**** Star-Lord (Legendary Outlaw) ****
Comments
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Yeah, for just 13 yellow you can cast a Thor yellow for 8ap!Phaserhawk wrote:Vhailorx wrote:Phaserhawk wrote:Yeah, that's what I said, boost red/yellow, boost black/green, then boost all so you would start R,Y,G,Black with +6 AP everything else 3. I understand what you are saying, but if you match yellow first and then use it next turn you can now cast X-Force. Then match green, you just saved yourself 2 AP that way, again assuming the tile survives, which you have a 75% chance it does.
Everyone gets so caught up in damage, damage, damage they forget to see the bigger picture. Yes the skill is on a CD tile so it has it's weakness, but 7 AP that if survives saves you 2AP on your skills is just absurdly good. Serioulsy 2nd turn X-Force!!! Purple I'm up in the air on, because if it does massive damage, that's a much better way to ensure the death of an opponent rather than slowing them up in red. Where I see him being used is opposite 4hor, because she wants blue and red, but also accelerates yellow, and Star Lord will just allow 4hor to lock the game and win faster than she already does, how is that a bad thing?
I don't get your point phaserhawk. you seem to be pointing out that boosting ap going into a match is great. That's true!
But why should i care that by max boosting ap and then casting starlord's yellow, I can cast xforce on round 2? If I max boost green, and then make one green match, I can already cast xforce on round 2. And I have an entire second character slot to use (with 4* Thor!).
The point is you have a tile that is reducing every other skill on your team by 2 AP. Giving X-Force may not be the best example but this skill is awesome, and if multiple's can be cast, hoo boy.0 -
Unless the ability description is misleading (or it changes at high levels) multiple tiles won't stack. It says you get the 1 AP cost shift whenever “at least one” of his tiles is on the board. That means the game is just checking whether there are any With Me/Oldest Trick tiles, and if there are, it modifies the costs of powers accordingly. It doesn't care if there's one tile or forty.0
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I don't think multiple yellows will reduce it more since the wording is 'while at least one CD exists...' If they're cumulative this qualifier would not be necessary, since having them stack would be the normal assumption. For example, Nightstalker steals some AP per turn, and we expect two of them to steal twice even though there's no additional text on Nightstalker that says whether this works or not. It doesn't need to because Nightstalker stacking with itself is the assumed behavior.0
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I'd say the potential is pretty awesome if we had a lot more low-AP cost characters and abilities, as they are the ones that most benefit from AP reduction. Perhaps some are in the pipeline as well.
If they update Ragnarok, he definitely has potential if they keep his AP costs low.
If the CD tile is unaffected by Magstique combo, then it could futher guarantee that combo looping. (I forget, does it change friendly CD tiles?)
4AP ALOTT is nice, 4AP Fireballs are nice. Too bad SL already has a red.
(It's really unfortunate if black is not included, otherwise we would have seen a ton more post-jab crosses).0 -
Tiles of any kind are pretty useless in the mag/mq combo. Too many match 4s erasing tiles. Same reason the combo doesn't care about bullseye.Trisul wrote:I'd say the potential is pretty awesome if we had a lot more low-AP cost characters and abilities, as they are the ones that most benefit from AP reduction. Perhaps some are in the pipeline as well.
If they update Ragnarok, he definitely has potential if they keep his AP costs low.
If the CD tile is unaffected by Magstique combo, then it could futher guarantee that combo looping. (I forget, does it change friendly CD tiles?)
4AP ALOTT is nice, 4AP Fireballs are nice. Too bad SL already has a red.
(It's really unfortunate if black is not included, otherwise we would have seen a ton more post-jab crosses).0 -
Good eye, now I don't want his cover anymore.0
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I don't get why there are so many complaining about Star-Lord...actually, I don't understand why anyone complains about ANY character...
For the most part, if you play the game because you like the match three aspect of it, then who you use is irrelevant.
If you play because you like the collection aspect, then you want every character, despite any flaws they might have (Bag-Man, Yelena anyone?).
If you're main reason for playing is because you are ultra competitive and want/need to win all the time, then you're using whoever's at the top of the mountain anyway (4hor/X-Force currently), so any and all new characters are pointless unless they overtake whoever is at the top and will only be used when essential in PvE.
And if you play for fun, then just have fun and stop finding all the negatives!
Personally, as far as Star-Lord is concerned, I applaud D3 for trying something different. I hope he is at least fun to use.0 -
People are just speculating. It's fun!rbdragon wrote:I don't get why there are so many complaining about Star-Lord...actually, I don't understand why anyone complains about ANY character...
For the most part, if you play the game because you like the match three aspect of it, then who you use is irrelevant.
If you play because you like the collection aspect, then you want every character, despite any flaws they might have (Bag-Man, Yelena anyone?).
If you're main reason for playing is because you are ultra competitive and want/need to win all the time, then you're using whoever's at the top of the mountain anyway (4hor/X-Force currently), so any and all new characters are pointless unless they overtake whoever is at the top and will only be used when essential in PvE.
And if you play for fun, then just have fun and stop finding all the negatives!
Personally, as far as Star-Lord is concerned, I applaud D3 for trying something different. I hope he is at least fun to use.0 -
this is my $0.02 then I'll be done.
Sentry could win games by himself
X-Force while powerful can't always win games by himself but still pretty godly
4hor can win games by herself
Sentry + Hood = insanity, especially with the 3/5/5 Hood build. Hood took an already super powerful character who could win by himself, and all but eliminated the chances of him not winning by himself with Intimidation and AP steal.
Star Lord + 4hor will be very similar. 4hor will still do all the dirty work, but Star Lord's yellow when coupled with 4hor will further eliminate chance. If you boost AP, accelerate into Power Surge, match a red and Smite you are down to one dude. You are pretty much at that point matching blue and or red and if you can't you grab yellow. That's where Star Lord comes in, instead of using yellow Striking distance which usually doesn't finish off guys, you can use Star Lord's, thus reducing the amount of red and blue you need to keep going. Smite for 8, Power Surge for 7. It smooths out your combo by making it less risky, because you don't have to spend as much time searching for enough red and blue you can kill faster and thus win faster.
If you boost to where you have 6R, 6Y, 6B, 6P, 3Blk, 3G you now have more options. If blue doesn't present it self, you can match yellow, then cast Star Lord's skill, you now have in reality this.
8R, 0Y, 8B, 8P, 5Blk, 5G. You match blue and go power surge. Without Star Lord you would be out of blue. With Star Lord, essentially you have 2 in the bank, only needing 7 which is 2 blue charged plus a regular, then rinse are repeat.
Will Star Lord/4hor be faster than X-Force/4hor? That's going to be one I would love to play test. For me I tend to rely on 4hor to win me games and X-Force is there as both a deterrant and backup threat. So if I'm already relying primarily on 4hor, and Star Lord lets her work faster than X-Force, and as we know it's all about speed in high end PvP then why not run him. I don't see Star Lord being any slower than X-Force, if not faster. He'll have the same amount of hit points, and a nice thing is if you make him a higher priority than 4hor, on defense if someone Surgically Strikes they steal purple and not green or red, so unless they are running their own Star Lord or the feature character has purple, you can put a hamper on other X-Force/4hor teams.0 -
Pretty sure SL will be more control-oriented than speed-oriented, since ultimately he is a support. Which... for his character, sounds about right.
He doesn't look THAT good now, but will get better:
- If the PvP meta becomes slower and more favorable to control. (probably not anytime soon without something drastic, like the removal of boosts or GT/XF nerfs)
- High tier characters with super cheap abilities are released. (very possible)0 -
Phaserhawk wrote:Yeah, that's what I said, boost red/yellow, boost black/green, then boost all so you would start R,Y,G,Black with +6 AP everything else 3. I understand what you are saying, but if you match yellow first and then use it next turn you can now cast X-Force. Then match green, you just saved yourself 2 AP that way, again assuming the tile survives, which you have a 75% chance it does.
Everyone gets so caught up in damage, damage, damage they forget to see the bigger picture. Yes the skill is on a CD tile so it has it's weakness, but 7 AP that if survives saves you 2AP on your skills is just absurdly good. Serioulsy 2nd turn X-Force!!! Purple I'm up in the air on, because if it does massive damage, that's a much better way to ensure the death of an opponent rather than slowing them up in red. Where I see him being used is opposite 4hor, because she wants blue and red, but also accelerates yellow, and Star Lord will just allow 4hor to lock the game and win faster than she already does, how is that a bad thing?
2nd turn X-Force is already a thing with Boost All Boost
/ 
match , use XF. The only thing Star Lord does is let you also match 
to the same effect.
If you happen into 7 yellow then fine, boost away. If you go out of your way to get 7 yellow then any savings you see was actually time wasted collecting yellow.
Let's say you run Thor/Star Lord with Boost All,
/ 
, and 
/ You take a yellow first, then blue, then use Star Lord 
and Thor 
for 7 (even tho you had 9). Now you take 5 red with a charge tile and on turn 4 you Smite for 11,384 damage leaving you with 3 red AP. OR, you take a match, use Thor , take the 5 AP red with charge tile, use Smite for 11,384 on turn 3 leaving you with 1 red AP.
He doesn't actually accelerate ****, since it takes turns to get the yellow to do the accelerating. Add on top of that the "if it survives" thing and it's a terrible ability with very limited usefulness.
I will give you that Captain America plus Star Lord might be crazy good. But that's about the only scenario I can think of that is half decent. And, again, it shoots his "godly" red all to hell because you can't use it.0 -
rbdragon wrote:I don't get why there are so many complaining about Star-Lord...actually, I don't understand why anyone complains about ANY character...
For the most part, if you play the game because you like the match three aspect of it, then who you use is irrelevant.
If you play because you like the collection aspect, then you want every character, despite any flaws they might have (Bag-Man, Yelena anyone?).
If you're main reason for playing is because you are ultra competitive and want/need to win all the time, then you're using whoever's at the top of the mountain anyway (4hor/X-Force currently), so any and all new characters are pointless unless they overtake whoever is at the top and will only be used when essential in PvE.
And if you play for fun, then just have fun and stop finding all the negatives!
Personally, as far as Star-Lord is concerned, I applaud D3 for trying something different. I hope he is at least fun to use.
We should never complain about anything?
Why are you even here then?
Since you just will take whatever D3 gives you, nothing matters to you - you would put ISO, HP, and covers on Yelena as readily as Blade.
We complain because we care. We don't want tinykitty characters.
Just like in real life.0 -
Lerysh wrote:Phaserhawk wrote:Yeah, that's what I said, boost red/yellow, boost black/green, then boost all so you would start R,Y,G,Black with +6 AP everything else 3. I understand what you are saying, but if you match yellow first and then use it next turn you can now cast X-Force. Then match green, you just saved yourself 2 AP that way, again assuming the tile survives, which you have a 75% chance it does.
Everyone gets so caught up in damage, damage, damage they forget to see the bigger picture. Yes the skill is on a CD tile so it has it's weakness, but 7 AP that if survives saves you 2AP on your skills is just absurdly good. Serioulsy 2nd turn X-Force!!! Purple I'm up in the air on, because if it does massive damage, that's a much better way to ensure the death of an opponent rather than slowing them up in red. Where I see him being used is opposite 4hor, because she wants blue and red, but also accelerates yellow, and Star Lord will just allow 4hor to lock the game and win faster than she already does, how is that a bad thing?
2nd turn X-Force is already a thing with Boost All Boost / match , use XF. The only thing Star Lord does is let you also match to the same effect.
If you happen into 7 yellow then fine, boost away. If you go out of your way to get 7 yellow then any savings you see was actually time wasted collecting yellow.
Let's say you run Thor/Star Lord with Boost All, / , and / You take a yellow first, then blue, then use Star Lord and Thor for 7 (even tho you had 9). Now you take 5 red with a charge tile and on turn 4 you Smite for 11,384 damage leaving you with 3 red AP. OR, you take a match, use Thor , take the 5 AP red with charge tile, use Smite for 11,384 on turn 3 leaving you with 1 red AP.
He doesn't actually accelerate ****, since it takes turns to get the yellow to do the accelerating. Add on top of that the "if it survives" thing and it's a terrible ability with very limited usefulness.
I will give you that Captain America plus Star Lord might be crazy good. But that's about the only scenario I can think of that is half decent.
So having a guy that reduces your red and blue costs by 2, where you stunned one guy and blew up the 2nd, still leaving a 3rd, and now not having to collect as much AP to lock them down, I'm at a loss how that doesn't accelerate things.
Take last tournament you have X-Force/4hor/SG. You stun 4hor, kill X-Force, still have SG. An X-Force isnt' going to take her down, meanwhile 4hor is coming off of lockdown. You hopefully can match enough red or blue to get the second cast off again targeting 4hor then finish up the game in a few turns.
So lets play law of averages. Lets always assume 9 of each color, and 4hor's skills always divided the charged tiles evenly amongst the colors. At that point every yellow, red, or blue match will average you 5.67 tiles.
You Boost
6 6 6 6 3 3
X-Force/4hor.
1.Match Blue
2.Power Surge match red. 11.67 6 0 3 3
3.Smite, say you match blue 1.67 6 5.67 3 3
You are looking at at least 2 more red matches and 1 more blue at this point
Star Lord/4hor
1.Match Yellow
2.Everyone with me, you are at 6 2 6 6 3 3 , you match blue.
3.Power Surge and match red. you are at 11.67 2 2 6 3 3
4.Smite you are at 3.67 2 2 6 3 3 you only need 1 more red match at this point to knock someone off and 1 blue.
Does the first method allow Power Surge Smite to go off faster, hell yes. Does Star Lord, allow it to go off faster a second time, yes it does. The risk the tile poses of getting destroyed with 2 guys locked up or dead and the other soon to be mitigates the risk.
X-Force/4hor boosting will get the combo off in theory faster, although you could just do the same thing with Star Lord and match blue as well, the big issue is that his yellow allows you to finish them off quicker. So your "accelerate ****" comment is way off in the course of the match.
It's no different than Sentry/Hood you didn't need Hood to make the combo go off, but Hood made the combo go off more reliably and lessened the chance of the strike tile getting destroyed. Star Lord will lower the chance of you not getting the required matches to finish them off with Smite/Power Surge0 -
Ok I get it, Star-Lord is being released, can you disable the pop up already? I don't need or want this in my face every time I return to the game0
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It's ok keep reminding 95% of the player base that one of the current hottest marvel heroes will be out of their grasp, i dare you.0
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Phaserhawk wrote:Lerysh wrote:Phaserhawk wrote:Yeah, that's what I said, boost red/yellow, boost black/green, then boost all so you would start R,Y,G,Black with +6 AP everything else 3. I understand what you are saying, but if you match yellow first and then use it next turn you can now cast X-Force. Then match green, you just saved yourself 2 AP that way, again assuming the tile survives, which you have a 75% chance it does.
Everyone gets so caught up in damage, damage, damage they forget to see the bigger picture. Yes the skill is on a CD tile so it has it's weakness, but 7 AP that if survives saves you 2AP on your skills is just absurdly good. Serioulsy 2nd turn X-Force!!! Purple I'm up in the air on, because if it does massive damage, that's a much better way to ensure the death of an opponent rather than slowing them up in red. Where I see him being used is opposite 4hor, because she wants blue and red, but also accelerates yellow, and Star Lord will just allow 4hor to lock the game and win faster than she already does, how is that a bad thing?
2nd turn X-Force is already a thing with Boost All Boost / match , use XF. The only thing Star Lord does is let you also match to the same effect.
If you happen into 7 yellow then fine, boost away. If you go out of your way to get 7 yellow then any savings you see was actually time wasted collecting yellow.
Let's say you run Thor/Star Lord with Boost All, / , and / You take a yellow first, then blue, then use Star Lord and Thor for 7 (even tho you had 9). Now you take 5 red with a charge tile and on turn 4 you Smite for 11,384 damage leaving you with 3 red AP. OR, you take a match, use Thor , take the 5 AP red with charge tile, use Smite for 11,384 on turn 3 leaving you with 1 red AP.
He doesn't actually accelerate ****, since it takes turns to get the yellow to do the accelerating. Add on top of that the "if it survives" thing and it's a terrible ability with very limited usefulness.
I will give you that Captain America plus Star Lord might be crazy good. But that's about the only scenario I can think of that is half decent.
So having a guy that reduces your red and blue costs by 2, where you stunned one guy and blew up the 2nd, still leaving a 3rd, and now not having to collect as much AP to lock them down, I'm at a loss how that doesn't accelerate things.
Take last tournament you have X-Force/4hor/SG. You stun 4hor, kill X-Force, still have SG. An X-Force isnt' going to take her down, meanwhile 4hor is coming off of lockdown. You hopefully can match enough red or blue to get the second cast off again targeting 4hor then finish up the game in a few turns.
So lets play law of averages. Lets always assume 9 of each color, and 4hor's skills always divided the charged tiles evenly amongst the colors. At that point every yellow, red, or blue match will average you 5.67 tiles.
You Boost
6 6 6 6 3 3
X-Force/4hor.
1.Match Blue
2.Power Surge match red. 11.67 6 0 3 3
3.Smite, say you match blue 1.67 6 5.67 3 3
You are looking at at least 2 more red matches and 1 more blue at this point
Star Lord/4hor
1.Match Yellow
2.Everyone with me, you are at 6 2 6 6 3 3 , you match blue.
3.Power Surge and match red. you are at 11.67 2 2 6 3 3
4.Smite you are at 3.67 2 2 6 3 3 you only need 1 more red match at this point to knock someone off and 1 blue.
Does the first method allow Power Surge Smite to go off faster, hell yes. Does Star Lord, allow it to go off faster a second time, yes it does. The risk the tile poses of getting destroyed with 2 guys locked up or dead and the other soon to be mitigates the risk.
X-Force/4hor boosting will get the combo off in theory faster, although you could just do the same thing with Star Lord and match blue as well, the big issue is that his yellow allows you to finish them off quicker. So your "accelerate ****" comment is way off in the course of the match.
It's no different than Sentry/Hood you didn't need Hood to make the combo go off, but Hood made the combo go off more reliably and lessened the chance of the strike tile getting destroyed. Star Lord will lower the chance of you not getting the required matches to finish them off with Smite/Power Surge
Remember that the cd tile only lasts 3 turns, so you don't have all the time in the world to get this off. Your post is also clearly biased because your X-Force scenario doesn't take into account X-Force doing anything. If the name of the game is just to get off Surge -> Smite, then sure, Starlord is better. However, a lot of the time the board is just all purple / Teamups, and theres no red / blue matches in sight. Starlord would do pretty much nothing here: you can't use his red with Smite so all he has is his purple and yellow. Yellow sucks by itself, purple is decent but hardly game winning. X-Force, on the other hand, shakes up the board with surgical or X-Force, and gets you what you need in order to surge / smite them.
Purely considering the duos XF / LadyThor vs LadyThor / Starlord, I'm inclined to say that Starlord does better in situations where you probably didn't need help winning to begin with, whereas X-Force helps more in unfavorable situations that you actually need your secondary character to do something useful with his abilities. Of course, it is possible that Starlord is better depending on the featured: let's say that mohawk is featured: X-Force becomes useless so Starlord automatically becomes better. However, It's a hard sell that he's going to be better at assisting LadyThor than Loki, since illusions and mischief carry pretty hard as well.
I think he's going to end up more playable than some of the other 4*s *cough* elektra *cough*, and probably ends up settling somewhere around Fury tier: very good and better than most 3*s, but not good enough to dethrone XF / Ladythor, or even dethrone the existing supports such as Loki / Cage / Hood (he's better standalone than any of these three, but Loki is just too damn good with LadyThor).0 -
hottest is right. du looks like he stepped off a One Direction soundstage
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All these match discounts forget that you matched yellow to get there, so discount fades away. ALso doesn't work on Fastball (no black)Phaserhawk wrote:Yeah, so if say he does end up reducing costs by 2 which I think is likely. Then all of a sudden you boost red/yellow AP, green/black AP, and all AP. One yellow match and now you have all you need to cast X-Force. One red match and now all their skills cost 2 more. Hmm, 2nd turn X-Force will sure sound good to me. There is a reason why in Magic the Gathering, skills that reduced overall cost were so valued, because they accelerated your play, sure they could blow it up, but you already got that jump start you needed. But lets say for arguements sake that it is only one. Here are the Character/skills most affected by his yellow.
(PvP playable)
Devil Dino--his red and yellow are now 2 match abilities
Fury--Demolition just became a 3 match ability
4hor--Smite became a 3 match ability
Blade--KYEC just became 3 match ability
Capt Marvel--Photonic just became a 2 match ability
Colossus--Fastball just became 3 match
Doom--Diabolic 3 match now
C.Mags--Blue is now 3 matchPhaserhawk wrote:And his red screws over these guys (only going over PvP playable)
Patch--Beserker Rage
Thor--Thunder Stirke
Deadpool--red
Captain America--blue
Black Panther--yellow and black
X-Force--yellow
Fury--yellow and purple
4hor--yellow and blue
Does not affect purple. Also doesn't "screw them" so much as delay the inevitable screw you you had coming. If Patch has 9 green and you fire of SL Red, you now have 3 (maybe 4) turns to kill Patch dead or that green is still coming at ya.0 -
They kinda screwed themselves when they kept hood's blue as it was. You can't do better than stealing a bunch of ap for free as soon as turn 2. I mean short countdown tiles are a giant step down from even aggressive recon, but I guess they're trying a workaround.
Any of you using luke cages black? Much worse than it seems on paper, right? And that one lasts 4 turns.0 -
In the interview I saw a blurb about how you can use Thunderclap for 4 AP so I'm guessing it's not going beyond -2 AP. I'm just not seeing the point of an ability on principle that costs more than its benefit. The only way it can work out is if you accidentally got a bunch of yellow, but if you're trying to match yellow to fire this ability you'd be coming out behind since you could've matched something else instead. Let's just say your team is X Force/Thor/Star-Lord, in a generic situation you'd be better off matching black, red, blue, or green over yellow. Sure, if you happen to have exactly 4 yellow AP and you have exactly 8 red AP and 7 blue AP you'll rather have the yellow instead, but that's a fairly contrived situation. If you're trying to recreate this situation with AP+3 all boosts, you can usually just flat out overpower something with a straight race to Surgical Strike or Power Surge.0
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