Mark_Tedin said: blue has always been a stronger color in mtg ... since the beginning of the game ...and in MTGPQ this could not be different... the timer was the biggest NERF in the game history so far ...all my decks were damaged... we do not need more NERF ...
On top of that, I think (correct me if I'm wrong) we're advocating bring Blue in line with the power of the other colors, and then take out the timer.
The timer is a Band-Aid on a broken bone. It'll help sometimes, but most of the time, it'll be ineffective
wickedwitch74 said: Once rotation occurs (Fall)
jimpark said: You can nerf cards as you wish but i can promise you that will:1) increase the amount of wasted time spent in game. 2) everything will feel "meh" and boring like the severe lack of chase cards in RNA. If your going nerf things but keep the grind the same then peace out to this game.
jimpark said: -Buffs before nerfs. -Convenience issues (deck slots, visual aid) before buffs/nerfs. -Card bugs before convenience issues.-Program bugs before Card bugs.**you can add and rearrange a few of those as you please but feel like thats the ladder.
Brakkis said: wickedwitch74 said: Once rotation occurs (Fall) Rotation doesn't happen then. It occurs when the 9th set enters.XLN RIX DOMM19GRNRNAWAR-Unknown--Unknown- (Rotation happens here - XLN, RIX, DOM, and M19 leave)War of the Spark comes out May 3rd. Most sets in paper are 3 to 5 months apart. So the set after that will hit sometime between August and October. That puts the 9th set, when rotation will occur, sometime between November and March of 2020.
Just as a random aside, #8 is going to be Core 2020.
Still no idea on 9, obviously.
OmegaLolrus said: Brakkis said: wickedwitch74 said: Once rotation occurs (Fall) Rotation doesn't happen then. It occurs when the 9th set enters.XLN RIX DOMM19GRNRNAWAR-Unknown--Unknown- (Rotation happens here - XLN, RIX, DOM, and M19 leave)War of the Spark comes out May 3rd. Most sets in paper are 3 to 5 months apart. So the set after that will hit sometime between August and October. That puts the 9th set, when rotation will occur, sometime between November and March of 2020. Just as a random aside, #8 is going to be Core 2020.Still no idea on 9, obviously.
Brakkis said: No. You literally remove its ability to target the player. ....Then, buff reds already existing burn spells. A lot.
starfall said: https://whatsinstandard.com has the following to say:IxalanRivals of IxalanDominariaCore Set 2019Exiting Standard Q4 2019
Stormcrow said: Brakkis said: No. You literally remove its ability to target the player. ....Then, buff reds already existing burn spells. A lot. In this scenario, what player would ever use your nerfed Beacon Bolt, for anything, ever?
starfall said:https://whatsinstandard.com has the following to say:IxalanRivals of IxalanDominariaCore Set 2019Exiting Standard Q4 2019
Stormcrow said: You're missing the point: all blue/red walkers would have access to the buffed red spells for direct creature damage. That accounts for most of the Beacon Bolt decks in the wild. And all blue walkers would still have access to blue bounce. If Beacon Bolt were purely for creature control there are already better options out there, and if you buffed red spells there'd be even more better options out there. You'd nerf it into just being yet another uncommon nobody ever uses.
starfall said: Beacon Bolt might get enough of a nerf simply from BSZ getting nerfed. People hate nerfs, so the nerf hammer should only target the absolutely extreme cases of brokenness on the first pass, and I don't think BB is in that bracket.
It seems like BB only becomes a huge issue when combined with BSZ firing off a couple times.
Without BSZ, in my experience (since I don't have BSZ), it can take most of the game to get it up to doing enough damage to seriously worry a Planeswalker.
Brakkis said:And once again, the argument of not nerfing something because it's super effective and everyone is using it, is not a valid reason to not nerf it. It's an uncommon direct damage spell that is currently better than any mythic direct damage spell in the game. If it gets "nerfed" to what it was designed for in the first place, then so be it. It's an uncommon. It shouldn't make mythic and rare burn spells look like jokes.
Stormcrow said: Brakkis said:And once again, the argument of not nerfing something because it's super effective and everyone is using it, is not a valid reason to not nerf it. It's an uncommon direct damage spell that is currently better than any mythic direct damage spell in the game. If it gets "nerfed" to what it was designed for in the first place, then so be it. It's an uncommon. It shouldn't make mythic and rare burn spells look like jokes. "We need to nerf it because it's too strong for an uncommon" is a completely different argument than "we need to nerf it because it breaks the color pie". Counterpoint: instead of nerfing the only successful burn-deck archetype (and yes, Beacon Bolt is only especially good in decks designed to maximize it) this game has ever had into nonexistence, why not just bump the card up to mythic status. Problem solved!
Brakkis said:Also, Beacon Bolt can get just as high outside of BSZ. Run it with Underrealm Lich and Surveil cards.
Brakkis said: wickedwitch74 said: Once rotation occurs (Fall) Rotation doesn't happen then. It occurs when the 9th set enters.XLN RIX DOMM19GRNRNAWAR-Unknown--Unknown- (Rotation happens here - XLN, RIX, DOM, and M19 leave)War of the Spark comes out May 3rd. Most sets in paper are 3 to 5 months apart. So the set after that will hit sometime between August and October. That puts the 9th set, when rotation will occur, sometime between November and March of 2020.Then push each of those dates back between 1 to 2 months for it to be brought to PQ.None of the broken stuff in standard is leaving standard until next spring. jimpark said: You can nerf cards as you wish but i can promise you that will:1) increase the amount of wasted time spent in game. 2) everything will feel "meh" and boring like the severe lack of chase cards in RNA. If your going nerf things but keep the grind the same then peace out to this game. Not nerfing an overpowered card purely so people can play through matches at a faster rate is the dumbest argument against nerfs there is. jimpark said: -Buffs before nerfs. -Convenience issues (deck slots, visual aid) before buffs/nerfs. -Card bugs before convenience issues.-Program bugs before Card bugs.**you can add and rearrange a few of those as you please but feel like thats the ladder. It's also quite asinine to never ask for changes to things that need to be changed until after other things you feel are higher priority get changed. We all have our tiers of changes that should be made. Just because you want the thing at tier 1 to be fixed, doesn't mean you can't bring up the thing at tier 6 as well.
Brakkis said: Stormcrow said: Brakkis said:And once again, the argument of not nerfing something because it's super effective and everyone is using it, is not a valid reason to not nerf it. It's an uncommon direct damage spell that is currently better than any mythic direct damage spell in the game. If it gets "nerfed" to what it was designed for in the first place, then so be it. It's an uncommon. It shouldn't make mythic and rare burn spells look like jokes. "We need to nerf it because it's too strong for an uncommon" is a completely different argument than "we need to nerf it because it breaks the color pie". Counterpoint: instead of nerfing the only successful burn-deck archetype (and yes, Beacon Bolt is only especially good in decks designed to maximize it) this game has ever had into nonexistence, why not just bump the card up to mythic status. Problem solved! I concede that that would make sense in justifying it's current capabilities.Also, Beacon Bolt can get just as high outside of BSZ. Run it with Underrealm Lich and Surveil cards.
Even without building a deck around it (besides just an Izzet deck with Ral), I've gotten it up to 50+ in some of the boss fights. That's without BSZ and whatever. Usually, whatever deck I'm running it with won't power it enough to kill my opponent until my creatures and other spells have already done a lot of damage to the AI.
I don't think a spell that you can't use at that effectiveness (30+ damage in one shot) until turn 9+ is necessarily an issue (it might be, though). It's when you pop off 30+ damage on turn two because BSZ has filled and emptied your hand a few times that it's a huge problem.
That said, I 10,000% agree with your original statement, that popularity is not a good reason not to nerf something. Of course it's popular, you always win with it.
Beacon Bolt may need a nerf, but I think we need to see what the game looks like after BSZ gets nerfed down before making an informed decision.