Coming Soon: Character Updates!

ballingbees

Dartmaster01 wrote:

It's funny how hard they pushed woman's month.......I mean how hard they pushed women in women's month.

They could buff Susan and Squirrel for good measure

Unknown

ballingbees wrote:

Dartmaster01 wrote:

It's funny how hard they pushed woman's month.......I mean how hard they pushed women in women's month.

They could buff Susan and Squirrel for good measure

Why buff invisible woman when you can give an xman her power and nerf 4*thor?

Their master plan to get us to use moonstone....

Polares

raisinbman wrote:

ballingbees wrote:

Dartmaster01 wrote:

It's funny how hard they pushed woman's month.......I mean how hard they pushed women in women's month.

They could buff Susan and Squirrel for good measure

Why buff invisible woman when you can give an xman her power and nerf 4*thor?

Their master plan to get us to use moonstone....

Well it is just another way of making us remember this is a men's world

PS: In the end it is even sad that in the women's month they nerf two of their best female chars, a reminder that women are still really far away from equality

Unknown

Actually the change to Magneto's purple could help Moonstone, the more red on the board, the stronger her red is!

Unknown

taloncarde wrote:

Actually the change to Magneto's purple could help Moonstone, the more red on the board, the stronger her red is!

True but I actually see this as more of a bad thing. I don't carry her on my roster and I don't know many people who do. I usually only see her as an enemy in PVE and often use mags with cstorm, especially at higher levels...

Unknown

I still use Moonstone, but mostly when bored and clearing some PVE battles or just to do something different. I was mostly kidding about the comment a few posts up where they implied that all these changes was to make her more powerful

Unknown

I'm actually leveling my Moonstone to 94 right now.

It doesn't have anything to do with any of the changes; it was just I hit the point that I was finishing maxing my 2*s, and it was down to her and Bagman. And Bagman is next.

JVReal

Polares wrote:

raisinbman wrote:

ballingbees wrote:

Dartmaster01 wrote:

It's funny how hard they pushed woman's month.......I mean how hard they pushed women in women's month.

They could buff Susan and Squirrel for good measure

Why buff invisible woman when you can give an xman her power and nerf 4*thor?

Their master plan to get us to use moonstone....

Well it is just another way of making us remember this is a men's world

PS: In the end it is even sad that in the women's month they nerf two of their best female chars, a reminder that women are still really far away from equality

If Wolverine was a chick, she'd be nerfed by now too...

teknofyl

I am SO PUMPED about these updates!

Arimis_Thorn

orionpeace wrote:

rawfsu wrote:

I hate Mags is getting nerfed, especially with the nice combo of either Cap and Hawkeye. Oh well, tis life. If there's a possibility of endless turns with Mystique, the devs have no other choice.

Oh, they have choices.

And because they are choosing to make these changes, many people are upset.

They could make different choices. They could tweak and then test, rather than this ham-fisted approach. They choose not to.

They also choose to operate on a character system with very little to no testing or long-term planning.

The above sentiment is 100% un-provable and will only rile you up unnecessarily. I worked in Games for 15 years, (though never for D3). The idea that there was "little to no testing" is absurd. The idea that other folks like to trot out that the Devs "clearly don't play the game" is absurd.

I'm no fan of the nerfs, but in reality they Devs are the ones closest to the Game. F2P games like this live and die by data analysis. They have ALL the information. We have some and then some anecdotal evidence, but the plural of Anecdote is not Data. They know what's coming down the road and have a better idea of how the pre-nerf characters could completely break what they are up to.

I'm not saying you have to like the nerfs. I'm not saying you have to keep playing. If the game now sucks for you, by all means vote with your wallet and your time and walk away. But unless you have first hand knowledge of the internal workings of the Devs, creating a toxic narrative doesn't help anyone.

NorthernPolarity

Arimis Thorn wrote:

orionpeace wrote:

rawfsu wrote:

I hate Mags is getting nerfed, especially with the nice combo of either Cap and Hawkeye. Oh well, tis life. If there's a possibility of endless turns with Mystique, the devs have no other choice.

Oh, they have choices.

And because they are choosing to make these changes, many people are upset.

They could make different choices. They could tweak and then test, rather than this ham-fisted approach. They choose not to.

They also choose to operate on a character system with very little to no testing or long-term planning.

The above sentiment is 100% un-provable and will only rile you up unnecessarily. I worked in Games for 15 years, (though never for D3). The idea that there was "little to no testing" is absurd. The idea that other folks like to trot out that the Devs "clearly don't play the game" is absurd.

I'm no fan of the nerfs, but in reality they Devs are the ones closest to the Game. F2P games like this live and die by data analysis. They have ALL the information. We have some and then some anecdotal evidence, but the plural of Anecdote is not Data. They know what's coming down the road and have a better idea of how the pre-nerf characters could completely break what they are up to.

I'm not saying you have to like the nerfs. I'm not saying you have to keep playing. If the game now sucks for you, by all means vote with your wallet and your time and walk away. But unless you have first hand knowledge of the internal workings of the Devs, creating a toxic narrative doesn't help anyone.

It's not so much "they don't play the game" as much as it is "they don't play the game at a high level". It's a common thing for developers to be out of touch with the products that they work on (as I've seeing interning at a fb game company), and it's not unreasonable to say that they don't play the game competitively when the only person that is actually in a top 100 alliance is IceIX afaik. There obviously is a lot of testing in the sense that they need to make sure that the abilities work, but whether or not there is informed balance testing that reflects the experiences of the veteran players is a whole other thing. Their testing would catch bugs and technical issues with the abilities, but as we've seen from instances such as Iron Fist where any veteran could see a mile away that his purple was OP, they clearly don't have a great handle on balance testing.

Unknown

Arimis Thorn wrote:

orionpeace wrote:

rawfsu wrote:

I hate Mags is getting nerfed, especially with the nice combo of either Cap and Hawkeye. Oh well, tis life. If there's a possibility of endless turns with Mystique, the devs have no other choice.

Oh, they have choices.

And because they are choosing to make these changes, many people are upset.

They could make different choices. They could tweak and then test, rather than this ham-fisted approach. They choose not to.

They also choose to operate on a character system with very little to no testing or long-term planning.

The above sentiment is 100% un-provable and will only rile you up unnecessarily. I worked in Games for 15 years, (though never for D3). The idea that there was "little to no testing" is absurd. The idea that other folks like to trot out that the Devs "clearly don't play the game" is absurd.

I'm no fan of the nerfs, but in reality they Devs are the ones closest to the Game. F2P games like this live and die by data analysis. They have ALL the information. We have some and then some anecdotal evidence, but the plural of Anecdote is not Data. They know what's coming down the road and have a better idea of how the pre-nerf characters could completely break what they are up to.

I'm not saying you have to like the nerfs. I'm not saying you have to keep playing. If the game now sucks for you, by all means vote with your wallet and your time and walk away. But unless you have first hand knowledge of the internal workings of the Devs, creating a toxic narrative doesn't help anyone.

They don't know balance. Why are you defending D3 when X-Force is living and breathing? Why was sentry OP for so long if they knew what was up? Why would you ever ever ever release beast? What the **** is up with the ragnarok "buffs"? If they cared about game health so much they'd fix characters before releasing them(both good and bad).

Instead their focus is on vomiting out as many characters as possible.


And no, this isn't specific to D3. There are plenty of billion/trillion dollar game series out there with obvious game/balance flaws(Pokemon is a great example - lots of characters very little thought about balance)

Unknown

aesthetocyst wrote:

I for one, am very happy with the (latest) Rags tweak ... even if it does make him a PITA in PVE. This new version finally all clicks together, and he works like a nuttier, weaker version of 3*Thor, exactly as he should. In terms of game mechanics and theming, it's great. Having had a 550 for like a year, I'm looking forward to completing him.

Now if only they would tweak the art, to fix those ludicrous pirate pants. Yikes!

On the contrary, new Rag is much less annoying. No more infinite red green chaining. Now I can safely ignore him and there is no additional risk of magic AI cascades. Plus, now the AI may save blue rather than nuke you with Daken every few turns.

Arimis_Thorn

They don't know balance. Why are you defending D3 when X-Force is living and breathing? Why was sentry OP for so long if they knew what was up? Why would you ever ever ever release beast? What the **** is up with the ragnarok "buffs"? If they cared about game health so much they'd fix characters before releasing them(both good and bad).

Instead their focus is on vomiting out as many characters as possible.


And no, this isn't specific to D3. There are plenty of billion/trillion dollar game series out there with obvious game/balance flaws(Pokemon is a great example - lots of characters very little thought about balance)

Yeah, Balance is a bear, especially with this many moving parts, and there are a lot of game with many, many more. Tweak one thing and it causes something to break way down the line somewhere you never would have guessed. And as you say, D3 is definitely not alone.

NorthernPolarity

aesthetocyst wrote:

I for one, am very happy with the (latest) Rags tweak ... even if it does make him a PITA in PVE. This new version finally all clicks together, and he works like a nuttier, weaker version of 3*Thor, exactly as he should. In terms of game mechanics and theming, it's great. Having had a 550 for like a year, I'm looking forward to completing him.

Now if only they would tweak the art, to fix those ludicrous pirate pants. Yikes!

I actually think the rework was really poorly done thematically. Ignoring the abysmal blue ability, Rags as a nuttier, weaker thor shouldn't have a green that is as expensive as Thor. The original Rags design was supposed to be a faster version of Thor, why does his green cost 14 then? I think something like 9 AP: 1.3k team damage + destroys 2 columns would have been a better ability thematically. As is all anyone sees in his green is a direct comparison to Thor's green, which makes him feel too similar to Thor.

Unknown

Since Rag seems to be the topic of the day, I'll give my .02:

All they did was make it easier to fight him in PVE.

- D3 seems to have trouble making big-cost greens that can actually stand toe to toe with Thor or Old-Sentry(Insert obligatory X-Force reference here), and instead we get big-cost greens like Doc Ock's and new Rag's. I think the icing on the cake for me with this move was when Rag killed himself with it(sometimes, his allies). It its current form, it costs too much, does too little, and is literally suicidal(in both cost and use). This skill is either overcosted or not powerful enough.

Compared to the Old Green - What the old green really was a roulette spin - it could lead to something, but more often than not it didn't. It seems like Old Rag was supposed to be some sort of...3*Juggernaut. THe old green was definitely much more useful.

My suggestion: Reading the description of the old and new powers, I do think there's a way to fix it quite easily -

Godlike Power: 8-10AP
Ragnarok exhibits his godlike power, destroying the entire board(at 5 covers). (If this is high damage) This also harms his allies for half of what it harms his enemies.

The team damage part is only necessary if it's a big damage move. Otherwise, no team damage. If D3 wants the no-fun version of this, they can just keep special tiles while the rest of the board dies.

Red wasn't really changed, so I won't discuss it too much. It could probably have used a damage buff. This move, however, does ironically does give him more synergy with another 'changed' hero, 2*Mag.

I'm not really sure what the devs were thinking here. It isn't a true heal, maybe they were scared of creating 3-star-cyborg-little-brother-of-4-star-Thor(in terms of power)? I can't really know what to think of this but I think at LEAST it should be true heal. Maybe shake the board, do something besides fake-heal.

IamTheDanger

I wonder if it would be possible to combine MN Mags new blue and Cyclops yellow. When you use Mags blue, you place a 3 blue tiles, then have 5 TU tiles convert to red. This would take away some the random effect that everyone just loves , and give players a bit more control. Not much, but enough that there can still be a strategic value. After all, random events and powers in a strategy game just don't work IMO. How can a player make an effective game plan when they don't know what to expect? At least with converting TU, the player can look at the board, watch the TU, and based on their placement, use Mag's blue ability at the most opportune time allowing players to actually use strategy in a strategy game.

darkmagearcanis

JCTthe3rd81 wrote:

I wonder if it would be possible to combine MN Mags new blue and Cyclops yellow. When you use Mags blue, you place a 3 blue tiles, then have 5 TU tiles convert to red. This would take away some the random effect that everyone just loves , and give players a bit more control. Not much, but enough that there can still be a strategic value. After all, random events and powers in a strategy game just don't work IMO. How can a player make an effective game plan when they don't know what to expect? At least with converting TU, the player can look at the board, watch the TU, and based on their placement, use Mag's blue ability at the most opportune time allowing players to actually use strategy in a strategy game.

There is a pre-nerf video in the video thread that Jamie posted using 2* mags, cyclops and 4Thor. But I would like to see a post-nerf vid do the same thing.

Unknown

RIP Magstorm

mjh

why are these not live yet?