Kamar-Taj support

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  • Skindo
    Skindo Posts: 11 Just Dropped In
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    If they allow supports to be used in PvP only on offense, I think I will benefit. But that is because I am a 4* with a weak roster who only cares about getting the 25 win rewards. Using supports might get me to start pushing for 50 wins (if clears are faster and I don't need to dodge as many opponents & use as many health packs). But even though it is good for me now, it seems like a bad idea in general. It seems like it is good for those who want to play pvp for progression only and bad for those who want to play it competitively, which seems backwards. I would also be disincentivized from playing pvp for placement because I don't have great supports, so I probably would not climb as fast as those who do.

    If they allow it on offense and defense, I worry my 25 wins may be much tougher to get given my limited supports. Then I would be disincentivized from playing pvp at all.

    If (and I really hope this does not happen) they add resurrecting enemies to PVE, I really hope their health gets cut WAY down.

  • Tony_Foot
    Tony_Foot Posts: 1,726 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @Bowgentle said:
    I don't want to see supports in pvp, ever.
    Only on offense means you'll get hit A LOT more than now.

    I get my wins and get hit back to the point where I'm not worth the risk. That wouldn't change. What would happen is my targets would open up, I could punch up. I would skip almost nothing. I'd happily take on double 550's and I think that's the reason the top end of the game really don't want supports on offence only.

    It is irritating they have released this support and not told us what's happening. I would buy the chain deal if I knew. If it's not coming to pvp I would skip.

  • liminal_lad
    liminal_lad Posts: 463 Mover and Shaker
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    Are we going to get an answer on this? I have been very vocal in my support of the new devs, but it would be great to get some clarity while the offer is still up.

  • Yepyep
    Yepyep Posts: 952 Critical Contributor
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    The problem with K-T is that it is so limited. Currently, there are 5 chars that can use it: 3/5 Stranges, Mordo, Wong, and Shang-Chi. It seems pretty useless.

    I hope their plans for supports aren't along the lines of planning to make scores of them, each highly restricted by affiliation, and potentially "support roster slots" creating further limitations (not to mention revenue opportunities). Doing this would make it easier to introduce to PvP because it would, in time, create the potential for highly differentiated team builds in an increasingly, um, Balkanized? player base where a small percentage of players have all supports. Kind of like now with the 5* game but with an added layer concentrating power even further.

  • liminal_lad
    liminal_lad Posts: 463 Mover and Shaker
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    @Yepyep said:
    The problem with K-T is that it is so limited. Currently, there are 5 chars that can use it: 3/5 Stranges, Mordo, Wong, and Shang-Chi. It seems pretty useless.

    I hope their plans for supports aren't along the lines of planning to make scores of them, each highly restricted by affiliation, and potentially "support roster slots" creating further limitations (not to mention revenue opportunities). Doing this would make it easier to introduce to PvP because it would, in time, create the potential for highly differentiated team builds in an increasingly, um, Balkanized? player base where a small percentage of players have all supports. Kind of like now with the 5* game but with an added layer concentrating power even further.

    Shang-Chi in PVP with K-T wouldn't necessarily be a slam dunk but it could totally change playing against the immortal brothers. Down Chasm and Hulk follows quickly.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2023
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    Talking about 5* land, SC is hard countered by chasm. Certainly with this support things would change although he won't take advantage of any other perk.
    Wong is countered too and is pretty irrelevant in pvp until now. He would take advantage of the yellow which chasm negates to him. Plus special tiles empowered which wong creates. So it would be a nice final pump for him.
    Also the geniuses perk is open to synergies which would heal the immortal bros punishment.
    And now a bonus speculation of mine: if they need approvals it should be because there is gonna be a major change in the same.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Then it should be pves with revivers goons.
    I always fail the % on speculations :D

  • Colognoisseur
    Colognoisseur Posts: 804 Critical Contributor
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    @S0kun said:
    Our next blog is going to be a good one folks. Apologies for not having it ready this week, but some of your questions will be answered next week if things go as planned. Fingers crossed!

    So just to be clear you’re going to inform us of changes to supports after the current offer for the first new support expires, is that correct?

  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2023
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    @S0kun said:
    Our next blog is going to be a good one folks. Apologies for not having it ready this week, but some of your questions will be answered next week if things go as planned. Fingers crossed!

    This is obviously not an ideal scenario. I live in the real world where mistakes happen and things aren't always perfect, so I get it.

    Since customer goodwill is also important, especially in a live service game, i definitely think that part of the support rework announcement should include some form of equity for this snafu (i.e., offering a new item without any information about planned, imminent future changes to the relevant system). Ideally, the new support would be made available for sale again after the announcement AND people would be given the chance to roll back any purchases already made. But at least one of those two things should happen.

  • Scofie
    Scofie GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,184 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2023
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    @Vhailorx said:

    @S0kun said:
    Our next blog is going to be a good one folks. Apologies for not having it ready this week, but some of your questions will be answered next week if things go as planned. Fingers crossed!

    This is obviously not an ideal scenario. I live in the real world where mistakes happen and things aren't always perfect, so I get it.

    Since customer goodwill is also important, especially in a live service game, i definitely think that part of the support rework announcement should include some form of equity for this snafu (i.e., offering a new item without any information about planned, imminent future changes to the relevant system). Ideally, the new support would be made available for sale again after the announcement AND people would be given the chance to roll back any purchases already made. But at least one of those two things should happen.

    I think the option to buy should be extended. I, personally, wouldn't cater for buyers remorse. And it's been used. Nobody wants a second-hand Kamar-Taj...

  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2023
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    @Scofie said:

    @Vhailorx said:

    @S0kun said:
    Our next blog is going to be a good one folks. Apologies for not having it ready this week, but some of your questions will be answered next week if things go as planned. Fingers crossed!

    This is obviously not an ideal scenario. I live in the real world where mistakes happen and things aren't always perfect, so I get it.

    Since customer goodwill is also important, especially in a live service game, i definitely think that part of the support rework announcement should include some form of equity for this snafu (i.e., offering a new item without any information about planned, imminent future changes to the relevant system). Ideally, the new support would be made available for sale again after the announcement AND people would be given the chance to roll back any purchases already made. But at least one of those two things should happen.

    I think the option to buy should be extended. I, personally, wouldn't cater for buyers remorse. And it's been used. Nobody wants a second-hand Kamar-Taj...

    I think the content of the announcement is relevant to what they should do, but it's plausible to imagine a scenario where they are about make changes that substantially reduce the value of supports (be that making them harder to use, less powerful, or even making them easier to acquire which would lower the value of rarer tier 4/5 supports).

    If any of those things are happening then I think it would be good for D3 to offer refunds to some or all of the people who purchased this offer. Certainly it would only be for people who bought during a particular period, and they could also do something like a match cutoff so that people who purchased the support and used it hard in PVP for short term advantage cannot then immediately return it.

    I have no idea how logistically plausible this sort of fix would be, and I don't think BCS or D3 are legally obligated to do something like this, nor do i expect it to happen. I just think it would be the right thing to do under these circumstances.

  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2023
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    Now that words are out that this support is not available for support yet, the additional perk is pretty much not useful.

    The entire offers cost a total of 35. Here are the contents, thanks to players in reddit:

    Kamar-Taj Support Chain 1: $10
    1CP, 300 3* strange shards, R1 Kamar-Taj support, 500 HP, 10000 iso, 2500 Riso

    Kamar-Taj Support Chain 2: $10
    2CP, 400 Mordo shards, R2 Kamar-Taj support, 500 HP, 15000 iso, 5000 Riso

    Kamar-Taj Support Chain 3: $15 2CP, 500 Shang Chi shards, R3 Kamar-Taj support, 1000 HP, 25000 ISO, 10000 rISO

    Total: $35
    5CP, 300x 3* Strange shards, 400x Mordo shards, 500x Shang Chi shards, R3 Kamar-Taj support, 2000 HP, 50000 ISO, 17500 Riso

    $35 allows you to buy 3 Agency Expenses (600hp x 3, $5x3) and 1 Logan's Loonies (2900 HP, $20) for a total of 4700HP. Players who bought this are trading 2700HP for 500 5* SC shards ,and that alone, is pretty much worth it.

    Players who buy such chain offers are highly unlikely to be petty people and request for refunds.

  • Scofie
    Scofie GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,184 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @Vhailorx said:

    @Scofie said:

    @Vhailorx said:

    @S0kun said:
    Our next blog is going to be a good one folks. Apologies for not having it ready this week, but some of your questions will be answered next week if things go as planned. Fingers crossed!

    This is obviously not an ideal scenario. I live in the real world where mistakes happen and things aren't always perfect, so I get it.

    Since customer goodwill is also important, especially in a live service game, i definitely think that part of the support rework announcement should include some form of equity for this snafu (i.e., offering a new item without any information about planned, imminent future changes to the relevant system). Ideally, the new support would be made available for sale again after the announcement AND people would be given the chance to roll back any purchases already made. But at least one of those two things should happen.

    I think the option to buy should be extended. I, personally, wouldn't cater for buyers remorse. And it's been used. Nobody wants a second-hand Kamar-Taj...

    I think the content of the announcement is relevant to what they should do, but it's plausible to imagine a scenario where they are about make changes that substantially reduce the value of supports (be that making them harder to use, less powerful, or even making them easier which would lower the value of rarer tier 4/5 supports).

    If any of those things are happening then I think it would be good for D3 to offer refunds to some or all of the people who purchased this offer. Certainly it would only be for people who bought during a particular period, and they could also do something like a match cutoff so that people who purchased the support and used it hard in PVP for short term advantage cannot then immediately return it.

    I have no idea how logistically plausible this sort of fix would be, and I don't think BCS or D3 are legally obligated to do something like this, nor do i expect it to happen. I just think it would be the right thing to do under these circumstances.

    Yeah, I see your point, but it would have to be a massive reduction in value from now to qualify for refund status in my view.

  • purplemur
    purplemur Posts: 454 Mover and Shaker
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    Customer feedback: If I was still trying to champ Shang-Chi I would buy this, if supports were pvp I would buy this, if this was limited like infinity stones I would buy it.
    I will pass this time but not at all a bad deal.
    Player feedback: This support is exactly what is needed: a place/location/base like sanctum/ancestral plane, unique abilities, powerful abilities and evocative art. Well done!
    hypothetical debate question: if supports WERE in pvp: would lvl3Kametaj replace lvl3Chimichanga on Shang?
    Also serious request: please add Killmonger/shuri to Ancestral Plane.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @Scofie said:

    @liminal_lad said:
    Are we going to get an answer on this? I have been very vocal in my support of the new devs, but it would be great to get some clarity while the offer is still up.

    Just a an update: Announcement is still going through Marvel approvals. Supports won't go into PvP (at least not yet - not ruling it out in the future) - can't without UI changes anyway. Kamar-Taj will rotate into Support packs at season change.

    Hope that helps.

    Thank you for confirmation about supports in PVP.
    That does help, me at least.

  • WilliamK1983
    WilliamK1983 Posts: 732 Critical Contributor
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    @Scofie said:

    @liminal_lad said:
    Are we going to get an answer on this? I have been very vocal in my support of the new devs, but it would be great to get some clarity while the offer is still up.

    Just a an update: Announcement is still going through Marvel approvals. Supports won't go into PvP (at least not yet - not ruling it out in the future) - can't without UI changes anyway. Kamar-Taj will rotate into Support packs at season change.

    Hope that helps.

    Big help! All the answers I needed. Thanks.

  • Omegased
    Omegased Posts: 581 Critical Contributor
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    @S0kun said:
    Our next blog is going to be a good one folks. Apologies for not having it ready this week, but some of your questions will be answered next week if things go as planned. Fingers crossed!

    Will this be out before the current sale is finished? Any other way to get it outside of the standard token rotation?

  • atomzed
    atomzed Posts: 1,753 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2023
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    Hmm, the Kamar-Taj support level 1 ability seems to be working differently from what I expected. I thought that it will only trigger the first time in the battle, but it seems to trigger EVERYTIME an enhancement is done.

    I used Hela, Kitty and Wong (with Kamar-Taj support). The Kamar-Taj banner keeps triggering multiple times throughout the battle.

    I took a video and will try to find a way to post it. Edit:- Hmm, as a dinosaur I don’t have YouTube channel, so I cant find a way to post it. But I counted the number of times the banner pops up, it trigger 10x in battle.

    Opps, there was a typo. I am sorry Wong, please don’t teleport me to the mountains!