Why Developer inaction kills playerbase activity within the game.

Phumade

Without rehashing all the arguments listed in other thread.  I simply want to show everyone an example of why its important for developers to keep innovating and addressing player complaints.  

Specifically the death of Lighting Rounds activity.

From my personal perspective, LRs used to be the best part of MPQ.  The short duration of each LR encouraged players to experiment and try out different strategies and playstyles.  You could snipe, coordinate and grill, or simply harvest gold to 250,  literally any approach to the game could be explored.  And its still a great play mode if the Devs could ever be bothered to update them with new essentials or even new/different rulesets.

Does anyone remember the last time they ever bothered to update LRs?  Honestly, it seems like they get annoyed when we remind them to turn on double iso at the appropriate times.

What is the result?  LRs are now the most stagnant and least engaging part of the game (maybe the story tab is worse, but I assumed that was for onboarding new players).  especially compared to "Welcome to",  Introducing,  The support prize events, Deadpool daily,  main pve, main pve game modes.

Are LRs even relevant to any player in the 4* tier?  Probably not since they are effectively stuck using a 2* character with big roster combo pairs.  The current resource environment essentially bootstraps player rosters past the point where they care about LR events. (i.e. its good that the game speeds players into the high 3*/4* range, but that effectively makes it harder for them to try out new advanced play approaches)

Even simple changes like including new char rotations, a 4*/5* LR or simply requiring only 3* for this iteration, then 4* for next LR etc would inject alot of utility and interest as players are forced to try out new interactions in a low risk/ low consequence environment.

I am not privy to engagement numbers,  but I'm guessing LRs rank about as high as the Story tab does on the devs radar and its a real shame.

It is what it is, I just point this out to show you that when the developers can't be bother to respond and  address player complaints.  The result is the slow painful death of a once great game mode.

I.e. ignore player complaints and watch the whole game become a LR wasteland.

entrailbucket

Were you around when LRs were villains only?  They finally added heroes after a long time.  I think that's the only thing that changed.

LRs were pretty relevant in 2014...I remember getting my last Magneto cover from LR when those were impossible to get and he was the best character in the game.  I haven't played an LR at all in probably 5 years though, and I don't think I ever actually enjoyed them.


I guess I get why you're saying this but I'm not sure why you're saying it now.  LR have been stagnant and irrelevant since...forever. 

jredd

lightning rounds arn't worth my time. i already play this game too much. now, if the rewards were better i might dabble a bit more. 

i will agree that multiple aspects of this game are grossly neglected though (character rebalances, supports would top my list) 

BriMan2222

The only time I ever touch a lightning round is the rare time one pops up at the same time I need to win one pvp battle for the daily quest. 

entrailbucket

I feel like boosted 5* eliminated the need for rebalancing all but a few characters -- and remember, boosted 5* are a pretty recent change.

All they really need to do to balance the whole 5* tier is buff the 4 or 5 guys that are unusable even when they're boosted, and, uh, the-opposite-of-buff the 4 or 5 guys that are usable unboosted.

Supports are such a weird mess right now that I really have no suggestions for how they can fix them.

Godzillafan67

I play them. I don’t love them, but I need all the drips of iso I can squeeze out of the game. At the very least, rotating the middle character would be an improvement. I of course would also like them to yield more rewards for my time, but I don’t wish to be labeled greedy and will silently, head bowed down, accept whatever gruel I’m gifted.

Phumade

All valid criticism and yet LRs are guaranteed to show up every week on Tuesdays and Wed.  Its the most consistently run and least utilized game mode.  Retire it so that the devs can run something with better engagement or at least try to make a good faith / low effort change to show that they pay lip service to player comments.

My only real commentary here is that I'm sure they will respond to the cheating reports the exact same way they respond to LR comments.

Its a real shame because even a simple change like changing the featured essential to the last 6 releases would guarantee a ton of player engagement (which I thought based on the old venture beat article was the only metric that mattered)

https://venturebeat.com/2014/04/15/marvel-puzzle-quests-road-to-the-mythical-1-arpdau-part-3-event-design-improvements/

SnowcaTT

I'm probably T5 all time in number of matches played in LR's.

I've almost completely stopped playing them because a couple of specific very, very obvious hackers.

I mean, I guess they could be spending hundreds of HP every two hours.

Or [and stay with me here]....obvious hacks are obvious, and are not cared about by D3.

Bad

Well you are posting it so, but except one user you are all vets without need for iso.
I use to play too and try to get some heroics too.
I would love new content and many times I have posted it without any of you appearing, by the way. 
And I need to play LR. Changing the middle character would be nice for a bit of a change imo.
However one thing is what we'd like and another is the reality.
If no one played LR you can be sure it wouldn't be there. I bet it's played massively for new players, yes those type of players really few of us can track. For these players could be troublesome to be changing the middle character or possibly always playing a loaned as these players still haven't a developed roster.

Phumade

Bad said:

Well you are posting it so, but except one user you are all vets without need for iso.
I use to play too and try to get some heroics too.
I would love new content and many times I have posted it without any of you appearing, by the way. 
And I need to play LR. Changing the middle character would be nice for a bit of a change imo.
However one thing is what we'd like and another is the reality.
If no one played LR you can be sure it wouldn't be there. I bet it's played massively for new players, yes those type of players really few of us can track. For these players could be troublesome to be changing the middle character or possibly always playing a loaned as these players still haven't a developed roster.

Actually its pretty easy to track.  They only have one bracket at a time and you can tank to the bottom.  Its generally smaller than one bracket in regular pvp.

HoundofShadow

I find that shield sim is better for testing out strategies because no one is boosted and it's a pick-3 instead of a pick 2. It has a 24-25 days (?) limit instead of 3 days limit per week. I would like them to run Balance of Power more often because everyone is at 550. And you can pair 1* with 5*, 2* with 5* etc. While max match damage isn't the same for all tiers, I think their power damage are similiar?

Given that pvps have low participation, I don't think LR is a priority. I think the main priority is to increase participation in pvps as a whole rather than limiting it to LRs. The last time they added wins to pvps, I read that participation actually decreased instead of increasing. I'm not sure if it was a short term effect or a permanent effect because that's the last I heard of it. I wonder if adding 5* shards past 75 wins will increase or decrease participations for non-5* players.

Bad

Phumade said:

Actually its pretty easy to track.  They only have one bracket at a time and you can tank to the bottom.  Its generally smaller than one bracket in regular pvp.

A new player will play LR totally in a casual way.
At least when I started playing I usually played 2 or 3 battles until the enemies were impossible to beat. But with a roster of a few 2* covers it was really fun to play a loaned 3* with all powers.
I didn't know even when LR were active or if it was coming another round.
A new player cannot be measured on brackets nor the benefits that having that option to play can grant.

Phumade

HoundofShadow said:

I find that shield sim is better for testing out strategies because no one is boosted and it's a pick-3 instead of a pick 2. It has a 24-25 days (?) limit instead of 3 days limit per week. I would like them to run Balance of Power more often because everyone is at 550. And you can pair 1* with 5*, 2* with 5* etc. While max match damage isn't the same for all tiers, I think their power damage are similiar?

Given that pvps have low participation, I don't think LR is a priority. I think the main priority is to increase participation in pvps as a whole rather than limiting it to LRs. The last time they added wins to pvps, I read that participation actually decreased instead of increasing. I'm not sure if it was a short term effect or a permanent effect because that's the last I heard of it. I wonder if adding 5* shards past 75 wins will increase or decrease participations for non-5* players.

Well that is the beauty of a 2hr event.  You can try lots of different formats and log many different datasets.  Announce your format for this week LRs.  See the participation, match played, high score, median scores, and quartile results.  All basic statistical measures.

Then announce a new format for the next week and compare the results.

Phumade

HoundofShadow said:

I find that shield sim is better for testing out strategies because no one is boosted and it's a pick-3 instead of a pick 2. It has a 24-25 days (?) limit instead of 3 days limit per week. I would like them to run Balance of Power more often because everyone is at 550. And you can pair 1* with 5*, 2* with 5* etc. While max match damage isn't the same for all tiers, I think their power damage are similiar?

I do like the idea of running BoP one event, then Combined Arms the next lr, maybe the lastest release next.  All good suggestions and existing events that should be easily repurposed.

Lots of events already exist and the still can't be bothered to make a change.

sad

DAZ0273

Phumade said:

HoundofShadow said:

I find that shield sim is better for testing out strategies because no one is boosted and it's a pick-3 instead of a pick 2. It has a 24-25 days (?) limit instead of 3 days limit per week. I would like them to run Balance of Power more often because everyone is at 550. And you can pair 1* with 5*, 2* with 5* etc. While max match damage isn't the same for all tiers, I think their power damage are similiar?

Given that pvps have low participation, I don't think LR is a priority. I think the main priority is to increase participation in pvps as a whole rather than limiting it to LRs. The last time they added wins to pvps, I read that participation actually decreased instead of increasing. I'm not sure if it was a short term effect or a permanent effect because that's the last I heard of it. I wonder if adding 5* shards past 75 wins will increase or decrease participations for non-5* players.

Well that is the beauty of a 2hr event.  You can try lots of different formats and log many different datasets.  Announce your format for this week LRs.  See the participation, match played, high score, median scores, and quartile results.  All basic statistical measures.

Then announce a new format for the next week and compare the results.

Sounds like potentially a lot of work for a small Dev team. They couldn't keep up with even updating the Forum until Neko arrived, not sure where the manpower to do all that would be conjured from.

Still - would be nice to have something new/different.

Phumade

Bad said:

Phumade said:

Actually its pretty easy to track.  They only have one bracket at a time and you can tank to the bottom.  Its generally smaller than one bracket in regular pvp.

A new player will play LR totally in a casual way.
At least when I started playing I usually played 2 or 3 battles until the enemies were impossible to beat. But with a roster of a few 2* covers it was really fun to play a loaned 3* with all powers.
I didn't know even when LR were active or if it was coming another round.
A new player cannot be measured on brackets nor the benefits that having that option to play can grant.

hehe  That point is fair and reasonable until the game bootstraps players into the 3* tier.  As I said earlier, the game now throws more than enough resources to push players into 3* land within what 60 days?  In year 1 when I first started this game, you could reasonable assume that you'd be in 2-3* land for a year plus+

Now I think @Bigler got to 3* land in 3 weeks on his latest roster restart.  

Are LRs meant solely for on-boarding new players?  Maybe this should just move it straight to the story tab.

HoundofShadow

Actually, what was the history of LR and why did they create LR? What goal do they have in mind back then?

Bad

Phumade said:

Are LRs meant solely for on-boarding new players?  Maybe this should just move it straight to the story tab.

I repeat mostly of you are not iso needing.
But a 3 year player like me needs to play LR regularly for to continue leveling new and old characters. 

Phumade

Bad said:

Phumade said:

Are LRs meant solely for on-boarding new players?  Maybe this should just move it straight to the story tab.

I repeat mostly of you are not iso needing.
But a 3 year player like me needs to play LR regularly for to continue leveling new and old characters. 

huh?

Are you implying that older rosters should be prohibited out from playing LRs?

You do know they can keep giving iso out in any new revamp of LRs.  I thought you wrote in your post that changing the featured essential would be a good change.

In any case,  its pretty sad that the only current reason to engage in LR plays is to harvest iso and heroics.  It used to be good for practicing tactics and developing communication skills for alot of players.  I remember when MEGA whales would come play.  It took a lot of tactics and coordination to stop them from taking a T2 slot.  That was the same skillset that would be needed to take T5 in a main pvp event with Big Room support. 

(Here is a news flash for all readers.  LRs actually use the original form of MMR and you can still grill a 1* CC if you want to experience the original form of baking.  Its actually quite different and challenging vs using a 550 okie, 370 chavez, 166 loaner )

Your comment pretty much sums up my main point.  the Lack of developer attention to the game has devolved LRs into mere iso harvesting.  Any one of the suggested changes would reinvigorate player participation as they experiment with new releases or test out new combos paired with a new essential.

Its pretty depressing but 100% accurate statement to think that all the game modes will simply devolve down to iso harvesting if the developers are unwilling to update and refresh the rulesets.

I remember when people would goto to story mode to try and use OBW to TRUE heal chars against venom.  At least that was a compelling reason to visit the story tab.

entrailbucket

HoundofShadow said:

Actually, what was the history of LR and why did they create LR? What goal do they have in mind back then?

They've been in the game since the beginning.  PvP was quite different then -- events lasted a full week and there were no shields yet.  Shield sim existed but it didn't have start and end times, it just ran forever.

Also, 3* were the top of the meta, and the villains that were featured were the best characters in the game.  Placement was extremely competitive for those covers.  (Players could buy covers for HP back then, but no one spent money on the game -- the biggest whale in the community had spent a couple hundred dollars at most)

I don't think they've talked about the whys of LR but my guess is that they wanted to create a "lightning" version of PvP to provide an alternative to the weeklong or forever-long events.  The villains were probably featured because they were the most sought-after covers.

Colognoisseur

When I had the opportunity to talk with Ice IX At NYCC seven years ago the why of LRs was simple. They were a place for players to mine iso. In those early days with a two character 4* tier and only 2&3* that was ideal. I played them like crazy and never found myself short of iso to keep up with new releases. Which is what was intended. Now they are obsoleted by all the developments since. I still play them because they were such a large part of my early time in MPQ.