze all the feedback from the community, in order to identify the best solution possible.
(The community gave a LOT of feedback, so this might take some time. )

But dont go so slowly just to wait out the furor and leave things lIke they are, I have temporarily quit until something is done about vaulting. Discuss, analyze, and give updates to the community, please.

whycantwesyncpc

Ayasugi-san wrote:

The vaulting of 3 s was at least promised to be rotating, and there are a bunch of strong ones in the current pool. Possibly too many; I hope that when they rotate, they leave some of those strong ones in. Getting some solid answers on how often the 3 s will be rotated in and out of the vault and how they'll choose would also be nice. For the 4 s they at least gave us solid statements. tinykitty ones, but we knew just what would happen.

The original post only says that if any are added they will rotate ones out. It says nothing about switching in the ones already rotated.

Moon Roach

Does unstickying mean that the devs don't want any more feedback?

killerkoala

whycantwesyncpc wrote:

Ayasugi-san wrote:

The vaulting of 3 s was at least promised to be rotating, and there are a bunch of strong ones in the current pool. Possibly too many; I hope that when they rotate, they leave some of those strong ones in. Getting some solid answers on how often the 3 s will be rotated in and out of the vault and how they'll choose would also be nice. For the 4 s they at least gave us solid statements. tinykitty ones, but we knew just what would happen.

The original post only says that if any are added they will rotate ones out. It says nothing about switching in the ones already rotated.

in space gem post

Brigby wrote:

There will be no changes to 3-Stars with this Season.

kinda gives hope to at least there might be a 3* rotation in the future.

Roguewookie26

I am glad they are reviewing this. And honestly if its going to take time to figure out changes and implement thats fine. But if its going to be months. How about you just roll the patch back and put us back to what we had before. Remove the bonus heroes if needed for a time. And try again later. Preferably with a focus group made up of actual players instead of the 2 janitors and im guessing whichever mom is letting you guys use her basement this week. (Saw where you claim the majority of your player base loves your new release schedule. 1.thats a lie 2. You know it. Because if you didnt you wouldnt have mentioned it to start with) Its not just playtesting this game lacks. Its a basic understanding of your player base before you implement changes this large. And yes please learn you can tell us things ahead of time instead of 5 mins after you do it. If you had posted a couple, or even 1 week early, what your plans were then you could have avoided a lot of this firestorm.

whycantwesyncpc

killerkoala wrote:

whycantwesyncpc wrote:

Ayasugi-san wrote:

The vaulting of 3 s was at least promised to be rotating, and there are a bunch of strong ones in the current pool. Possibly too many; I hope that when they rotate, they leave some of those strong ones in. Getting some solid answers on how often the 3 s will be rotated in and out of the vault and how they'll choose would also be nice. For the 4 s they at least gave us solid statements. tinykitty ones, but we knew just what would happen.

The original post only says that if any are added they will rotate ones out. It says nothing about switching in the ones already rotated.

in space gem post

Brigby wrote:

There will be no changes to 3-Stars with this Season.

kinda gives hope to at least there might be a 3* rotation in the future.

Or could just mean that there were no new 3* characters and that's why there is no rotation. Hopefully they just realize that vaulting is bad period and remove it completely

stewbacca

Although I get everyone's issue with the vaulting. HavING pulled a bonus five star I think is the biggest feature, no more pure randomness it will help get the specific character covers I need immensly. Plus that fact that the bonus (strange), came with me only spending classic 20 pts. Why anyone would spend 25 pts ever makes no sense.

Magic

stewbacca wrote:

Although I get everyone's issue with the vaulting. HavING pulled a bonus five star I think is the biggest feature, no more pure randomness it will help get the specific character covers I need immensly. Plus that fact that the bonus (strange), came with me only spending classic 20 pts. Why anyone would spend 25 pts ever makes no sense.

For many reasons. One would be you only have 5% of the 15% of pulls to get the bonus cover (say Strange from classics pull) - so lucky you. On average you should get 15 5* covers in 100 pulls. And only 5% of them will have the bonus (so 1 in 20 of that limited quantity). Which means you will get on average 1 out of 200 20 CP pulls (might get 2 if lucky).

In the latest you get 5% of chances to get the latest cover. So Strange should show up 5 times in 100 pulls.

If you need less simplistic math - dig in the thread as there are plenty of people who did the calculation to give you the probability.

Oldboy

So here's what i think may be typical for some in the coming weeks and months if the current state continues:

I now have 4 covers of Gwenpool (lvl 200) and 4 of Kate Bishop (lvl 120) on the vine but only enough iso to champ one of them before the other covers expire. With the news that Kate is going to be rotated out, it looks like Gwenpool will be the one getting champed. In the meantime Kate will probably be languishing at lvl 120 for a long, long time. She's usable when boosted for her essentials but there's less incentive now for me to put levels into her. I have enough 4* champed to make it through most weeks.

Seems to me a waste of dev time and effort to design a character when said character just ends up collecting dust in the 'closet'.