**** Moon Knight (Marc Spector) ****

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  • stochasticism
    stochasticism Posts: 1,181 Chairperson of the Boards
    Is Green the only color available to be sent as a TU? Purple is out as a passive and Black should be out as it has a self-heal condition. Just want to confirm this.
  • Piro_plock
    Piro_plock Posts: 287 Mover and Shaker
    stochasticism wrote:
    Is Green the only color available to be sent as a TU? Purple is out as a passive and Black should be out as it has a self-heal condition. Just want to confirm this.
    DPX red can be sent as a TU despite self-heal. I think the restriction only applies to self-harm
  • amusingfoo1
    amusingfoo1 Posts: 597 Critical Contributor
    Piro_plock wrote:
    stochasticism wrote:
    Is Green the only color available to be sent as a TU? Purple is out as a passive and Black should be out as it has a self-heal condition. Just want to confirm this.
    DPX red can be sent as a TU despite self-heal. I think the restriction only applies to self-harm

    Rags blue can also be sent as a team-up. Self-harm or self-stun definitely rule things out, though.
  • Konman
    Konman Posts: 410 Mover and Shaker
    Got a Moon Knight cover from the latest Clash of Titans. I had honestly forgotten he was in the game.
  • notamutant
    notamutant Posts: 855 Critical Contributor
    https://youtu.be/N4YE2-ujycA

    I finally decided to go back and make a video for Moon Knight. He really is not that good. Very mediocre unless boosted.
  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    notamutant wrote:
    https://youtu.be/N4YE2-ujycA

    I finally decided to go back and make a video for Moon Knight. He really is not that good. Very mediocre unless boosted.

    Interesting. Some of the whales really like him.

    That nuke is scary on defense. No hiding a squishy support from random targeting. But his other two powers are meh.

    I think his high damage numbers and not terrible passive make him mid tier.
  • notamutant
    notamutant Posts: 855 Critical Contributor
    Vhailorx wrote:
    notamutant wrote:
    https://youtu.be/N4YE2-ujycA

    I finally decided to go back and make a video for Moon Knight. He really is not that good. Very mediocre unless boosted.

    Interesting. Some of the whales really like him.

    That nuke is scary on defense. No hiding a squishy support from random targeting. But his other two powers are meh.

    I think his high damage numbers and not terrible passive make him mid tier.

    I agree he is mid-tier, it is just that being mid-tier is kind of meaningless nowadays with some really strong 4 stars and 5 stars out. Unpredictability makes him much less useful. I think a good way to think if a character is good, is if you would use them when not boosted. Iceman, JG, HB, RH, Peggy, all good even when not boosted.
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,643 Chairperson of the Boards
    notamutant wrote:
    Vhailorx wrote:
    notamutant wrote:
    https://youtu.be/N4YE2-ujycA

    I finally decided to go back and make a video for Moon Knight. He really is not that good. Very mediocre unless boosted.

    Interesting. Some of the whales really like him.

    That nuke is scary on defense. No hiding a squishy support from random targeting. But his other two powers are meh.

    I think his high damage numbers and not terrible passive make him mid tier.

    I agree he is mid-tier, it is just that being mid-tier is kind of meaningless nowadays with some really strong 4 stars and 5 stars out. Unpredictability makes him much less useful. I think a good way to think if a character is good, is if you would use them when not boosted. Iceman, JG, HB, RH, Peggy, all good even when not boosted.

    I finally champed him, and I have been using him in the past PvEs and I think you were too harsh with him. For me he is definitely good-tier, he is quite good, specially in PvE. I have used him in the past two PvEs where he has been buffed and I have been quite happy with the results.

    I used him with a 3/5/5 build with OML+PH first, and he complements them quite nicely. His green does 26k damage, and his purple 2/3 times has a power that goes really nicely with the strikes of the 5s (both attack tiles and extra damage when matching purple). He is always protected by the 5s, never in front, so he is just damaged by AoE attacks. In general you won't use his black because OMLs is better, this is why 3/5/5 I think is the preferred build with those two.
    I am also using him in this Heroic, with 4hor and over x23 and Antman which I also have champed. In this PvE I am using him 5/3/5. His black is really really good, it hits for 13k damage, and makes him very resilent, he finishes almost all fights at full life. Again you just need to use it when it is better, not fire it right away when you get the AP.

    I have found out that green can be used almost always when there are two enemies at full health or there is just one enemy left, so the randomness it is not that bad, you just need to wait a bit before you use it, and if you are in 4 land (scaling with max enemies of 320-350 level) his green will certainly kill an enemy. I don't remember any other attack as strong in 4 land a part from FalCap's red, Punisher's black and of course Peggy's blue, but those require special tiles on the board, or some tiles to survive for a while, this one doesn't, it just hits when you fire it. With green and black hitting so hard, it is very easy to have two enemies left, hit the weakest first with black, heal and then kill the other one with green.
  • sambrookjm
    sambrookjm Posts: 2,163 Chairperson of the Boards
    Just heard back from the devs about his green ability. In the most recent sim, his green randomly took out my Scarlet Witch without The Thing's jumping in and taking the damage for her with his Rock Solid ability. I filed a bug report, and they got back to me on it:
    Our apologies for any confusion or misunderstanding, but what you had experienced was normal gameplay functionality. With the introduction of Moon Knight (Marc Spector), there are enemies who can deal Random damage. Similar to AoE Damage, Random Damage is not blocked by The Thing (Classic)'s Rock Solid or Deadpool (It's Me, Deadpool!)'s Life of the Party abilities, and can deal damage through targets invisibility. So far, only Moon Knight (Marc Spector)'s Moonsilver Blades (Green) and Gwenpool (Gwen Poole)'s Deus Ex Machina (Green) powers deal Random target damage.
    So it can hit just about anyone in the game; even that annoying invisible Prof X that's tormenting you. A big thanks to the devs for the reply on the day after Thanksgiving, as I certainly wasn't expecting to hear back from them until the weekend was over.
  • himatako
    himatako Posts: 269 Mover and Shaker
    sambrookjm wrote:
    Just heard back from the devs about his green ability. In the most recent sim, his green randomly took out my Scarlet Witch without The Thing's jumping in and taking the damage for her with his Rock Solid ability. I filed a bug report, and they got back to me on it:
    Our apologies for any confusion or misunderstanding, but what you had experienced was normal gameplay functionality. With the introduction of Moon Knight (Marc Spector), there are enemies who can deal Random damage. Similar to AoE Damage, Random Damage is not blocked by The Thing (Classic)'s Rock Solid or Deadpool (It's Me, Deadpool!)'s Life of the Party abilities, and can deal damage through targets invisibility. So far, only Moon Knight (Marc Spector)'s Moonsilver Blades (Green) and Gwenpool (Gwen Poole)'s Deus Ex Machina (Green) powers deal Random target damage.
    So it can hit just about anyone in the game; even that annoying invisible Prof X that's tormenting you. A big thanks to the devs for the reply on the day after Thanksgiving, as I certainly wasn't expecting to hear back from them until the weekend was over.

    Oooh. Thank you for asking them to clear this up. This explains why invisible characters can be stunned by Spider Gwen's purple. It's a Random Stun, so it works the same way.
  • Jaedenkaal
    Jaedenkaal Posts: 3,357 Chairperson of the Boards
    I believe Blade's Bloodthirst also hits a random target, so presumably that will apply to him as well.
  • Rick_OShay
    Rick_OShay Posts: 765 Critical Contributor
    Noticed something different about MK recently. His black is a great power, especially when you down an enemy and earn the true heal.
    However, it is no longer gaining the self-heal when downing the final enemy right as the match ends. This definitely used to take place, I would routinely ensure a Fist of Khonshu ending blow to get health back before the next match. Same thing for XPool if you can do it, heal up during the death blow.
    Did the dev's mention anything about nerfing this at the end of matches?

    EDIT: tested XPool and he still heals on the match-ending red power 'out of bullets'. So what gives on MK?
  • Tatercat
    Tatercat Posts: 930 Critical Contributor
    Rick OShay wrote:

    EDIT: tested XPool and he still heals on the match-ending red power 'out of bullets'. So what gives on MK?

    Must have something to do with conditional setting of the two powers. Deadpool’s Out Of Bullets will heal you no matter if the target survives or not, so I guess its activated at the same time as the damage being dealt. Moon Knight’s black waits to see if the character is downed before the healing is triggered, so I’m guessing that the VICTORY is programmed to “cut in” before any such conditional effects.

    I had noticed the lack of heal on the final "kill" of a fight too, but had thought it had always been that way (only champed him last fall).
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,643 Chairperson of the Boards
    Tatercat wrote:
    Rick OShay wrote:

    EDIT: tested XPool and he still heals on the match-ending red power 'out of bullets'. So what gives on MK?

    Must have something to do with conditional setting of the two powers. Deadpool’s Out Of Bullets will heal you no matter if the target survives or not, so I guess its activated at the same time as the damage being dealt. Moon Knight’s black waits to see if the character is downed before the healing is triggered, so I’m guessing that the VICTORY is programmed to “cut in” before any such conditional effects.

    I had noticed the lack of heal on the final "kill" of a fight too, but had thought it had always been that way (only champed him last fall).

    I have not tested it now, but before it did heal you for the final death.

    Another bug for the list icon_e_sad.gif
  • DrDevilDinosaur
    DrDevilDinosaur Posts: 436 Mover and Shaker
    Can confirm this bug. It seems that there are a few issues with certain attack effects happening out of order, so it's probably a case that the End Of Match is being flagged before it gets to the Heal Moon Knight part of the ability. How the game doesn't resolve the full active ability before even making checks for End Of Match is beyond me.
  • alaeth
    alaeth Posts: 446 Mover and Shaker
    notamutant wrote:
    I agree he is mid-tier, it is just that being mid-tier is kind of meaningless nowadays with some really strong 4 stars and 5 stars out. Unpredictability makes him much less useful. I think a good way to think if a character is good, is if you would use them when not boosted. Iceman, JG, HB, RH, Peggy, all good even when not boosted.


    I disagree... with HP and power creep, I find I get his green nuke off well before anyone is seriously injured. Or if the opponent has a squishy support, I take them out first to ensure the full force of his green is met.

    I think he is unpredictable, and boosted extremely dangerous.

    In the (off-season) Divine Heroes PvP - I'm running him, with Thoress and IM40... good color coverage, and you can typically get him to down someone on his Black, saving a healthpak.

    Last season, I ran him along-side Peggy and XPool on Simulator and rarely had any issues with downing other 4* teams.


    Overall I think he is undervalued and makes a great fill-in - especially against high HP teams where you need a nuke to take out "someone". icon_e_smile.gif
  • OneLastGambit
    OneLastGambit Posts: 1,963 Chairperson of the Boards
    I like to run him with C4ge and F3st. 66% of the time MK purple will boost fist black, fist generates black for MK, Cage mitigates damage while providing yellow and red coverage and MK destroys anything with green. What's not to like?
  • OneLastGambit
    OneLastGambit Posts: 1,963 Chairperson of the Boards
    Polares wrote:
    Tatercat wrote:
    Rick OShay wrote:

    EDIT: tested XPool and he still heals on the match-ending red power 'out of bullets'. So what gives on MK?

    Must have something to do with conditional setting of the two powers. Deadpool’s Out Of Bullets will heal you no matter if the target survives or not, so I guess its activated at the same time as the damage being dealt. Moon Knight’s black waits to see if the character is downed before the healing is triggered, so I’m guessing that the VICTORY is programmed to “cut in” before any such conditional effects.

    I had noticed the lack of heal on the final "kill" of a fight too, but had thought it had always been that way (only champed him last fall).

    I have not tested it now, but before it did heal you for the final death.

    Another bug for the list icon_e_sad.gif


    It's not a bug, passives no longer trigger at the end of the match. It's why we never see KK grinning after downing someone or PX shake his head. It's not a bug, it was an intended change made quite a while ago.
  • OneLastGambit
    OneLastGambit Posts: 1,963 Chairperson of the Boards
    Rick OShay wrote:
    Noticed something different about MK recently. His black is a great power, especially when you down an enemy and earn the true heal.
    However, it is no longer gaining the self-heal when downing the final enemy right as the match ends. This definitely used to take place, I would routinely ensure a Fist of Khonshu ending blow to get health back before the next match. Same thing for XPool if you can do it, heal up during the death blow.
    Did the dev's mention anything about nerfing this at the end of matches?

    EDIT: tested XPool and he still heals on the match-ending red power 'out of bullets'. So what gives on MK?[/quote]

    MK heal is a passive aspect of his power. XFDP is all active.
  • Jaedenkaal
    Jaedenkaal Posts: 3,357 Chairperson of the Boards
    Well that's a proximate explanation, yes. But it does not explain why the powers behave differently.

    My guess is that it actually is a bug, and has more to do with powers with multiple effects firing multiple times, once for each "effect" (ala Chemical Reaction)

    You could test this with Chemical Reaction, in fact. If you end a match with the "first" part of Chemical Reaction, does it still consume strike tiles to do extra damage? Or does the match end before that happens?

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