shteev said: I've got Drake Haven, New Perpectives, and a bunch of cycling cards, so I'm pretty sure I won't need any other cards until Kaladesh rotates out...
gillkonam said: Not long ago, we used to play for event-specific rares, packs that contained rares often enough, and mega packs that contained rares. Now we play for nothing but stingy packs that rarely pop rares, and currency that doesn't produce much in the end. We have events that are now completely grindy in a way they weren't before. This game feels like work more often then not. It's a business and there are in a business to make money. That means people buying in. The problem I see is that the prizes that make buying the optimum cards to make new decks aren't there. It was always meant to be a comparable trade off, the one feeding the other. D3, seriously, what the heck is going on? Up the prize levels and makes this feel a little less like a part-time job.
bken1234 said: gillkonam said: Not long ago, we used to play for event-specific rares, packs that contained rares often enough, and mega packs that contained rares. Now we play for nothing but stingy packs that rarely pop rares, and currency that doesn't produce much in the end. We have events that are now completely grindy in a way they weren't before. This game feels like work more often then not. It's a business and there are in a business to make money. That means people buying in. The problem I see is that the prizes that make buying the optimum cards to make new decks aren't there. It was always meant to be a comparable trade off, the one feeding the other. D3, seriously, what the heck is going on? Up the prize levels and makes this feel a little less like a part-time job. Well first of all, I don't think it's grindier than ever before. I remember the days when ALL events were 4 hour charges -- people were grinding on the toilet at work just to not miss charges. Now it's just the weekend -- when people have to be with their families and marriages are suffering a bit -- but at least toilet grinding has been minimized. I think this game is what you make it. I play story mode every day -- and it's the same thing over and over for 19 months -- but I like to try new, cool things. For ToZ this time, I played 70% new decks. My only cycling deck is for 3.1 and 3.3 -- just because a mechanic is useful doesn't mean it's fun. Games should be fun -- break the win or die mentality and start finding ways to have fun with it. My team can attest that since I've done that, my scores are higher than ever. You're not being boxed in, there's a whole world of possibilities in this game. Expand your horizons. Or just quit -- if it's not fun, you could always just quit.
I think this is the core problem. Cycling is such an amazing skill that it drives competitive players to flock to it with nearly every deck. If you don't mind losing 5 times on The Gods in ToZ then you can experiment. But I suspect most people will rush right back to cycling with the presumably upcoming ToS and the much higher individual stakes.
When I can't find a single card in the elite pack which will make my ToZ decks better at all, you know we are in a disconnected game state. Because of engines like New Perspectives and Shefet Monitor, you can basically shrink the size of your deck down to 4-5 cards rather than 10. Now, without even using cycling as your win condition with Drake Haven or Faith of the Devoted, I can throw out half of my deck and just play with a 5 card deck. The consistency this offers makes the decks nearly unbeatable and yet makes the game less fun on a number of fronts.
1. Lots of tedious RSI-cling
2. Less experimentation with cards (Why buy Angel of Sanctions when I can just use Metalwork Colossus and Heart of Kiran in every deck... ie I only need 2 creatures because I now only play with 5 cards.)
Anyway, I see virtually no competitive reason to spend any more resources on cards until AT LEAST KLD rotates out and perhaps not until AKH rotates out. This is a problem that D3 should very much be concerned with.
Ohboy said: I'm also surprised people don't remember that all events used to be 4h. Or that when it switched over to 8h, some complained that there weren't enough games to play.
Sirchombli said: For me, the amount of rares isn't the issue. I pull a lot of them. The problem is that it's always one of the same 20. For a while I felt like I was just pulling from my own pool. I think this makes drop rates seem worse than they are.
bken1234 said: Well first of all, I don't think it's grindier than ever before. I remember the days when ALL events were 4 hour charges -- people were grinding on the toilet at work just to not miss charges. Now it's just the weekend -- when people have to be with their families and marriages are suffering a bit -- but at least toilet grinding has been minimized. I think this game is what you make it. I play story mode every day -- and it's the same thing over and over for 19 months -- but I like to try new, cool things. For ToZ this time, I played 70% new decks. My only cycling deck is for 3.1 and 3.3 -- just because a mechanic is useful doesn't mean it's fun. Games should be fun -- break the win or die mentality and start finding ways to have fun with it. My team can attest that since I've done that, my scores are higher than ever. You're not being boxed in, there's a whole world of possibilities in this game. Expand your horizons. Or just quit -- if it's not fun, you could always just quit.
madwren said: Ohboy said: I'm also surprised people don't remember that all events used to be 4h. Or that when it switched over to 8h, some complained that there weren't enough games to play. I likewise am surprised that you don't remember that when it switched to 8h, there was more celebration than complaint. The primary reason people complained was "not having stuff to do", which has been alleviated by the constantly ongoing events.
Ohboy said: madwren said: Ohboy said: I'm also surprised people don't remember that all events used to be 4h. Or that when it switched over to 8h, some complained that there weren't enough games to play. I likewise am surprised that you don't remember that when it switched to 8h, there was more celebration than complaint. The primary reason people complained was "not having stuff to do", which has been alleviated by the constantly ongoing events. Which if you remember, also got complaints. Turns out some people want to play more than others.
Yvendros said: I've gotta ask, what is this cycling deck? Of course I never see AI execute one properly, so that's no help. I've got most of common/uncommon cycling cards. None of the rares though, I assume that's where it's at?
Volrak said: Yvendros said: I've gotta ask, what is this cycling deck? Of course I never see AI execute one properly, so that's no help. I've got most of common/uncommon cycling cards. None of the rares though, I assume that's where it's at? Make nearly all your deck cycling, and run cards like Drake Haven (get +4/+4 on your drakes per cycle) New Perspectives (draw 3 when played, and cycle for free on cards with cycling 3 or less), and Cast Out, which solves all your removal needs (at least in ToZ).What any of your other cycling cards do when cast normally is almost irrelevant, since you almost always just cycle them: when your board's clear, you're cycling to find Drake Haven and New Perspectives; and when these supports are in play, you're cycling to make drakes and find copies of Cast Out. You're effectively playing a 3 or 4 card deck, and the same deck will be optimal for around half the nodes in ToZ, so gameplay variety is very low.The AI never cycles any card, so players are never on the receiving end of how overpowered the mechanic is.Edit: Some more good info is here: https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/66015/unpopular-opinion-needs-cycling-a-nerf