Patch Notes - 11/27 - DISCUSSION

Unknown

Ranzera wrote:

They could have limited through flow of spice rather than doing a 2 prong approach. Tokens in general are worthless to me because I can only see them as another unstoppable crash for 1 star or mjolnirs might for 2 star tokens. So I'm not even all that invested in this change. I still think it's stupid to attack a problem from both sides at once.

But it is changing relative to other prices. If the diabolic pack was now 2200 HP, that would be crazy. If leveling a 2* character was 1000 HP, that would be crazy. They didn't change those. Plus, they haven't changed the cost of the heroic pack since they started giving out tokens anyway. If anything, we should be glad we had that window to pull all those covers before they up'ed the price. I understand that it doesn't really concern you because you're above that level, but I think it is going to encourage players to level up their characters and use less HP on the heroic pack which wasn't that great for anyone that has Thor and C. Storm. I know it is how I got some of my drops, but I think newer players will get their drops in other ways such as special packs, PvE events, and tournaments.

i would like to see an increase in the chance of pulling a 3* or 4* with the price increase though. I thought it was a little weak before.

Unknown

Blue Shoes wrote:

Ranzera wrote:

They could have limited through flow of spice rather than doing a 2 prong approach. Tokens in general are worthless to me because I can only see them as another unstoppable crash for 1 star or mjolnirs might for 2 star tokens. So I'm not even all that invested in this change. I still think it's stupid to attack a problem from both sides at once.

But it is changing relative to other prices. If the diabolic pack was now 2200 HP, that would be crazy. If leveling a 2* character was 1000 HP, that would be crazy. They didn't change those. Plus, they haven't changed the cost of the heroic pack since they started giving out tokens anyway. If anything, we should be glad we had that window to pull all those covers before they up'ed the price. I understand that it doesn't really concern you because you're above that level, but I think it is going to encourage players to level up their characters and use less HP on the heroic pack which wasn't that great for anyone that has Thor and C. Storm. I know it is how I got some of my drops, but I think newer players will get their drops in other ways such as special packs, PvE events, and tournaments.

i would like to see an increase in the chance of pulling a 3* or 4* with the price increase though. I thought it was a little weak before.

It does however make this game less accessible to new players. The difficulty is already greatly higher for new players than it was for us. The devs are chopping off their lifeblood at the knees. Repeatedly!

ElectroBlast

junshengkeh wrote:

Will this event work the same way as the previous unstable ISO event? Missions reset every two days or so. Also, will there be rubber banding like the Heroics Tournament? How many people per bracket? Need more information please!

A lot of changes to the inner workings were made this one, like adding 2 repeatable missions, but to get to your exact questions...

Missions will change every day. Think of it like the previous event, but running in 1/2 of the time (5 days instead of 10).

Regarding the "rubber banding", the algorithms are are continuously being worked on so that both new and old players can enjoy the event. This time around, Unstable Iso-8 is using an entirely different point-rewarding calculation than any previous event.

Brackets are limited to 1,000 players.

Unknown

ElectroBlast wrote:

junshengkeh wrote:

Will this event work the same way as the previous unstable ISO event? Missions reset every two days or so. Also, will there be rubber banding like the Heroics Tournament? How many people per bracket? Need more information please!

A lot of changes to the inner workings were made this one, like adding 2 repeatable missions, but to get to your exact questions...

Missions will change every day. Think of it like the previous event, but running in 1/2 of the time (5 days instead of 10).

Regarding the "rubber banding", the algorithms are are continuously being worked on so that both new and old players can enjoy the event. This time around, Unstable Iso-8 is using an entirely different point-rewarding calculation than any previous event.

Brackets are limited to 1,000 players.

Woah, back that train up. The event rules say resets every OTHER day. Is this wrong?

Unknown

Well...it all comes down to numbers. So if they show that there is a dip in revenue or enough feedback from players on the forum and elsewhere then perhaps it might change? Some games never change their prices it seems (candy crush has been the same price for ages) and some always changing. This might just be a game where it is changing quite a bit...but new content is constantly released. (maybe one day the respec will happen). As IceIX said before...they are just testing the market to see if it can sustain that change.

Unknown

Ranzera wrote:

It does however make this game less accessible to new players. The difficulty is already greatly higher for new players than it was for us. The devs are chopping off their lifeblood at the knees. Repeatedly!

I do think getting in early was an advantage, but I don't know how hard it is for new players. It depends on how far they can progress by going through PvE and if they are up against easier people in the tournaments. I don't know how that is going to impact it. Yes, we had it easier. But does that make things less enjoyable for them? I don't know. If the devs see more people giving up, I think they'll change it, but I'm not sure a fresh face will look at the 300 HP price tag and just give up. When I look at it, I don't think it would have changed my current character set that much. I've gotten way more tokens than packs I've bought. Other people might be different, but I think this just incourages different use of HP. As for cover slot prices, I'm with you there. As a collector style game, I think those are pricey.

Unknown

Blue Shoes wrote:

Ranzera wrote:

It does however make this game less accessible to new players. The difficulty is already greatly higher for new players than it was for us. The devs are chopping off their lifeblood at the knees. Repeatedly!

I do think getting in early was an advantage, but I don't know how hard it is for new players. It depends on how far they can progress by going through PvE and if they are up against easier people in the tournaments. I don't know how that is going to impact it. Yes, we had it easier. But does that make things less enjoyable for them? I don't know. If the devs see more people giving up, I think they'll change it, but I'm not sure a fresh face will look at the 300 HP price tag and just give up. When I look at it, I don't think it would have changed my current character set that much. I've gotten way more tokens than packs I've bought. Other people might be different, but I think this just incourages different use of HP. As for cover slot prices, I'm with you there. As a collector style game, I think those are pricey.

At about 25% through juggernaught you hit a brick wall of pain. With everything random pulls hawkeye classic is your best character most likely. It gets worse as you go. Bag man is 100% necessary to keep going.

Unknown

My issue is just that raising the price on various things gives off a "we don't know what we're doing" vibe.

Unknown

Elementalor wrote:

My issue is just that raising the price on various things gives off a "we don't know what we're doing" vibe.

there was an explanation by iceix earlier in this thread with an explanation, whether u agree or not to the explanation however is another point.

i'm in the half agree/half disagree faction

Unknown

Ranzera wrote:

ElectroBlast wrote:

Missions will change every day. Think of it like the previous event, but running in 1/2 of the time (5 days instead of 10).

Woah, back that train up. The event rules say resets every OTHER day. Is this wrong?

Yes, clarification, please?

Unknown

Ranzera wrote:

At about 25% through juggernaught you hit a brick wall of pain. With everything random pulls hawkeye classic is your best character most likely. It gets worse as you go. Bag man is 100% necessary to keep going.

Juggernaut? Really? Yikes. That seems too early for a wall. Bagman would actually be a good reward to just give out for beating H.A.M.M.E.R. He's kinda useless later on, but can be helpful through PvE. But that's besides the point. How much HP is someone going to have going through the first 1.5 levels? If the wall is that early and harsh then the levels need to be rebalanced, but there are still tournaments going on. I didn't even want to do tournaments until I hit my first wall in venom. Then I got into them and loved them. I think if people like playing the game, they'll keep playing. Then again, it seems like you might know someone who quit because of that wall so I'm probably wrong.

Unknown

forgrim wrote:

Elementalor wrote:

My issue is just that raising the price on various things gives off a "we don't know what we're doing" vibe.

there was an explanation by iceix earlier in this thread with an explanation, whether u agree or not to the explanation however is another point.

i'm in the half agree/half disagree faction

I'm including that explanation in the vibe. It indicates that the business model was not properly planned or thought out.

Unknown

300 for a chance to pull Bag Man or Hawkeye or a cover I already have maxed out. Nope. No more casual buys of $5 just to see what heroics can pull if it's only going to get me 2 draws. Raising the price of items now makes D3P look bad. This game was already a money sink, but now they're just making it ridiculous.

Unknown

All these HP changes just drive down the value of purchased HP.

I probably bought 15 covers with money. After the cover price change I got another 2 with event rewards.

I spend most of my first $25 on heroic tokens. I got some decent covers but close to 50% was bagman/ m. Hawkeye. I don't buy these at all now as those odds suck. We get enough tokens as progression rewards (and they still suck but at least they are free).

Now all that's worth paying for is upgrades but as soon as those go up I'm done with spending any money. Got a really good return on investing in red Rag covers as now I can win some 3*s.

Yes we get plenty of rewards from tournaments but that just means there is less incentive to spend money.

Looking only at whales may be a bad strategy as they'll get bored of being at the top at some point.

Instead of this 'let's milk them for as much as they can afford' strategy, how about some goodwill? Have 4 hour sales on tokens or upgrades and see how many people buy that bit of HP they are missing.

You will find many indie authors who said their sales went through the roof when they drop the price of books to 99c. They make up the lower price in volume. Also, look at the Steam sale system and how much money those make for everyone.

ElectroBlast

Ranzera wrote:

ElectroBlast wrote:

junshengkeh wrote:

Will this event work the same way as the previous unstable ISO event? Missions reset every two days or so. Also, will there be rubber banding like the Heroics Tournament? How many people per bracket? Need more information please!

A lot of changes to the inner workings were made this one, like adding 2 repeatable missions, but to get to your exact questions...

Missions will change every day. Think of it like the previous event, but running in 1/2 of the time (5 days instead of 10).

Regarding the "rubber banding", the algorithms are are continuously being worked on so that both new and old players can enjoy the event. This time around, Unstable Iso-8 is using an entirely different point-rewarding calculation than any previous event.

Brackets are limited to 1,000 players.

Woah, back that train up. The event rules say resets every OTHER day. Is this wrong?

Yes, that is a bug. The new missions will appear on an irregular timer (so not every 24 hrs), but at least every day.

Sorry I don't have better details for you folks at the moment.

Unknown

IceIX wrote:

Our 300 HP packs in events for 2* plus heroes have been doing just fine since they were first introduced. Players, both old and new, continue to find value in these packs when gaining 2* characters.

It will be interesting to see, though I suspect one reason the 300 HP packs were popular was due to the value of having a better idea what you would get. I suppose this means those will probably go up in price as well...

Unknown

Spoit wrote:

The problem is, with the exception of the completely random HP drops in heroic mode, all those ISO methods are increasingly being moved to placement prizes, rather than progression. So the rich get richer, and the people who can't place in the top 25 regularly can barely scrounge for a slot per handful of new covers.

This has been a recurring theme enough times now that we should consider it a developer strategy, not an unfortunate consequence.They are clearly catering to the high-paying player, which is certainly a valid choice. I haven't seen them try to maintain some illusion that f2p players can be competitive, so you shouldn't be surprised when these changes keep happening.

Dayv

I think doubling the cost of the heroic packs all at once was a mistake. Maybe you should have tried 200 first. 33% more is a world of psychological difference from simply doubling the cost.

Also, I agree with what one or two others said: there was extra value in the 300 HP special packs because people buying them knew that the smaller selection or increased odds of certain characters gave them a better shot at what they were looking for.

I've spent a fair bit of HP (including real money) on character slots and heroic pulls. The price increase on character slots has made me a lot more critical (I may just sell Bag Man and Classic Hawkeye the next time I need slots), and this increase on heroic packs is going to slow down any real purchases I make a lot more.

I've always thought that power upgrades are too expensive for uncommon characters and ludicrous for rare ones, and haven't spent HP on them at all.

I understand you need to maximize profit. I may be a statistical outlier but these changes are pushing me, someone who is usually f2p, away from further spending.

IronyMan

IceIX wrote:

forgrim wrote:

i do have to wonder why it was raised to 300 hp. is it because with tokens, there's just an abundance of covers going out? there has to be some arbitrary reason, even if its to make more money (more hp as prizes, from random things?)

I'll field that one. Similar to cover slot pricing, we're testing price ceilings.

And while I think that you've done a great job speaking to everyone on here and while I love the game, this attitude really screams "we're not quite sure what we're doing so we'll see how much we can gouge you before you get too pissed" This is kind of the way I've felt it's been like from the beginning, which is why I don't put any more money into it. I just dropped 7 bucks into Lords of Waterdeep for iOS and for that I get an extremely polished full game. For the same price on this app, I get 2 (more than likely completely ****) cover pulls. So instead of feeling like I'm investing, it feels more like a rigged carnival game attached to a pretty fun game but you won't do as well in the main game until you throw money into the pit and even then, won't usually get much.

Spoit

IronyMan wrote:

IceIX wrote:

forgrim wrote:

i do have to wonder why it was raised to 300 hp. is it because with tokens, there's just an abundance of covers going out? there has to be some arbitrary reason, even if its to make more money (more hp as prizes, from random things?)

I'll field that one. Similar to cover slot pricing, we're testing price ceilings.

And while I think that you've done a great job speaking to everyone on here and while I love the game, this attitude really screams "we're not quite sure what we're doing so we'll see how much we can gouge you before you get too pissed" This is kind of the way I've felt it's been like from the beginning, which is why I don't put any more money into it. I just dropped 7 bucks into Lords of Waterdeep for iOS and for that I get an extremely polished full game. For the same price on this app, I get 2 (more than likely completely ****) cover pulls. So instead of feeling like I'm investing, it feels more like a rigged carnival game attached to a pretty fun game but you won't do as well in the main game until you throw money into the pit and even then, won't usually get much.

Or if you don't have a free slot, only 1 pull