Is the current LT pool worth champing?

BriMan2222

I think a lot of people were down on High Evo because they didn't understand what he does. I still don't really understand what exactly he does (I haven't finished him yet) but I do know that every time I face him in pvp he ends up being a problem even though I'm not exactly sure what he's doing that is making him a problem.

entrailbucket

What's interesting is that it's not a case of us ALWAYS being wrong. Like everybody was down on Jeff and he's okay, but not great. Folks were really down on Magik and she was actually so bad that they had to buff her. So there's something about certain characters that causes everybody to miss on them.

skittledaddy

Is it safe to assume that 3/5/5 is the correct build for HEvo?

Bowgentle

@entrailbucket said:
What's interesting is that it's not a case of us ALWAYS being wrong. Like everybody was down on Jeff and he's okay, but not great. Folks were really down on Magik and she was actually so bad that they had to buff her. So there's something about certain characters that causes everybody to miss on them.

Overcomplicated kits, mostly.

dianetics

@Bowgentle said:

There is some lesson to be learned there, somewhere.

Never listen to you, which we all should have learned years ago!
Also, never listen to me, either.

Damn, for a guy that is ignoring me, you sure reply to me a lot.

Still I love your perspective. Keep at it man.

entrailbucket

@dianetics said:

@Bowgentle said:

There is some lesson to be learned there, somewhere.

Never listen to you, which we all should have learned years ago!
Also, never listen to me, either.

Damn, for a guy that is ignoring me, you sure reply to me a lot.

Still I love your perspective. Keep at it man.

He was replying to me, and he was absolutely correct!

dianetics

@skittledaddy said:
Is it safe to assume that 3/5/5 is the correct build for HEvo?

Yes

@entrailbucket said:
He was replying to me, and he was absolutely correct!

Damn, I guess we should all just hang out in the no friend zone.

rainkingucd

@entrailbucket said:

There is some lesson to be learned there, somewhere.

No, it's the children who are wrong

rainkingucd

@dianetics said:

@skittledaddy said:
Is it safe to assume that 3/5/5 is the correct build for HEvo?

Yes

I think he can work either 5/5/3 or 3/5/5, depending on situation and team.

As a general rule, I'd say yes, 3/5/5. e.g. with Kang as a partner, 3/5/5 for sure as his is a better blue. Against Immortal/Chasm with Deathlok as a partner, also 3/5/5, as Deathlok create blue for Chasm to drain, while you quietly gather black when Chasm makes a match.

But during TaT against some of the goon nodes, and with Deathlok as a partner, I am often ending up with 20+ blue, but barely enough black, and then end up firing blue 3-4 times in a match and never black, so I think I'd prefer his blue in that situation.

DAZ0273

@rainkingucd said:

@entrailbucket said:

There is some lesson to be learned there, somewhere.

No, it's the children who are wrong

The boy knew too much.

DAZ0273

All I know is that he has like 300k health and is zapping people for 100k + with his black in TaT so he is alright with me!

dianetics

@rainkingucd said:

@dianetics said:

@skittledaddy said:
Is it safe to assume that 3/5/5 is the correct build for HEvo?

Yes

I think he can work either 5/5/3 or 3/5/5, depending on situation and team.

As a general rule, I'd say yes, 3/5/5. e.g. with Kang as a partner, 3/5/5 for sure as his is a better blue. Against Immortal/Chasm with Deathlok as a partner, also 3/5/5, as Deathlok create blue for Chasm to drain, while you quietly gather black when Chasm makes a match.

But during TaT against some of the goon nodes, and with Deathlok as a partner, I am often ending up with 20+ blue, but barely enough black, and then end up firing blue 3-4 times in a match and never black, so I think I'd prefer his blue in that situation.

His black just scales so much better though. Since it is based off of %health. The bigger EVO the harder his black will hit.

His blue will give you a 2 turn stun at max. I’d rather take the scaling nuke though.

Players choice though.

Vhailorx

@entrailbucket said:

@rainkingucd said:

@dianetics said:
I champed him a few days ago and Evo makes me giggle.
Generate yellow and just grow him past the opposing teams damage.
I ran Evo, Kang, Deathlok for the techno trio and it was just stupid.
Evo is just standing there growing every round and matching away the main target. The Kang sends the other two away for a win. It works and its simple. You don't need a good board and you don't have to worry about health packs.

Gunna try it when nobody is boosted.

totally agreed. Of the last 15 releases (i.e. going back to start of 2022), Hevo is easily top 3 in use. Hevo, Wong, MThor.

What's interesting there is that the forum (and the community in general, from what I've seen) were really down on two of those three at release -- both Evolutionary and Wong. I was one of them! I turned around on High Evo pretty quickly once I started using him, but I got a bunch of flack in his thread from people who didn't believe me (and to be fair, I had trouble figuring out why he was overperforming my expectations).

There is some lesson to be learned there, somewhere.

The lesson to be learned here is that complex kits are harder to evaluate that simple ones. Anyone with experience in the game could tell that fosthor would be useful because she has passive boardshake and targets special tiles. Even if her actives were total **** (which they definitely are not) she would have value from shutting down any team that relies on specials or likes a static board. Her floor was obviously very high without any need to see her in action.

But Wong and HEvo have tons of moving parts and abilities that are relative to the opposing team. They are much harder to evaluate on paper. I am not at all surpsied that the community was hesitant.

entrailbucket

I think "harder to evaluate" is the right takeaway.

We don't want it to swing too far in the other direction, where the community assumes that a complicated powerset is automatically good, because there are plenty of them that aren't (new Wasp, for example).

Also, some of these guys aren't obviously good right away, even when playing them (ie in practice, not on paper). It took me a bunch of matches to figure out how to play Wong and Evolutionary.

Bowgentle

With Wong it was more a matter of realizing just how often his strikes trigger at the start of the match.
High Evo really takes a while to get a grip on.

rainkingucd

@dianetics said:

@rainkingucd said:

@dianetics said:

@skittledaddy said:
Is it safe to assume that 3/5/5 is the correct build for HEvo?

Yes

I think he can work either 5/5/3 or 3/5/5, depending on situation and team.

As a general rule, I'd say yes, 3/5/5. e.g. with Kang as a partner, 3/5/5 for sure as his is a better blue. Against Immortal/Chasm with Deathlok as a partner, also 3/5/5, as Deathlok create blue for Chasm to drain, while you quietly gather black when Chasm makes a match.

But during TaT against some of the goon nodes, and with Deathlok as a partner, I am often ending up with 20+ blue, but barely enough black, and then end up firing blue 3-4 times in a match and never black, so I think I'd prefer his blue in that situation.

His black just scales so much better though. Since it is based off of %health. The bigger EVO the harder his black will hit.

His blue will give you a 2 turn stun at max. I’d rather take the scaling nuke though.

Players choice though.

Totally agree. His black is the better power. I just kept finding myself flush with blue and kept using his blue power at Level 3, so it was kind of a waste

dianetics

This is totally normal.

rainkingucd

@dianetics said:

This is totally normal.

Totally normal

entrailbucket

Sounds like a great idea for a (player-run, rewardless) forum contest! We used to do those all the time in the first year or so of the game.

Who can get a screenshot of the highest-health Evolutionary?

Blackstone

@dianetics said:

This is totally normal.

Seems legit.