PvP Main Season points shouldn't decrease.

Milk Jugz

carrion pigeons said:

__________________

carrion pigeons said:....Oh, yes, I have loads of 270s on my roster.  Waitaminnit...

I am so jealous! I have loads of characters I wish were up to 270. Would you believe I haven't got a single 270? A 267 ... a 271 ... not a single 270.

Oh ... you were being sarcastic? No 270s there either? Hey, bright side: we could be "no-270s-havin" roster buddies!

I actually have no idea what you're trying to say here, so I'm guessing we're talking past each other.  Let me try to be more plain.

I am a 3* player thrust into face-offs with champed 4*s, and partially levelled 5*s, neither of which I have any of.  I do not see 3* teams.  I view this as a problem with PvP.

There are thousands of 3* players I *could* be matched against, but I'm not.  I assume this is because I have a lot of roster slots or some other similar reason.  The fact remains that the upshot is I'm facing teams 60-80 levels higher than anything I can field, and this makes matches take too long to compete for meaningful rewards, in addition to making the game excessively boring.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you don't really have that problem.  I seem to recall you saying more than once that players don't lose.  Well, I lose maybe one match in four, in PvP, specifically because of bad matchmaking.

Looking at your gamependium roster, assuming it is fairly up to date? You seem to be right on the cusp of 4* territory, that may be your problem also. You have a very solid 3* roster, I imagine boost weeks are pretty good for you? I suggest maxing your 11 cover 4*s, and setting them as BH. Once you have them covered, champ them and the 2 you have at 13 already. You're very close to the jump!!! It will make your Versus experience better (and keep getting better as you cover and champ more 4s). Good luck!!!!

aesthetocyst

carrion pigeons said: ....  [1] I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you don't really have that problem.  [2] I seem to recall you saying more than once that players don't lose.  [3] Well, I lose maybe one match in four, in PvP, specifically because of bad matchmaking.

1.  The next time I am cycling endlessly through a great selection of 3 monster rosters, I'll be hoping that limb hasn't let you down. Trust me, the matchmaking is what it is. It gives everyone challenging matches at certain points of PVP. I see the same on both accounts. Power through or take a break.

2.  Say what? IceIX once said, right here on the forum, that players win 90% of the time, but that was a long time ago.Pretty sure I've quoted that in various ways for various reasons, but saying players don't lose, no. RNG along ensures everyone loses, and failing that, crashes will "lose" for you now and again. Does seem to be less crashing since last update though. Finally? Yay. (I probably just ruined it).

3.  Losing 1 in 4??? That sounds like bad matchtaking. Or poor preparation (lineups, boosts). You don't have to take what's on offer. If the game is serving nothing but poor options (and it frequently does .....), despite skipping, then either take a break and come back and skip some more, or take on some of those qs. Try to win them of course (boost like crazy, drop whales, use a troll team), but sometimes it means dropping a few.

Vets are not playing a different game. A different level, sure, but these assumptions, that we're floating on clouds and plucking free rewards, are silly. We're facing the same quirks and challenges, often in more pointed fashion. The difference is vets are playing the game as-is, and getting it done (hopefully), rather than complaining here, win or lose.

giotorres81

carrion pigeons said:

My personal experience in PvP:

Enter the event, do the seeds.  Do one more fight against a team of 270s, get super bored, realize I have to do at least 10 more and probably more like 30 more before I get anything worthwhile at it, and quit.

I expect that's a pretty typical experience among non-LINE players.  PvP sucks.

And you don't get bored of the amount of fights against the same enemies over and over in pve before getting something worthwhile?

Spudgutter

giotorres81 said:

carrion pigeons said:

My personal experience in PvP:

Enter the event, do the seeds.  Do one more fight against a team of 270s, get super bored, realize I have to do at least 10 more and probably more like 30 more before I get anything worthwhile at it, and quit.

I expect that's a pretty typical experience among non-LINE players.  PvP sucks.

And you don't get bored of the amount of fights against the same enemies over and over in pve before getting something worthwhile?

Not who you are asking, but i see this asked from time to time.

No, because every 4 matches in pve, the opposing team changes and i get varying levels of iso, tokens and cp, all while moving the progression bar towards better rewards and a stash of cp at the end.  Not to mention i can play those sets of 4 on practically any order i want, at any time without messing with shields, forcing me not to play.  Spread it out to 6 times, and now i get 90xp at least.

In pvp, after the seed teams, it is 80% or more of just the required 3* with any combination of 2 of the 4 boosted and champed 4* that week.  That, to me, is boring.

Rod5

Spudgutter said:

giotorres81 said:

carrion pigeons said:

My personal experience in PvP:

Enter the event, do the seeds.  Do one more fight against a team of 270s, get super bored, realize I have to do at least 10 more and probably more like 30 more before I get anything worthwhile at it, and quit.

I expect that's a pretty typical experience among non-LINE players.  PvP sucks.

And you don't get bored of the amount of fights against the same enemies over and over in pve before getting something worthwhile?

Not who you are asking, but i see this asked from time to time.

No, because every 4 matches in pve, the opposing team changes and i get varying levels of iso, tokens and cp, all while moving the progression bar towards better rewards and a stash of cp at the end.  Not to mention i can play those sets of 4 on practically any order i want, at any time without messing with shields, forcing me not to play.  Spread it out to 6 times, and now i get 90xp at least.

In pvp, after the seed teams, it is 80% or more of just the required 3* with any combination of 2 of the 4 boosted and champed 4* that week.  That, to me, is boring.

You make out like there's variety of teams in PvE - the reality is that aside from a couple of events it's just a relentless procession of Dark avengers.

Milk Jugz

Rod5 said:

Spudgutter said:

giotorres81 said:

carrion pigeons said:

My personal experience in PvP:

Enter the event, do the seeds.  Do one more fight against a team of 270s, get super bored, realize I have to do at least 10 more and probably more like 30 more before I get anything worthwhile at it, and quit.

I expect that's a pretty typical experience among non-LINE players.  PvP sucks.

And you don't get bored of the amount of fights against the same enemies over and over in pve before getting something worthwhile?

Not who you are asking, but i see this asked from time to time.

No, because every 4 matches in pve, the opposing team changes and i get varying levels of iso, tokens and cp, all while moving the progression bar towards better rewards and a stash of cp at the end.  Not to mention i can play those sets of 4 on practically any order i want, at any time without messing with shields, forcing me not to play.  Spread it out to 6 times, and now i get 90xp at least.

In pvp, after the seed teams, it is 80% or more of just the required 3* with any combination of 2 of the 4 boosted and champed 4* that week.  That, to me, is boring.

You make out like there's variety of teams in PvE - the reality is that aside from a couple of events it's just a relentless procession of Dark avengers.

Or goons...  Or symbiotes....

Really the only events that offer variety are the 2 everyone tinykitties about- Simulator and Gauntlet 

Kahmon

...and Deadpool versus MPQ.

Milk Jugz

Kahmon said:

...and Deadpool versus MPQ.

Oh yes, forgot about that one. Thank you!! 

Spudgutter

Rod5 said:

Spudgutter said:

giotorres81 said:

carrion pigeons said:

My personal experience in PvP:

Enter the event, do the seeds.  Do one more fight against a team of 270s, get super bored, realize I have to do at least 10 more and probably more like 30 more before I get anything worthwhile at it, and quit.

I expect that's a pretty typical experience among non-LINE players.  PvP sucks.

And you don't get bored of the amount of fights against the same enemies over and over in pve before getting something worthwhile?

Not who you are asking, but i see this asked from time to time.

No, because every 4 matches in pve, the opposing team changes and i get varying levels of iso, tokens and cp, all while moving the progression bar towards better rewards and a stash of cp at the end.  Not to mention i can play those sets of 4 on practically any order i want, at any time without messing with shields, forcing me not to play.  Spread it out to 6 times, and now i get 90xp at least.

In pvp, after the seed teams, it is 80% or more of just the required 3* with any combination of 2 of the 4 boosted and champed 4* that week.  That, to me, is boring.

You make out like there's variety of teams in PvE - the reality is that aside from a couple of events it's just a relentless procession of Dark avengers.

There are.  

The question was "same enemies over and over."  Across 12 or so nodes in the first day of TaT,  there are about 10 or 12 different opponents in different combos.  In roughly the same number of matches, taking approximately the same amount of time in the Sentry pvp, i see sentry paired up with Cage, JG and Mordo.  In the previous pvp, it was the same. And the pvp before that, the same. So, probably 60 or so pvp matches, 75% had those same three characters. You throw in antman, and it rises to probably 85%.  

How is having 4 times as many opponents less variety?

giotorres81

I play pve also and I see more variety in pvp even at 5* level of play, maybe is time to level up your five stars spudgutter.
Or is it gonna make Pvp harder for you?

You all keep saying that pve is the most fun node, then explain how fighting the same easy fight 3×5 beatable with 1 move, 3 medium level with 1 or 2 out of the 3 enemies being the same as the easy fight sometimes for 7 day events is fun?

Don't make pvp the same grinding thing where everyone gets a cover.
I dont even care if the 4* cover is handed to everyone just for joining, I care more about the Cp and the mechanics of pvp is play.
And no I do not cordinate on Line neither I am a whale (maybe I've spent £20 in this game) and I can get to top 5 some events.

Spidurman27

PVE is more fun for some because they understand how to win (max prog) at it.  PVP is always about either getting the rewards you can without shielding (can be frustrating) or shielding/hopping for higher score than your float point.  Totally different gameplay, introduced halfway through.  

It it took me a little while to get used to pvp and imo there's a huge chasm in terms of effort/reward between 575 and 900, where there's minimal accessible  upside in between.  That gap is tough to want to overcome until you're running boosted champ 4s.  

As far as pvp season rewards - only one that really matters is at 4k - after that it's very minimal and just incidental to the work required.  

ZootSax

Kahmon said:

...and Deadpool versus MPQ.

To be fair, people only complain about DPvsMPQ because the two 48hr subs makes the rewards less than a typical 4 day event (even if progression is much easier), along with the associated decreased margin of error for Top 10 play.  The actual nodes in that event aren't overly painful and cycle through the available characters at the time of the event's release pretty effectively.

Both PVE & PVP are repetitive grinds. The difference is that PVP is 7 days of repetition and PVE is either 3, 4 or 7 days of repetition.  Honestly, that's one of the reasons why Strange Sight seems to be many people's favorite event: the opponents change daily and there's a puzzly boss battle to mix things up.  No other event in PVE or PVP has anything like that kind of variety...except for the early parts of the off-season PVP test, when people were totally goofing off with their team selection.

elvy75

@carrion pigeons you joined this forum only two months after i did, which means you are way over your 1000 days of playing (assuming you haven't made breaks). If you just played pve entire that time, you would be well into 4* land, but you are not. That means you don't really want to play much, but want all prizes ... its not how it goes

Now to get back on topic, OP idea is pretty bad, but it could work with certain tweaks. I know it is disheartening to transitioning players to compete in pvp. But i think that just number of wins is not the solution. Lots of people said they could q much more people after 575 points than they usually were able to. It was because points were available. Currently lots of transitioning rosters just stop after they get cp, and for those poor souls that are trying to get to 900 there is nothing left in their MMR. 3* rosters start seeing only 4* who are able to get to 900 points where they start seeing only 5*. Someone in that other big how to fix pvp thread actually had good idea. That you cant lose points below the last progression reward. So you manage to get to 575 points and on your road to 650 no matter how much you are hit you can't drop lower than 650. It is like a mini shield if you want it. This would make it much easier for people to climb to max progression reward, and would create lots of points in the slice, which would mean it would be easy even for 3* roster to get to 900 points. From 900-1200 gap is too wide and it would be the separation point for developing and developed rosters. However given that this method would lead to points inflation i am not sure that devs would actually ever try it.

Lucifier

to reduce point inflation, here is another idea.

1- same as you mentioned progression point counter separated from placement counter.
2- when you got attacked (either they win or they lose) you don't lose progression points.
3- when you attack others in case you win, you get points added, *** in case you lose, you lose points ***.
why point 3 like this, to prevent player from losing purposely to go down in rank and fight back again easy targets, to hit 1200 easily (also this help to reduce inflation).

4- (this one a little complicated), if above implemented, the matching system will be better based on your progression points, so hitting 900 and 1200 will not be impossible, but also not very easy, but it may lead to inflation too, and may mess up the placement counter point too (in indirect way).
* not very sure about point 4 *

Spudgutter

giotorres81 said:

I play pve also and I see more variety in pvp even at 5* level of play, maybe is time to level up your five stars spudgutter.
Or is it gonna make Pvp harder for you?

You all keep saying that pve is the most fun node, then explain how fighting the same easy fight 3×5 beatable with 1 move, 3 medium level with 1 or 2 out of the 3 enemies being the same as the easy fight sometimes for 7 day events is fun?

Don't make pvp the same grinding thing where everyone gets a cover.
I dont even care if the 4* cover is handed to everyone just for joining, I care more about the Cp and the mechanics of pvp is play.
And no I do not cordinate on Line neither I am a whale (maybe I've spent £20 in this game) and I can get to top 5 some events.

You get top 5 in some events, without coordination,  so you obviously have the roster to take on different teams.  How long have you been at that level?  If you are in the top 5, how similar do you honestly think your experience is to a developing roster?

If i do raise my two 5* that are at 13/13 to 450, i may see more opponents, but i am not sure how many i can beat. I can get to 900 without coordination now, by playing the same teams over and over. So i should trade one headache for another?  

I'm not arguing one is more fun then the other, just that i see more variety in pve than i do pvp.  And also in pve, i use different teams.  One or two teams for easy nodes, different teams for the harder.  Depending on the essentials, maybe another team for those.  It's a grind either way, let's not kid ourselves. 

If they tweak it from the test, to what most are suggesting, everyone wins.  I've said it before, but i guess i have to say it again: lower the win count, put cp back into progression.  Everyone doesn't just "get the 4* cover."  Everyone who puts in some work gets the cover.  

K1NGY

Wow it was only yesterday I queried the OP scenario out to team mates about season points rocking back and forth and after reading this thread it now makes perfect sense. It was only 2 months ago I started even being interested in pvp. It was also only 3-4 mths ago I joined a competitive alliance....I actually now enjoy pvp and strive to get to at least 900 which for my roster is a great achievement. It’s also fun to get to 800 and play like heck to get to 900 while between these points I will start getting attacked. Sometimes pretty intense but fun at the same time. 900 success finally and shield super quick in hope somebody hasn’t hit you while trying to shield also intense ha ha. All in all I don’t mind the way pvp is now set, hard work pays off eventually and my roster will eventually become stronger because of it.

Ducky

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