New Mission Difficulty For All Story Events *Updated

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Comments

  • carrion_pigeons
    carrion_pigeons Posts: 942 Critical Contributor
    DuckyV wrote:
    What was that noise?

    Oh, just the mass exodus of people playing PvE competitively, which will in turn lead them to stop playing it altogether.

    I think there's a common perception that if you play competitively, then you're the game's target audience. But if they lose every single player who was happy to take advantage of the 8-hour refresh, and replace them all (and more) with people who prefer a less structured experience, can you really call it a bad business decision?

    The reality is that PvE is their least popular game mode by a lot, on average. If they can get people interested in playing that format, they stand to benefit substantially, and they are apparently happy to burn their existing playerbase to the ground to do it. (And I think they're right to do so, even though I think this is not the implementation they wanted, to make it happen.)
  • dider152
    dider152 Posts: 263
    This is a stupid decision and I'm honestly surprised how boneheaded the devs are. The last test was not good, but it was promising, and I was hoping that pve would finally become true pve and be progression based. Instead we got this ****. I can already see that it's going to be hell for placement, with the 1 point easy node being a repeated node for the player who wants the best prize.

    And it's not like it's difficult to make everything progression: they could have just combined the two progression rewards lists and made the point difference between the 25 cp reward and the first cover big. If you want to stop at 25 cp, you can, and if you want to go for the covers, you can play just a little bit more. And why does everything have to be competitive based anyway? Let everybody play for and receive covers of new characters if they wish. It even helps you by making players decide if they want to spend hp on new slots or just sell the covers. Opening the acquisition of covers to all players is a clear money maker and I'm honestly surprised at you guys. I think the decision to implement this is a bad decision and spells the beginning of the end of the game, whether it takes a year or more.

    At least you should have tested this change on a heroic or something before you planned to implement it.
  • hodayathink
    hodayathink Posts: 528 Critical Contributor
    dider152 wrote:
    This is a stupid decision and I'm honestly surprised how boneheaded the devs are. The last test was not good, but it was promising, and I was hoping that pve would finally become true pve and be progression based. Instead we got this ****. I can already see that it's going to be hell for placement, with the 1 point easy node being a repeated node for the player who wants the best prize.

    How exactly is that different from right now? With the current (soon to be former) PvE system, you can also repeat the easiest node for 1pt, and it actually doesn't scale up in difficulty anywhere near as fast (or, I think, as much) as it does in the new system. Yet we don't see people doing that right now, even after the third full clear.
  • Figure15
    Figure15 Posts: 284 Mover and Shaker
    I want to recruit one of these legendary 5* Muscle goons.
  • DTStump
    DTStump Posts: 273 Mover and Shaker
    Hey guiz I'm super happy about finally being able to play anytime I want because that totally wasn't possible before. Right? ¯\_(• _•)_/¯
  • Malcrof
    Malcrof Posts: 5,971 Chairperson of the Boards
    DuckyV wrote:
    What was that noise?

    Oh, just the mass exodus of people playing PvE competitively, which will in turn lead them to stop playing it altogether.

    Quite the opposite.. i have all but stopped playing MPQ recently, RL issues and a long commute made it to where i could no longer be competitive in PVE or PVP, and didn't have the time for it even if i could... So i am playing MtG:PQ , very relaxed and at your own pace, and engrossing. With the new PVE going into effect, it looks like i can spend minimal time and get the CP at least, regardless of which slice or when i join now, and not worry about having to try and play every X hours for X amount of time, it just became more relaxed and at your own pace.. All i want is progression though, so speaking for someone who has no real need of any PVE placement rewards anymore, this is just what MPQ needed.
  • puppychow
    puppychow Posts: 1,453
    pheregas wrote:
    Well, I guess I'm done with "competitive PVE."

    Story mode is now just a farm for iso and cp. I can't, won't, and simply don't have the time to grind down every node as quickly as possible and then grind grind grind for one point per match at the end (the trivial one, of course as it is worth as much as the hardest node by that point.)

    I'll pick up my new character every week to two weeks in PVP.

    This is all fine, of course. I still get to play my favorite match three game, but only for progression prizes now without the stress of the final grind. I still get the new character. I may even get out of s2!

    When game devs constantly tested the new pve format, I already saw the writing on the wall and quit competitive pve at the end of May, or six weeks ago. With the new scaling, in conjunction with another cover leveling increase, pve will be much harder veteran players. But you are correct that you could pick up the new character in pvp. That's what I've been doing this month. icon_cool.gif
  • puppychow
    puppychow Posts: 1,453
    carrion pigeons wrote:
    DuckyV wrote:
    What was that noise?

    Oh, just the mass exodus of people playing PvE competitively, which will in turn lead them to stop playing it altogether.

    I think there's a common perception that if you play competitively, then you're the game's target audience. But if they lose every single player who was happy to take advantage of the 8-hour refresh, and replace them all (and more) with people who prefer a less structured experience, can you really call it a bad business decision?

    The reality is that PvE is their least popular game mode by a lot, on average. If they can get people interested in playing that format, they stand to benefit substantially, and they are apparently happy to burn their existing playerbase to the ground to do it. (And I think they're right to do so, even though I think this is not the implementation they wanted, to make it happen.)

    To be honest, I think game devs' main goal (re: pve) is get people to spend $$$, rather than player engagement. There was one point, when I was a competitive t10 pve player, where I spend up to 1,000 hp per sub in order to keep pace in t10. If you have enough players doing that trying to get 2 or 3 new covers, then it's less relevant what the engagement rate is b/c the less competitive players are very unlikely to spend $$$ anyway.
  • simonsez
    simonsez Posts: 4,663 Chairperson of the Boards
    killerkoala wrote:
    i am surprised they hot-shotted the changes to permanent before giving it a try in all the different types of events ( regular, heroic, and with multiple waves).
    Is there really any point in further testing when they're ignoring the feedback they're getting?
  • Quebbster
    Quebbster Posts: 8,070 Chairperson of the Boards
    simonsez wrote:
    killerkoala wrote:
    i am surprised they hot-shotted the changes to permanent before giving it a try in all the different types of events ( regular, heroic, and with multiple waves).
    Is there really any point in further testing when they're ignoring the feedback they're getting?
    What feedback are they ignoring? They said in the opening post that the Rocket and Groot system had the most positive feedback, so that's what they are going with aside from some minor corrections also based on user feedback. How is that ignoring feedback?
  • GrumpySmurf1002
    GrumpySmurf1002 Posts: 3,511 Chairperson of the Boards
    Quebbster wrote:
    simonsez wrote:
    killerkoala wrote:
    i am surprised they hot-shotted the changes to permanent before giving it a try in all the different types of events ( regular, heroic, and with multiple waves).
    Is there really any point in further testing when they're ignoring the feedback they're getting?
    What feedback are they ignoring? They said in the opening post that the Rocket and Groot system had the most positive feedback, so that's what they are going with aside from some minor corrections also based on user feedback. How is that ignoring feedback?

    They said nothing about feedback. They said their results, which is coming from data, showed the most positive results.

    The biggest thing they're ignoring is this idea that people aren't playing to a schedule. It's possible they didn't in test, but with tinykitty events like Heroics mixed with rewards like Cho, it's to be expected.

    The first time they run a new release with this system is when they're gonna see the goals aren't close to being met. That's the feedback that's been ignored during virtually every test, and now into implementation.
  • ngoni
    ngoni Posts: 112 Tile Toppler
    Mal if you just wanted progression you didn't need to worry about the timers. Just clear 4-5 times each sub and you'd get there.
    Malcrof wrote:
    DuckyV wrote:
    What was that noise?

    Oh, just the mass exodus of people playing PvE competitively, which will in turn lead them to stop playing it altogether.

    Quite the opposite.. i have all but stopped playing MPQ recently, RL issues and a long commute made it to where i could no longer be competitive in PVE or PVP, and didn't have the time for it even if i could... So i am playing MtG:PQ , very relaxed and at your own pace, and engrossing. With the new PVE going into effect, it looks like i can spend minimal time and get the CP at least, regardless of which slice or when i join now, and not worry about having to try and play every X hours for X amount of time, it just became more relaxed and at your own pace.. All i want is progression though, so speaking for someone who has no real need of any PVE placement rewards anymore, this is just what MPQ needed.
  • TxMoose
    TxMoose Posts: 4,319 Chairperson of the Boards
    I guess its really a psychological advantage to not see the timer. even though everyone is saying 4 clears and you get progression and most of the prizes...and that is mostly the same as before. 4 suboptimal clears has mostly always gotten progression. the only restriction was it couldn't all be done at once, so a minimum of 2 play sessions (which is much more healthy than 1 long one anyway). its a real blow to my schedule since I really enjoyed the morning clear, lunch clear, evening grind schedule. I can still treat it that way for progression, but i'll never be able to place that way. and its a shame too, now that finishing off my 3s is in sight. I may be pleasantly surprised and I really hope I am. I'm just expecting some disengagement from me in pve because of this.
  • __Adam
    __Adam Posts: 111 Tile Toppler
    TxMoose wrote:

    the only restriction was it couldn't all be done at once, so a minimum of 2 play sessions

    This is a big deal for someone like me; I can schedule 1 block a day pretty consistently but I can't schedule 2-3, especially since they conveniently don't have a sub that ends in the early evening hours EST. For someone like me we put in the same effort and get neither the progression OR placement rewards. That sucks.

    The newly proposed system isn't objectivity worse; it just seems that way on the forums because those that benefit from the current structure are politicking for keeping the status quo. The truly competitive will adapt.

    I'm looking forward to the changes; I might get enough CP to actually mature my roster.
  • simonsez
    simonsez Posts: 4,663 Chairperson of the Boards
    Quebbster wrote:
    What feedback are they ignoring?
    That people playing for placement have to play 4-5 hours straight at a specific time, which is 180 degrees counter to their stated goals, and far worse than the current system in regard to those goals. I really shouldn't have to spell this out to you.
  • PorkBelly
    PorkBelly Posts: 535 Critical Contributor
    If you ask any top 10 pve player to state the worst part of the system, it is the final grind of each sub.

    This change just doubled the amount of grinding you have to do in order to place well and made the nodes harder by the end.

    From a competitive pve perspective, I can't see how they could have made it worse.
  • JVReal
    JVReal Posts: 1,884 Chairperson of the Boards
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  • simonsez
    simonsez Posts: 4,663 Chairperson of the Boards
    PorkBelly wrote:
    From a competitive pve perspective, I can't see how they could have made it worse.
    Me neither, but I bet it would have something to do with banners...
  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    simonsez wrote:
    PorkBelly wrote:
    From a competitive pve perspective, I can't see how they could have made it worse.
    Me neither, but I bet it would have something to do with banners...


    It could have been much worse. 15 clears per node + final grind? Scaling like that one crazy run of the gauntlet this spring? Don't challenge them to make things worse! Just point out that this new system may not actually achieve their stated goals. . .
  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    --Adam wrote:
    TxMoose wrote:

    the only restriction was it couldn't all be done at once, so a minimum of 2 play sessions

    This is a big deal for someone like me; I can schedule 1 block a day pretty consistently but I can't schedule 2-3, especially since they conveniently don't have a sub that ends in the early evening hours EST. For someone like me we put in the same effort and get neither the progression OR placement rewards. That sucks.

    The newly proposed system isn't objectivity worse; it just seems that way on the forums because those that benefit from the current structure are politicking for keeping the status quo. The truly competitive will adapt.

    I'm looking forward to the changes; I might get enough CP to actually mature my roster.

    If cp is your goal from pve, then a single play session was sufficient to get almost all available cp under the old system. Optimal schedule only mattered at all if you cared about placement. And placement provides a trivial amount of cp. Progression rewards were always achievable with sub-optimal play.

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