CW scaling goes boom

thanos8587

Malcrof wrote:

HxiiiK wrote:

I'm pretty okay with reasonable scaling, but the genius who decided, "hey, you know what would be fun? 3* Cap Marv in ALL the wave nodes! At level 300 she'll just use energy absorption on every tinykitty skill, THAT'll challenge the players!" should find the nearest ditch and bury himself in it

Considering she's softened, and does not even generate black, its a non issue.

I love that fact that it is loads more challenging now, heck, its sorta nice to see my OML die once in a while, keeps ya humble.

i dont play for challenge. i play for fun and awards. when the time requirement spikes without commensurate reward increases, im done.

and if i wanted challenge id find it somewhere other than a bejeweled clone. this isnt a challenge, its a straight up grind and waste of time now.

atomzed

Even after the increased scaling, I still think that this is the easiest ever first run of special pve. Ultron, galactus were both difficult. I do think that this is scaled appropriately.

I think the clearest indicator of how appropriately scaled this event is by the number of alliances who completed round 8. I seen at least 127 alliances who completed it on my leadership board, and probably much more that I couldn't see.

I don't remember galactus 1 having so many alliances completed round 8...less than 20? This event, considering its run the first time, is way way better.

CNash

The Captain Marvel fight that really gave me problems was the one where she's in the first wave, with Sentry on the second. If you don't tackle her in exactly the right way, Sentry will use all that red AP and murder you with repeated Supernovas.

thanos8587

atomzed wrote:

Even after the increased scaling, I still think that this is the easiest ever first run of special pve. Ultron, galactus were both difficult. I do think that this is scaled appropriately.

I think the clearest indicator of how appropriately scaled this event is by the number of alliances who completed round 8. I seen at least 127 alliances who completed it on my leadership board, and probably much more that I couldn't see.

I don't remember galactus 1 having so many alliances completed round 8...less than 20? This event, considering its run the first time, is way way better.

to be fair galactus one was broken. people finishing it were using one team AND they were resorting to force quit cheating to do it. and in this event many alliances were well into round seven before scaling kicked in. with the points available for round 7 and eight bosses, it wouldnt have been an issue finishing progression without
ever getting full kills on the boss and you would have gotten the five star with 36+ hours to go in the event. its the scaling at the end of the event thats so stupid. my fear is that run number two is going to introduce this scaling from round one because something was clearly wrong with the system in this run.

elusive

I'm starting to wonder if the devs are starting to listen to the people with the 5* rosters who say this game is too easy. All I know is that I'm on Round 5 and I've effectively been locked out of winning any of the nodes thanks to not having a single good 4* to field (I have a ton of championed 3*, at least) - I forgot the Black Widow node had two waves and was like, "Thank god I barely managed to kill them!" right before it switched over to the next wave and immediately destroyed the tattered remnants of my team. The combination of Nova and Iron Fist kept playing off of each other and stacking strike tiles on top of attack tiles, not to mention Invisible Woman ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS, finds a way to generate enough AP to turn invisible and place the tile at a random corner.

I guess I should at least be happy I got one Hulkbuster cover out of this. Now I only have 11 more to go! At the rate I'm going, that means I'll be done in five years.

Nick441234

elusive wrote:

I guess I should at least be happy I got one Hulkbuster cover out of this. Now I only have 11 more to go! At the rate I'm going, that means I'll be done in five years.

I'm in your boat with HB. I've been so looking forward to using him but he continues to sit there with just 7 covers (3/1/3). I'll no doubt finish him when the games moved on and he's about as useful as a 1*.

Pylgrim

elusive wrote:

I'm starting to wonder if the devs are starting to listen to the people with the 5* rosters who say this game is too easy. All I know is that I'm on Round 5 and I've effectively been locked out of winning any of the nodes thanks to not having a single good 4* to field (I have a ton of championed 3*, at least) - I forgot the Black Widow node had two waves and was like, "Thank god I barely managed to kill them!" right before it switched over to the next wave and immediately destroyed the tattered remnants of my team. The combination of Nova and Iron Fist kept playing off of each other and stacking strike tiles on top of attack tiles, not to mention Invisible Woman ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS, finds a way to generate enough AP to turn invisible and place the tile at a random corner.

I guess I should at least be happy I got one Hulkbuster cover out of this. Now I only have 11 more to go! At the rate I'm going, that means I'll be done in five years.

You are a 3* player and got one of the better 4* covers in the game for 1-2 days of light playing. I'd say the reward is commensurate with your effort and the station of your roster. Right now seeing the 4* and 5* players being able to get higher rewards than you may seem grating, but when you eventually become a 4* player yourself, you surely will think that your 2-year hard-earned roster deserves to get better rewards than the people playing a year or less can get.

Bryan Lambert

Pylgrim wrote:

Who's saying that the goal of the game is to feel superior to anybody? I am talking about "FUN" as well. Do you know game theory? Progression and a sense of achievement are big components of what makes games fun. If you play an RPG where characters don't level up and neither do the challenges, leaving you to simply slay harmless slimes for countless hours, you'll get bored pretty fast. Similarly, if you play a multiplayer game in which a character that you have grown and trained for days and days faces against a character that achieved the same power by simply inserting a cheat code, you'll feel pretty cheated of your sense of achievement, eliminating your fun.

While I agree with you in general, the people saying the goal of the game is to feel superior to other players is Demiurge. It's my least favorite aspect of the game, but it's the foundation the game is based on.

It's interesting comparing two years in MPQ, where even the story mode of the game is competitive, to two months in Avengers Alliance 2, a game where even the PvP is non-competitive. The feel is completely different. AA2 puts me in complete control of my own progression. If I want to progress more, I can play more. If I want to progress in specific ways, I can go after specific goals. If I want a challenge, I can play the tougher modes for bigger rewards. If I need to grind some stuff out, I can take high-level characters into low-level nodes and knock it out quickly.

In MPQ, players have almost no control over their progression. The only way to get the things you need to move forward is to play the three things they give you to play, whether you're happy with the structure or not, whether you're happy with the difficulty or not, whether you even can or not.

And on top of that, their metrics are based on what people DO. But if players have to do things they don't enjoy to progress, then there's no actuall connection between how players play, and how well players do, and how much they actually enjoyed doing it. So there's no pressure on them to make the game more enjoyable by decreasing randomness, decoupling difficuty from grinding, or creating tiered gameplay.

Dragon_Nexus

atomzed wrote:

I do think that this is scaled appropriately.

How can it possibly be scalled appropriately when I'm fighting two waves of level 300 mobs to have another crack at the level 200 Captain America?

HxiiiK

Dragon_Nexus wrote:

atomzed wrote:

I do think that this is scaled appropriately.

How can it possibly be scalled appropriately when I'm fighting two waves of level 300 mobs to have another crack at the level 200 Captain America?

This

Shouldn't the BOSS be the main event? Seems like I'm having way more trouble with his goons

tizian2015

Pylgrim wrote:

elusive wrote:

I'm starting to wonder if the devs are starting to listen to the people with the 5* rosters who say this game is too easy. All I know is that I'm on Round 5 and I've effectively been locked out of winning any of the nodes thanks to not having a single good 4* to field (I have a ton of championed 3*, at least) - I forgot the Black Widow node had two waves and was like, "Thank god I barely managed to kill them!" right before it switched over to the next wave and immediately destroyed the tattered remnants of my team. The combination of Nova and Iron Fist kept playing off of each other and stacking strike tiles on top of attack tiles, not to mention Invisible Woman ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS, finds a way to generate enough AP to turn invisible and place the tile at a random corner.

I guess I should at least be happy I got one Hulkbuster cover out of this. Now I only have 11 more to go! At the rate I'm going, that means I'll be done in five years.

You are a 3* player and got one of the better 4* covers in the game for 1-2 days of light playing. I'd say the reward is commensurate with your effort and the station of your roster. Right now seeing the 4* and 5* players being able to get higher rewards than you may seem grating, but when you eventually become a 4* player yourself, you surely will think that your 2-year hard-earned roster deserves to get better rewards than the people playing a year or less can get.

Excuse me, i understand your position, but for a 3* player in the moment, i have the feeling the 4* land is simply blocked. In PVE placement rewards go to 2* rosters (easy entrance in the game to get some money from them, before they realize, for what they paid for) or rosters far away from me. In PVP i hit a wall of 4*s at 300-600 (earlier since the new system). So i have rarely opportunity to get a 4*cover. This event gave me 4*covers, venom yellow, fury purple, two hb. Im grateful for that, but i not have many other sources for 4* covers and to get a shot for 4* land i need them urgently. The other source for 4* covers are champion rewards. But for this i need iso, much iso. And with DDQ every day and lightning rounds and other activities i get maybe 5k-10k a day. I have to champion about 25 3*s to get a proper 4* source, 2.5m iso. This means 250 days minimum to get in 4* land. But in the moment i will be in 4* land the meta will changed to 5* game. I think a "newer player" should have a chance to get there.

mazerat

The problem is that other games have easy missions you can grind until you're able to do medium missions until you're able to do hard missions. MPQ just has missions. If I can't do them--I have to find something else to do. I've spent about 36 hours just not doing PvE because I can't clear the CW nodes. Now I'm going to spend another four days not playing PvE because they made Gauntlet ridiculous.

I want to play this game, but the devs won't let me. And it they keep not letting me, I'm going to look for other games to play. That's not a threat, that's just me needing things to fill time.

Partyof5

Why don't they have different difficulty levels so the 5* whales can be challenged and the 2-3* people won't be shut out? It's not a hard concept to implement.

In Civil War, my casual alliance has come to an almost complete halt since the scaling leaped to 200+ leveled opponents. We reached level 5 in IM, but now even at level 2 in Cap the difficulty is impossible for most of us. People aren't even trying now because it became too discouraging. If we are still in round 2 working to 3 we shouldn't have to face the same difficulty as we are seeing in our pursuit of round 6.

DrStrange-616

As one of my alliance mates mentioned, imagine being a newb and being lured into MPQ by the Civil War marketing stuff. If they managed to figure out what they were even supposed to do, they would have been scaled out within a day. Then they're presented with the gauntlet. I know I'd be confused and discouraged.

Ctenko

Ok. So for just as a thought. I can beat round 8 Cap. We're on Round 6 I think for Iron man, because Not enough people can beat round eight Cap in my alliance. We're Casual I knew I was not getting a Five Star, and I thank them for letting me get 5 4Star covers, and Three LT's. Feels good.

But who in the hell thought that a node requiring Storm, (who I will give you is one of the better Two Stars, and a Middling Three star. And you can pick on me for only having her be level 222 for this event.) Should have a level 411 Rulk and 411 Ares? And it's not like I have a max roster. My highest level Person on Cap's side is a 267 Switch. 10 Green onslaught from Ares ONE SHOTS HER. And the best part, It's a wave fight? I BEAT 411 Rulk Ares and Mr Fantastic. (Thanks Reed for only level 410!)

Then it has two Five stars in the next wave, and a Black widow who can deal literally lethal damage to my entire roster in One green shot.

Why Demiurge? Why?

KGB

Partyof5 wrote:

Why don't they have different difficulty levels so the 5* whales can be challenged and the 2-3* people won't be shut out? It's not a hard concept to implement.

In Civil War, my casual alliance has come to an almost complete halt since the scaling leaped to 200+ leveled opponents. We reached level 5 in IM, but now even at level 2 in Cap the difficulty is impossible for most of us. People aren't even trying now because it became too discouraging. If we are still in round 2 working to 3 we shouldn't have to face the same difficulty as we are seeing in our pursuit of round 6.

Exactly the problem my casual alliance has run into. The alliances who played (or were able to play) like crazy on day 1 got vastly easier times with all the non-boss nodes because scaling went up by day rather than my level.

The scaling of the nodes should go up by reward level achieved so that it's the same for round 4 nodes whether you hit them on day 1 or day 4.

Also it would be nice if they adjusted the boss fight too. I'm fine with it going up 50 levels per round. But players should have the option to select a lower leveled boss for lower points. I have ZERO chance to beat a L400 Captain/Iron Man but I can beat a L300 one. So why not let me chose to fight a L300 (or lower) for the amount of points a 300 boss gives. At least then I'll feel like I am contributing something to the effort (yes I suicide BagMan, Juggs and other 1*s just to get a few points and have access to the nodes but that feels like feeding Christians to the lions and is disheartening to players). And before someone worries that beating a L100 boss over and over might give max progression rewards, recall that early bosses only give 5K vs 45K points so it would take insane grinding to make up the difference in points.

KGB

CaptainFreaky

"David wrote:

Moore"]Hi all,

I checked with the dev team regarding 'Civil War' event scaling and the official word is:

"The difficulty scaling is intended. We will look at how everyone does and adjust accordingly."

Yeah - I'm guessing the second run will be even more of a grind and the scaling will start sooner and harsher - cause ya know, that's what typically happens when they look at the data... (except maybe after Galactus 1 which is the exception not the rule)

It will all depend on how many alliances finish round 8 (ours did yay!) and whether that's too many for demi-grinch to allow to get a precious...single...5* cover (cause ya know, that's so game breaking...)

_RiO_

"David wrote:

Moore"]Hi all,

I checked with the dev team regarding 'Civil War' event scaling and the official word is:

"The difficulty scaling is intended. We will look at how everyone does and adjust accordingly."

Days since massive screw-up on developer's end: 0
Days since last arrogant non-apology from developer: 0
Days until transaction freeze on my wallet is lifted: 180

Let's try again in half a year, ok David?



"As intended" could probably start joining the gallery of illustrious memes such as "this too shall pass" and "also; money" by now...

Ctenko

CaptainFreaky wrote:

"David wrote:

Moore"]Hi all,

I checked with the dev team regarding 'Civil War' event scaling and the official word is:

"The difficulty scaling is intended. We will look at how everyone does and adjust accordingly."

Yeah - I'm guessing the second run will be even more of a grind and the scaling will start sooner and harsher - cause ya know, that's what typically happens when they look at the data... (except maybe after Galactus 1 which is the exception not the rule)

It will all depend on how many alliances finish round 8 (ours did yay!) and whether that's too many for demi-grinch to allow to get a precious...single...5* cover (cause ya know, that's so game breaking...)

I think they altered Galactus, because they had twenty something Gripe threads, Ice said the dumbest thing ever, and I got a post up to like 70 reputation that essentially threatened to scorched earth the game, through bad publicity and word of mouth.

And I was not the only person who had that idea unless something was fixed.

But I was the sensible and generally calm person about that.

_RiO_

Ctenko wrote:

threatened to scorched earth the game, through bad publicity and word of mouth.

It's sad to admit, but that's not a strange reaction at all to the antics of this developer. Money is, after all, the great and only motivator for this company. So any direct threat to income will force them to take a matter seriously.

The same holds true for this particular screw-up. Consider how well a screw-up of this magnitude in a special movie tie-in event would sit with Marvel. And consider the potential effect an open letter to Marvel's community management might have. It's their IP and their movie that's getting the negative association, after all.