'Boosted' Characters Rebalancing Post-Champions



  • SnowcaTT
    SnowcaTT Posts: 3,486 Chairperson of the Boards
    Good thing there is that PVP that is 3* only (no 5* allowed, likely no 4* allowed and certainly no 4* boosted) - that way the 3*'s can slowly transition to 4*.

    Oh wait, that isn't a thing still, somehow.
  • Jam_Adams
    Jam_Adams Posts: 486 Mover and Shaker
    STOPTHIS wrote:
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]Demiurge Quote:
      “While we were developing Champions, we took a close look at the balance of characters above their max level,
    particularly the fact that 1-stars, 2-stars, and 3-stars could be significantly stronger than 4-stars and 5-stars of the same level.

    Funny how this isn't a problem when it comes to PvE. You guys are a-OK with Juggernaut taking out an entire 3*/4* team.

    I can't help but feel there's an intentional slow down on progression.

    The 3* level is now harder to get into for 2* transitioners thanks to a tinykitty redesigned DDQ. And it's harder to get out of now that you can't do as well in PvP thank to this nerf. Not to mention championing has pushed back the final progression for the level.

    The 4* level now can't be bought as easily. So, you need luck when it comes to covers or drop a high amount of CmdPts for one cover. Meanwhile, characters are still being released rather fast, but their drop rate isn't becoming any better. The amount of 4* that can be earned in PvE is now limited with the vault change. Championing extends this level as well.

    The 5* level requires an ungodly amount of CmdPts for one cover or tons of luck.

    And of course the iso cap is stopping all levels of players from getting anywhere with any kind of speed.

    This is tinykitty is deflating my confidence in the game.
    username is relevant.
  • Twysta
    Twysta Posts: 1,597 Chairperson of the Boards
    And even with this, CS wouldn't let me trade in my dupe IM40's for covers :/#
  • DFiPL
    DFiPL Posts: 2,405 Chairperson of the Boards
    I don't know if this is the single most tone-deaf red post in the history of these forums, but it's got to be a contender.

    Waiting seven weeks to say "working as advertised" on something people have been complaining loudly about? Not two, three, four...SEVEN weeks?

  • Uthgarprime
    Uthgarprime Posts: 202 Tile Toppler
    Come on, I keep telling you guys, for everything little positive thing, we have to get our teeth kicked in with a big negative. Its a punishment for not buying more ISO-8 in the store.
    Surely you have figured out that this companies sole purpose is to punish players for not playing exaclty the way they want you too. Oh wait that isn't how all other companies do it. Lol you are suppose to lose.
  • mouser
    mouser Posts: 529 Critical Contributor
    A boosted character should be equal or be close enough to a similar character from the next tier. Otherwise what's the point of encouraging broad and deep rosters to take advantage of the weekly boosts?
  • Twysta
    Twysta Posts: 1,597 Chairperson of the Boards
  • kensterr
    kensterr Posts: 1,277 Chairperson of the Boards
    I think a possible reason for this change is that the ones spending cash in the game right now are the people with 4*s and 5*s... therefore more changes and more stuff to keep them spending, and spending, and spending. I just found out from a chat today that a previously F2P player has been whaling lately so that he can bully and snipe people with his 5* roster.
  • TheOncomingStorm
    TheOncomingStorm Posts: 489 Mover and Shaker
    edited February 2016
    I would salute such an admission if it were not so overdue. I honestly don't get the clandestine mindset of mpq (including not accrediting the Demiurge quote to an actual person). Ignoring significant problems or concerns do not make them go away. Such actions only serve to further the players' perception that the development team suffers from severe apathy. Nothing is more shady than a game always trying to drastically change the game play under the nose of the players. In any other area of life, except mpq of course, people refer to this as duping or trying to get over on others.

    Also, I understand mpq has more important items on their daily agendas than responding to player issues, especially those that continue to resurface. However, I would reply to this in two ways.

    1. While these issues are repetitive to management, there is turnover on the playerbase.

    2. I would hope there is a balance between mpq being overly active on the forum and their current amount of interaction.

    Lastly, while I greatly appreciate mpq seeking to gather information from players, it is alarming that some of the problems seen (and continously reported by players) are unable to be recognized by the development team.

    That said, I still feel mpq overall has done an outstanding job of reinvigorating the game. It is truly an outstanding feat. I continue to look forward to when the placement structure reflects the 4* meta so I can start investing a lot more time into the game again. I'm jealous of all my friends rocking the game. I long to rejoin them when the game return on time invested comes back in line (as it was during the old 3* meta).
  • hesjingixen
    hesjingixen Posts: 215 Tile Toppler
    First off, let me say that I am primarily a PvE player, so I'm not overly familiar with whatever problems they thought Championing might cause in the PvP world. Here's what ticks me off about this change. For literally, years now, we've had to fight ridiculously scaled 2* villains, such as Ares, Bullseye, and Moonstar. Now, when we might actually be able to get this kind of scaling for ourselves, they decide it's too strong and take it away. Apparently it wasn't a problem for these guys to use and abuse us in PvE for years, but as soon as they might be used against PvP-ers, suddenly it's a problem. Wth?

    Honestly, I think I'm probably more annoyed that it took them this long to acknowledge the problem, and when they finally did, it was kinda *shrug* "Yeah, so, your champions are still gunna kinda suck."

    Additionally, as someone said in the first few posts, referencing a post with TONS of examples of how this change "impacted your game experience negatively" and then asking for people to post on it, as if you didn't even read the post you referenced.....that's like a dumb college student that plagiarizes a paper and then lists the paper as a reference in their bibliography. Come on guys.
  • scottee
    scottee Posts: 1,609 Chairperson of the Boards
    Eh, things are still better than when there were no weekly boosts.
  • Chrono_Tata
    Chrono_Tata Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
    The most insulting thing about this change is that Championing was advertised as a way to make lower-star characters more useful in higher-tier play, but actually weekly boosts were already doing a decent job of that. This change that has been pushed along with champions have negated that, and now we're being forced to spend extra time and effort to bring our 2- and 3-star characters back to the power levels they were pre-change.

    At the very least, can we get an official levelling chart from the devs so we can figure out what levels we should bring our champions top for them to be competitive?
  • Pylgrim
    Pylgrim Posts: 2,303 Chairperson of the Boards
    scottee wrote:
    Eh, things are still better than when there were no weekly boosts.

    Only nominally. For some characters the "gains" in damage from those additional 74 levels are literally a few hundreds. Like literally the damage from two-three 3-matches. Okay, okay, make it four 3-matches since their match damage was also nerfed.
  • Akari
    Akari Posts: 492 Mover and Shaker
    D3 giveth, and D3 taketh away.

    And as to specific instances where this change hurt people, you implemented it in the middle of a Heroic PvE. You know, the PvEs that everyone hate because they have to fight with their generally underleveled, less used heroes? And then you NERFED all those heroes? Yeah. Thanks. It was bad enough that I had none of the specified heroes at max level. It was far, far worse that every one I did have suddenly did 25-30% less damage, and the enemies sure didn't change any.
  • Xenoberyll
    Xenoberyll Posts: 647 Critical Contributor
    edited February 2016
    You're supposed to lose.

    I think regarded in this light, a lot of the people posting "thank you" posts want to take back the praise and slap the devs for that nerf instead.
    Pylgrim wrote:
    ...what are we supposed to do? Wait for a year or so until we gather 100 covers of our 3*s and they return to their former power level ...

    A lot of the whales have their champions maxed out already, why are you taking so long? oh...we forgot that the average player has to earn their covers from events....oops.

    I love the part where you get a prize and you don't just have to sell it but add it to make your champs better. But I feel like this is just another way that strengthens the P2W aspect of this game now that the whales have not only a pair of 5s but also a champ maxed 3star feature with it. Separating the peasants from the paying "elite"
  • goozen
    goozen Posts: 16
    This change makes the gap between maxed 3* to usable 4* even greater. Even if one was to average 20k iso per day (at least 2+ hours of playing) you are looking at 10 days to max a single 4*. Not that you would have the covers of course, the vast amount of 4* means that the only ones over 50% completed are the three old (and weaker) ones.
  • _Ryu_
    _Ryu_ Posts: 149
    Just to be polite, thanks for letting us know what we are dealing with since power NERF.

    Two thing that still disappoint me are that:

    - This statement should have come much sooner, many user complainig about the NERF since day one without clear communication about it... actually after reworking the posts, there was not a single statement about the NERF after it happend. There were alot of things changed since beginning of MPQ, most for the better, some for worse and many are lying in the eye of the observer, but such a magnificant change with this poor amount of communication is... sad.

    - The NERF came with championing together, so everybody was exciting about the new champion feature (I love it, it makes all the covers much more valuable and giving us this great payback system for invested covers is amazing), but of the other side the power of our roster was taken away in the shadows without knowing "why". That nearly nullifies this great implement to the game and again it makes me... sad.

    At least one wish, could all the character threads be updated with the new championed max lvl "Tile Damage" and new max lvl 3,4,5 "Power Outcome" for example

    Bullseye (Classic) icon_bullseye.png
    3 Star Rarity (Rare)
    At Max Level: HP: 7565 Tile Damage: 12/11/13/79/70/70/4.5x

    At Max Champion Level: HP ??? base Tile damage:???


    Level Upgrades
    Level 2: Deals 327 damage.
    Level 3: Deals 415 damage.
    Level 4: Deals 585 damage.
    Level 5: Deals 924 damage.
    Max Level
    Level 3: Converts up to 2 tiles and deals 1320 damage.
    Level 4: Converts up to 2 tiles and deals 1859 damage.
    Level 5: Converts up to 2 tiles and deals 2936 damage.

    Max Champion Level
    Level 3: Converts up to 2 tiles and deals ??? damage.
    Level 4: Converts up to 2 tiles and deals ??? damage.
    Level 5: Converts up to 2 tiles and deals ??? damage.

    That would give me at lest the motivation to go on knowing what the goal is. Many thanks in advance if this could be done.
  • Marine8394
    Marine8394 Posts: 301 Mover and Shaker
    Now I get it! Now I know why the AI plays the way it does. Place helpful tile on board. Destroy helpful tile immediately. Create helpful feature for low tier characters. Immediately cripple said feature. Yup makes sense now. icon_eek.gificon_lol.gif
  • Phaserhawk
    Phaserhawk Posts: 2,676 Chairperson of the Boards
    I'm actually okay with this. A fully championed 3* should only be as strong as a 270 4*. Where boosting comes in is where a 3* should start to scale like a 4*. So if PvP adds 100 levels my 266 3 * that's now 366 should be doing dmg similar to a 366 4*

    Now my one and only issue is this.


    If you are going to do this than PvP's should now be 4*. Rewards should be handing out 5*'s as top spot now with 4*'s for top 100 and alliance and for god sake ISO flow needs to be set at a 4* basis. DDQ should be changed to 4* every 2-3 days.

    You CANNOT!!!!! Continue to set the standard of the game at a 3* level and then not make them the gold standard. This is where we move to, 4*'s are the gold standard so for pete's sake do it and shift the focus there. Don't force the game down the 3* road and then make them worthless in the end
  • madsalad
    madsalad Posts: 815 Critical Contributor
    The way I pictured Championing was:

    2* fully champ would be almost as strong as a fully covered, maxed (but not Championed) 3*
    3* fully champ would be 10% stronger than a fully covered and maxed (but not Championed) 4*
    4* fully champ would be 20% stronger than a fully covered and maxed (but not Championed) 5*

    Given the time and effort it takes to champ a 2* vs. 3* vs. 4*, each tier should grow in strength toward the next tier. It is a lot easier and quicker to champ a 2* so their strength should only grow to right under the 3* level. Making them useful toward the 3* transition as they can then go (somewhat) toe-to-toe with other 3* characters.

    Obviously, it takes longer to champion at the 3* level so their strength when fully championed should take them above the 4* level, again, so they can compete toe-to-toe with maxed 4*s to aide in the 4* transition.

    Etc... etc...

    instead, you just knocked everyone down a few pegs and gave a false sense of accomplishment/power increase thinking (I guess) that no one would notice. I noticed on day one (during a PVE where Human Torch was required and boosted). The day before Championing, HT was doing like 7-8K per Fireball. Something stupid. After Championing (like 4 covers or so), he was doing like 5K.

    You guys need to go back to the drawing board and figure out the power curve correctly. These changes were supposedly meant to aide in transitions between tiers. They have actually set them back.