Dark Avengers: Heroic - Sept. 25 - Oct 1

Unknown

Since all the DA themed events have similar scaling and enemy compositino what makes them enjoyable or not is who you get to use. Patch or Thor going 1on3 isn't very fun, but it's better than Psylocke going 1on3. Occasionally you even have a heroic roster where all 3 of your 3* can actually do something and those usually turn out to be more enjoyable to play. It's true scaling eventually fixes all that but it's still not very fun to wipe on a node the first time because you Psylocke is your best choice to take Headbutts as opposed to Patch, even if eventually that node is going to be high enough to take out Patch, but at least you won a few games before that happened.

CrookedKnight

I guess I'm in the sweet spot for character levels, because this sub doesn't seem much harder than the first to me. The last fight is a definite "nope," but not much more so than the first round's Ares fight. Hood/Muscle/Thug is tough but beatable if the board doesn't hate me (two clears so far).

Unknown

hey guys, new here on the forum.

I don't have the best roster for this event, but I am doing okay with Psylocke, OBW and Thor. Did a lot worse last heroic with much better characters.

squirrel1120

2 wipes on hoodlums inc., and no successful clear of it last go round. It's insidious. One villain, 2 goonss, no problem right? Riiiight... except when you get boards that are just right to keep you from firing off powers that help take him down. Then threaten -> twin pistols -> cascade -> 2 dead characters before I could hit the retreat button. I don't think my eyes have gone that wide in a while.

The worst part about using every hpack is being short on them next clear.

dkffiv

squirrel1120 wrote:

2 wipes on hoodlums inc., and no successful clear of it last go round. It's insidious. One villain, 2 goonss, no problem right? Riiiight... except when you get boards that are just right to keep you from firing off powers that help take him down. Then threaten -> twin pistols -> cascade -> 2 dead characters before I could hit the retreat button. I don't think my eyes have gone that wide in a while.

The worst part about using every hpack is being short on them next clear.

I've managed to beat Hoodlums without too much luck involved a few times now, you need a fast kill on the Hood. I would not recommend Thor if you can avoid it, he's way too slow. Psylocke/Torch/OBW has been my go to, down Hood quickly then try to gather blue to make sure the goons don't beat you down too hard. In previous PvEs I was forced to PvP to restock my team ups. Bringing a 2* Storm blue or 2* Magneto purple can be a life saver against these goons.

I really miss Hood/OBW/(Punisher) for these team setups. Hood saps the hell out of Maggia goons and powers Twin Pistols / OBW to make sure tiles never go off.

Unknown

Lyrian wrote:

jozier wrote:

You are a complete tinykitty **** and full of tinykitty.

Thank you for the kind words, Jozier. You've really touched my heart this afternoon.

AFAIK, I'm still on a veteran-community initiated moratorium in regard to specifically calling out strategies or describing how the latest round of Calvinball works, if I figure it out before someone else does. Hence, I am trying to get others to realize what is occurring through indirect means. Forum games seem to be the "in" thing at the moment, so I attempted to go that route. Unlike Nonce's quiz, I seriously doubt in any capacity that I will be sent any HP for figuring out Calvinball first for this event.

Not that it matters so much this time. Unless the final main nodes are thrown from a different Calvinball curve from what is already being presented (which I severely doubt based on half the nodes already being unlocked and past precedents on how this event works), the devs have finally come up with a system that can't be gamed and generally punishes everyone relatively equally (with 3 and 4*s rosters punished a bit harder because of how scaling works). I'd highly expect this system to be the new norm for PvE going forward.

And for the popcorn comments, I'll just say this... It is a crying shame that the most loved and upvoted changes to the game in a long time is the primary source of future misery in PvE. But then again, Demiurge has a significant past track record of slowly implementing mass changes as piecemeal implementations that seem innocent and even beneficial independent of each other, but only show their true colors when all brought together as a complete package, which is what is occurring in this PvE.

Wat

lukewin

If you don't have 3 of the usable characters, can you still play DA: H?

Unknown

lukewin wrote:

If you don't have 3 of the usable characters, can you still play DA: H?

Yes, but you'll only be able to use the one or two you have.

Kolence

I believe you can play any event as long as you have at least one required character. I remember playing my first pvp (DA only) with just Moonstone. It was good for health packs.

Different matter is how hard it would be, especially in a heroic... Would you mind sharing your experience with us, later?

lukewin

I just noticed in the leaderboards, a name I recognized that finished one ahead of me in another event, where I didn't think they had the roster to score that high. In Facilities, they only have 2 characters, a Lvl 91 Thor 355 and a Lvl 42 Hawkeye 214 and has managed to score 8873 points so far. I've got 6 characters, and got 9787.

Unknown

lukewin wrote:

I just noticed in the leaderboards, a name I recognized that finished one ahead of me in another event, where I didn't think they had the roster to score that high. In Facilities, they only have 2 characters, a Lvl 91 Thor 355 and a Lvl 42 Hawkeye 214 and has managed to score 8873 points so far. I've got 6 characters, and got 9787.

This comes up a lot.

Certain people who only have a handful of the required characters are probably facing VERY low-leveled opponents. As a result, they're having a very easy time of things, and able to clear nodes easier than the rest of us. There are always a handful of people like that on the top of the leaderboards.

Ryz-aus

Ben Grimm wrote:

lukewin wrote:

I just noticed in the leaderboards, a name I recognized that finished one ahead of me in another event, where I didn't think they had the roster to score that high. In Facilities, they only have 2 characters, a Lvl 91 Thor 355 and a Lvl 42 Hawkeye 214 and has managed to score 8873 points so far. I've got 6 characters, and got 9787.

This comes up a lot.

Certain people who only have a handful of the required characters are probably facing VERY low-leveled opponents. As a result, they're having a very easy time of things, and able to clear nodes easier than the rest of us. There are always a handful of people like that on the top of the leaderboards.

Some people even build their rosters to take advantage of it - grumpysmurf on Fun Police looks like he's mastered this.

Unknown

MattyMattMatt wrote:

Lyrian wrote:

jozier wrote:

You are a complete tinykitty **** and full of tinykitty.

Thank you for the kind words, Jozier. You've really touched my heart this afternoon.

AFAIK, I'm still on a veteran-community initiated moratorium in regard to specifically calling out strategies or describing how the latest round of Calvinball works, if I figure it out before someone else does. Hence, I am trying to get others to realize what is occurring through indirect means. Forum games seem to be the "in" thing at the moment, so I attempted to go that route. Unlike Nonce's quiz, I seriously doubt in any capacity that I will be sent any HP for figuring out Calvinball first for this event.

Not that it matters so much this time. Unless the final main nodes are thrown from a different Calvinball curve from what is already being presented (which I severely doubt based on half the nodes already being unlocked and past precedents on how this event works), the devs have finally come up with a system that can't be gamed and generally punishes everyone relatively equally (with 3 and 4*s rosters punished a bit harder because of how scaling works). I'd highly expect this system to be the new norm for PvE going forward.

And for the popcorn comments, I'll just say this... It is a crying shame that the most loved and upvoted changes to the game in a long time is the primary source of future misery in PvE. But then again, Demiurge has a significant past track record of slowly implementing mass changes as piecemeal implementations that seem innocent and even beneficial independent of each other, but only show their true colors when all brought together as a complete package, which is what is occurring in this PvE.

Wat

The PvP-focused crew is starting to figure out what is going on here. See the thread "What is going on with PvP MMR and 94/166 opponent selection?" in General.

Now, that brings the question around to "How does this effect PvE"?

Well, from that thread the immediate answer is that the roster-based scaling system from the Gauntlet is in full effect here and determines a player's node levels (for the Essentials and Hard tracks). Node levels are based off the level of the highest, unboosted character that is playable in this event (likely Psylocke, HT, or Torch) [big thank you to Chaos League for the data and the confirmation of this important clarification].

Now, if one thinks about where this is going.... didn't most complain that the rewards weren't worth the effort of such hard nodes? I do very much believe so.

So... anyone remember how the last iteration of this PvE was handled? If I do remember correctly, all of the nodes were one-time nodes for a fixed number of points.

One-time nodes with a fixed number of points at a high level of very difficulty.... hrmm... didn't we see those in a very popular event last weekend using the same roster based difficulty system?

There's a new character being released in this event.... everyone ready to play the Gauntlet Finale on the main map with a real prize on the line this time? (Everyone did take advantage of the extra day of dry-run practice the devs gave, right???)

GrumpySmurf1002

Ryz-aus wrote:

Ben Grimm wrote:

lukewin wrote:

I just noticed in the leaderboards, a name I recognized that finished one ahead of me in another event, where I didn't think they had the roster to score that high. In Facilities, they only have 2 characters, a Lvl 91 Thor 355 and a Lvl 42 Hawkeye 214 and has managed to score 8873 points so far. I've got 6 characters, and got 9787.

This comes up a lot.

Certain people who only have a handful of the required characters are probably facing VERY low-leveled opponents. As a result, they're having a very easy time of things, and able to clear nodes easier than the rest of us. There are always a handful of people like that on the top of the leaderboards.

Some people even build their rosters to take advantage of it - grumpysmurf on Fun Police looks like he's mastered this.

I have just about every character worth having (roster is 45 deep). All I've done is refuse to level anyone above 94 until I'm ready for all of them that I want to get there. (I could probably go to 100 or even 110, but 94 is more fun). When the devs have basically said that scaling is based on that, there's little reason for me to have a single 166 screw over the rest of my roster. Yes, it does help, but I still get scaled out fairly quickly.

The hard nodes for me right now are Getaway plan ( ) is level 156. I can beat it but not repeatedly in a pass (so final clear is one and done at best). + is 137, which is beatable if I can get Hood down quick, otherwise it's a death sentence.

In the more general sense though, yes, I've built my roster for PvE, and have had good success with it.

NorthernPolarity

Lyrian wrote:

MattyMattMatt wrote:

Lyrian wrote:

jozier wrote:

You are a complete tinykitty **** and full of tinykitty.

Thank you for the kind words, Jozier. You've really touched my heart this afternoon.

AFAIK, I'm still on a veteran-community initiated moratorium in regard to specifically calling out strategies or describing how the latest round of Calvinball works, if I figure it out before someone else does. Hence, I am trying to get others to realize what is occurring through indirect means. Forum games seem to be the "in" thing at the moment, so I attempted to go that route. Unlike Nonce's quiz, I seriously doubt in any capacity that I will be sent any HP for figuring out Calvinball first for this event.

Not that it matters so much this time. Unless the final main nodes are thrown from a different Calvinball curve from what is already being presented (which I severely doubt based on half the nodes already being unlocked and past precedents on how this event works), the devs have finally come up with a system that can't be gamed and generally punishes everyone relatively equally (with 3 and 4*s rosters punished a bit harder because of how scaling works). I'd highly expect this system to be the new norm for PvE going forward.

And for the popcorn comments, I'll just say this... It is a crying shame that the most loved and upvoted changes to the game in a long time is the primary source of future misery in PvE. But then again, Demiurge has a significant past track record of slowly implementing mass changes as piecemeal implementations that seem innocent and even beneficial independent of each other, but only show their true colors when all brought together as a complete package, which is what is occurring in this PvE.

Wat

The PvP-focused crew is starting to figure out what is going on here. See the thread "What is going on with PvP MMR and 94/166 opponent selection?" in General.

Now, that brings the question around to "How does this effect PvE"?

Well, from that thread the immediate answer is that the roster-based scaling system from the Gauntlet is in full effect here and determines a player's node levels (for the Essentials and Hard tracks). Node levels are based off the level of the highest, unboosted character that is playable in this event (likely Psylocke, HT, or Torch) [big thank you to Chaos League for the data and the confirmation of this important clarification].

Now, if one thinks about where this is going.... didn't most complain that the rewards weren't worth the effort of such hard nodes? I do very much believe so.

So... anyone remember how the last iteration of this PvE was handled? If I do remember correctly, all of the nodes were one-time nodes for a fixed number of points.

One-time nodes with a fixed number of points at a high level of very difficulty.... hrmm... didn't we see those in a very popular event last weekend using the same roster based difficulty system?

There's a new character being released in this event.... everyone ready to play the Gauntlet Finale on the main map with a real prize on the line this time? (Everyone did take advantage of the extra day of dry-run practice the devs gave, right???)

I guess other people will have to do the complaining because I don't see what the problem is here. In the last PvE sub, the scoreboard was relatively static throughout the last hour because people couldn't just mindlessly C. Mags blue grind the nodes down to 1. You had to pick and choose which nodes to focus, and I believe that resulted in less variance and grinding overall, which I'm perfectly fine with. Then again, I have a 135 Psy, 166 HT, and a X/X/1 IM40 so my roster is near optimal for the event. I don't really see any reason for the veterans to be angry about this since it benefits us: 2->3* transition players are probably screwed though.

CrookedKnight

That depends on the roster. If they had the good/bad luck to push Psylocke or HT or IM40 into the high three digits while leaving the rest of their roster behind they're screwed, but if everybody is in the same level range then you're fine. Hell, I'd imagine you're better off with everyone at 94-ish, because then the whole slate of eligible characters is usable, 2*s included.

scottee

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

I have just about every character worth having (roster is 45 deep). All I've done is refuse to level anyone above 94 until I'm ready for all of them that I want to get there. (I could probably go to 100 or even 110, but 94 is more fun). When the devs have basically said that scaling is based on that, there's little reason for me to have a single 166 screw over the rest of my roster. Yes, it does help, but I still get scaled out fairly quickly.

The hard nodes for me right now are Getaway plan ( ) is level 156. I can beat it but not repeatedly in a pass (so final clear is one and done at best). + is 137, which is beatable if I can get Hood down quick, otherwise it's a death sentence.

In the more general sense though, yes, I've built my roster for PvE, and have had good success with it.

I'd hate to burst your bubble, but that strategy doesn't work as well as you think it does. I've always thought trying to manipulate roster levels and MMR is dumb.

I have a level 200 X-Force and multiple 166's. My Getaway Plan is at 174, and Hood is at 155.

So by underleveling your roster, you're having to fight well above your weight class. And I'm fighting around or below my weight class.

I have no problem making a full clear, and am doing so with minimal health packs.

TLDR: Manipulating your roster levels to face lower level enemies doesn't work.

Sandmaker

scottee wrote:

I'd hate to burst your bubble, but that strategy doesn't work as well as you think it does. I've always thought trying to manipulate roster levels and MMR is dumb.

I have a level 200 X-Force and multiple 166's. My Getaway Plan is at 174, and Hood is at 155.

So by underleveling your roster, you're having to fight well above your weight class. And I'm fighting around or below my weight class.

I have no problem making a full clear, and am doing so with minimal health packs.

TLDR: Manipulating your roster levels to face lower level enemies doesn't work.

What level is your Psylocke, HT, IM40? Or I guess more directly, what levels are the top 5 highest characters you can use this event?

CrookedKnight

He's fourth in the bracket, and nobody-over-94 me is third, so I can say with some confidence that it doesn't work as badly as you think it does.

scottee

CrookedKnight wrote:

He's fourth in the bracket, and nobody-over-94 me is third, so I can say with some confidence that it doesn't work as badly as you think it does.

I'm not saying it doesn't lower the levels you face. I'm saying, is it worth it? Are you facing enemies that are 72 levels lower than I am?

Using Psylocke is 166, Human Torch 83, OBW 94. (unbuffed levels) Mixing maxed MStorm if it's a goon only node.

Just made a complete clear using 1 health pack.

People can do whatever they want. Myself, I'd just rather have as strong a roster as possible. Instead of leveling evenly, as soon as I had the covers to max a 3*, I maxed as soon as possible. I continue to pick a 3* I have fully covered and focus iso to max them. It's worked out pretty well for me.