5* tier list for PvP and PvE

LucasRaven

Daniel2121 said:

Knull is good against Apoc event boss. His ability to deal permanent damage cuts down Apoc's regenerating health until you can kill him without deleting his Four Horsemen tiles. Has this been said?

Yeah, by Daniel2121

fight4thedream

New Characters

Abigail Brand
PvP rating: D
PvE rating: ???

Elektra
PvP rating:  B
PvE rating:  ???

Crystal
PvP rating:  B
PvE rating:  B

Gargantos
PvP rating:   B
PvE rating:   ???

658_2

I’ve been surprised at how much of a nothing Elektra is on defense, even boosted. I thought the yellow would be going off all the time, but I’ve hit 10-20
Elektras and not sure I’ve eaten it once. Boosted Abigail Brand with Wanda was actually a little bit annoying, which is more than I can say for Elektra. 

Vhailorx

658_2 said:

I’ve been surprised at how much of a nothing Elektra is on defense, even boosted. I thought the yellow would be going off all the time, but I’ve hit 10-20
Elektras and not sure I’ve eaten it once. Boosted Abigail Brand with Wanda was actually a little bit annoying, which is more than I can say for Elektra. 

I suspect this is a feature of the dumb ai. It doesn't know to get 6 quick yellow to start her defensive cycle.  Plus you know to deny it if possible. 

The other problem with elektra yellow is that it's only 3 damage ticks.  That is only 1-2 turns on average, since so many opponents will produce multiple damage ticks via cascade or special tiles.  So I think in practice her yellow is a little harder to leverage than it should be.  It can easily disappear the same turn it is cast and yet never mitigate damage from the most dangerous attack you face that turn.  That's not ideal for a defensive power. 

658_2

Boy, boosted Crystal is pretty damn impressive. She’s in that Deadpool and Warlock class where it’s like hitting an entirely different (deadlier) character

658_2

Polaris/Okoye/KK is a crazy fast and deadly team. I’ve been screwing around with it for a couple weeks in sim and just took it to 75 wins with a 1/1/1 lvl 300 KK (510 Okoye, 323 Polaris). Other than retals I only hit opponents with at least one character over 500, and hit every single 550 I could. Blasted through teams left and right. Really didn’t struggle with anything but 550 Hulkoye. Okoye/KK/Pol eats BRB and Col teams alive. Zero defensive value obviously 

Chirus

658_2 said:

Polaris/Okoye/KK is a crazy fast and deadly team. I’ve been screwing around with it for a couple weeks in sim and just took it to 75 wins with a 1/1/1 lvl 300 KK (510 Okoye, 323 Polaris). Other than retals I only hit opponents with at least one character over 500, and hit every single 550 I could. Blasted through teams left and right. Really didn’t struggle with anything but 550 Hulkoye. Okoye/KK/Pol eats BRB and Col teams alive. Zero defensive value obviously 

What was your strategy with this team setup? Did you go for Polaris stun first or KK's Blue?

658_2

First priority match specials. Second, match TU. Third, stun with Polaris and add 8 strikes to board. KK’s blue is far inferior to Polaris’s blue on this team. So, I always prioritize flooding the board with specials asap, and then it’s double dipping the boosted damage, combined with Polaris’s start of turn passive. Kamala’s green turns into the nuke of nukes on this team. I should mention that I was doing this without actively matching blue or green, since one cascade can down a lvl 300 KK. 

To lay out the math. My Okoye does 2098 added damage per TU, so with 10 TU that’s 20,980 added damage, and it goes to KK *and* Polaris’s passive each time a special is matched or destroyed (KK’s on friendlies only). *Every* friendly special matched or destroyed adds 41k damage. Even Scarlet Witch dies quick when the damage starts getting that big and it entirely evades Colossus’s passive. If KK’s green (which costs 7) hits 4 tiles and Okoye has 10 TU, that’s more than 160k damage and it’s not contained to the initial target as the damage is calculated sequentially. Plus 12 more friendly specials get added to the board. Everything dies.

If Polaris’s initial special gets placed in an unfavorable spot it can take a minute to get going, but you still have the start of turn passive and then KK’s yellow puts so many yellow protects on the board that the match is over in another couple turns.

Good team. Can’t wait for JThor to drop so I can champ her and KK.

Vhailorx

658_2 said:

First priority match specials. Second, match TU. Third, stun with Polaris and add 8 strikes to board. KK’s blue is far inferior to Polaris’s blue on this team. So, I always prioritize flooding the board with specials asap, and then it’s double dipping the boosted damage, combined with Polaris’s start of turn passive. Kamala’s green turns into the nuke of nukes on this team. I should mention that I was doing this without actively matching blue or green, since one cascade can down a lvl 300 KK. 

To lay out the math. My Okoye does 2098 added damage per TU, so with 10 TU that’s 20,980 added damage, and it goes to KK *and* Polaris’s passive each time a special is matched or destroyed (KK’s on friendlies only). *Every* friendly special matched or destroyed adds 41k damage. Even Scarlet Witch dies quick when the damage starts getting that big and it entirely evades Colossus’s passive. If KK’s green (which costs 7) hits 4 tiles and Okoye has 10 TU, that’s more than 160k damage and it’s not contained to the initial target as the damage is calculated sequentially. Plus 12 more friendly specials get added to the board. Everything dies.

If Polaris’s initial special gets placed in an unfavorable spot it can take a minute to get going, but you still have the start of turn passive and then KK’s yellow puts so many yellow protects on the board that the match is over in another couple turns.

Good team. Can’t wait for JThor to drop so I can champ her and KK.

You must have a high level okoye if she does 2k+ or tu.  Those of us with baby champ okoye will have a harder time getting her to tank over kk.  I look forward to trying this team myself in a few months when I get more kk covers though. Is Apoc a better play (if you don't need true healing)?

658_2

Yeah, my Okoye is 510. I assume any champed Okoye will tank TU until Kamala is way bigger, so with only yellow overlap shouldn’t be too hard to keep a healthy supply with baby champ Okoye. The only problem with Apoc is that you have to cast yellow to get his boost going. With Okoye, if there is TU available on the board, I’d rather match it and save the yellow for KK. If KK’s yellow is out, the match is over super fast. 

fight4thedream

New Characters

Kamala Khan
PvP rating: C
PvE rating: A**/B   (A if player has Supports that generate yellow/black AP and paired with Apocalypse)

Mighty Thor
PvP rating: A
PvE rating: C

Chasm
PvP rating:  A
PvE rating:  C

Rank update

Apocalypse
PvP: A
PvE: S**/A (up from A)  [S when player has Supports that generate yellow/black AP]

Immortal Hulk
PvP: A (up from B )
PvE: A (no change)

Jessica Jones
PvP: C (down from B )
PvE: ??? (no change)

Kitty Pryde
PvP: B (down from A)
PvE: A (no change)

New PvE Effective teams
Apocalypse/Beta Ray Bill/Kamala Khan (**requires: supports that generate yellow/black and use of AP boosts) 
Apocalypse/Kamala Khan/ 5* Thor (Gladiator)
Apocalypse/Gorr/ 5* Thor (Gladiator)
Gorr/Okoye/5* Thor (Gladiator)

For easy nodes featuring Mindless Ones
Chasm/iHulk/Thanos

Notes: Kamala Khan PvE competitive value is largely dependent on whether the player has good supports that can generate yellow and black AP during the match.  For PvP, she is ok but suffers from the problem that there are usually better partners for the characters she pairs well with. With that said, she is great for pick-3 events. 

Mighty Thor's PvE value is a bit of a toss up. Her best partner is Shang-Chi but he partners better with other characters (America Chavez, Melinda May, Thor (Gladiator) and Valkyrie). Additionally, her constant banner displays eat up time and charged tiles can be a double-edged sword against tile-moving opponents. Still I think she has potential, especially if CL 11 ever gets released. 

Chasm has resurrected iHulk in PvP and can go toe-to-toe against most other meta characters, even on his own. Really good for opening nodes in PvE events and a counter to Mindless Ones nodes, so has a good niche role there. Still not certain it's worth taking him into harder nodes with Mindless Ones since he burns the player AP supply but perhaps there is something I am missing there. 

dianetics

Just want toss something out there since I tried out your Apoc BRB KK team. It is decent but not great. 

 I find a lot more success and faster wins with Apoc Crystal and SW. Less damage reduction, but the healing helps with mitigation.
 I don’t think that ABK is that effective. I’ll keep running it this PvE to give it the benefit of the doubt, it is very slow, and there are more effective damage reduction teams.

Sekilicious

dianetics said:

Just want toss something out there since I tried out your Apoc BRB KK team. It is decent but not great. 

 I find a lot more success and faster wins with Apoc Crystal and SW. Less damage reduction, but the healing helps with mitigation.
 I don’t think that ABK is that effective. I’ll keep running it this PvE to give it the benefit of the doubt, it is very slow, and there are more effective damage reduction teams.

As F4D stated Apoc, BRB, KK is very support dependent. If you have r3 Korg, r3 Sanctum Santorum, (for yellow at start) and r4 Ebony Maw (for +black) then it is insanely fast unless bad board. The 2+r/y and 2+g/b ap boosts are probably necessary as well. Fire Apoc’s yellow then black triggering KK passive green and BRB’s passive yellow on turn 2? Potentially turn 1 with 5* Tinkerer support? Yes please. I run it with just Korg and SS and it when it hits on all cylinders it is pretty great, even though my KK is not yet champed. It would be so much better if Apoc was at lvl 550 though.

Without those supports or the desire to boost it is as you suggested. Decent but nothing to write home about.

fight4thedream

@dianetics: My apologies, I should have made it clearer that you need supports that give you AP and use AP boosts for that team to reach max efficiency. I have updated my posts to better reflect this.

@Sekilicious: Thank you! Your explanation is spot on (and glad to see your back!) . 

Jimsta_rooney

Apoc/Kk/polaris is another good pve team.
Often games are over by third turn.
If no black supports you can put yaro root/atlantis on and generate green instead of black.
Kks green and apocs black are very similar.
Polaris for the extra special tile generator and double dips.

Sekilicious

Jimsta_rooney said:

Apoc/Kk/polaris is another good pve team.
Often games are over by third turn.
If no black supports you can put yaro root/atlantis on and generate green instead of black.
Kks green and apocs black are very similar.
Polaris for the extra special tile generator and double dips.

Thanks for this. I just got the r4 Atlantis and didn’t think of putting it on Apoc for some reason. Switching Polaris in for BRB is faster with my baby champed squad, imo. It does lack the ap gained from tile destruction but it is much easier to fill the screen with tiles

fight4thedream

Jimsta_rooney said:

Apoc/Kk/polaris is another good pve team.
Often games are over by third turn.
If no black supports you can put yaro root/atlantis on and generate green instead of black.
Kks green and apocs black are very similar.
Polaris for the extra special tile generator and double dips.

Nice! Added to PvE teams section. 

fnedude

So CN I use SC+1/2Thor+4Black Widow.  Use +Yellow AP supports.  Sometimes I can start w/ 10Y AP w/ the 3 i have.

Once you have 10Y AP (and enough AP for SC), you cast 4BBW Yellow.  Now SC's powers cost only 4AP to use.  You engage Winfinite and you start rolling in the damage.

Admittedly, i'm done being competitive SCL10, the damage builds quickly.

Sekilicious

I tried using Apocalypse/Polaris/and newly champed Kamala Khan in the Polaris PvP and it was slow and boring. Switch to Pick-3 PvP and it is probably my fastest team right now. It is crazy the difference supports make 

Codex

I think apoc/px/Emma. With purple and yellow support and +2 r/y, b/p is pretty fast as well. Maybe not on challenge nodes