PvP Main Season points shouldn't decrease.

nitefox1337

TL;DR: Read parts in Bold

Ok, maybe I don't remember correctly cause it's been a long time since I didn't play PvP, but just remembered that test they did about Win based rewards, and i was wondering.

So here's the deal.

As an example I will use the current Season PvP event.

There's this "Mind Season" main event.

Then there are shorter events linked to the mind season like "Made Man", "Starfall", and "Shield".

So, if I remember correctly, when you collect points for the shorter events and reach a threshold you get rewards from the shorter event and also the main event.

But when you lose points, you lose points from both events.

------- Why not fix the whole PvP problem by making so that you Can't lose points from the Main Season? Why the Main Season isn't just registering the maximum points I gathered from lower events?

What I mean is that if I win 300 points from "Made Man", but then lose 50, while "made man" will show 250 points, the Mind Season should show 300 points.

So "PvE" Free to Play players like myself would now definitely go back to PvP to get those rewards, won't care about losing points cause any points we win are at least still standing at the Main Season. This would help PvE players to target Main Season Progression Rewards only. (Not even Ranked!).

And about the ranking: PvP Players will be way ahead anyway, regardless since PvE players won't be able to progress that much. This wouldn't even affect the ranking.

So PvE Players will be able to focus on the progression Rewards of the Main Season, while PvP players will have Progression AND Ranking rewards.

-------

It's simple, it's elegant and it fixes so many problems:

- PvE players can enjoy challenging higher level players heroes for fun. (Cause for a PvE only player it's getting tiring to play against bullseye and moonstone over and over).

- PvP players get more noob to grind!. (other players can attack my heroes as many time as they won't since I won't care about the lower event, and focus only in progressing in the Main Season. So PvP becomes automatically noob friendly.

- PvP players still have rewards from lower events which is way more than the Main Event so their Roster are still legitimized.

- PvP players still have all incentives to be as competitive as before, especially with this change where they will need stronger Rosters to grind even more noob.

- PvE players get that progression rewards from PvP as they do in PvE.


------

This makes so much sense that I wonder why it isn't already like that?



PS: When I used to play PvP your points decreased from The Main Season too. I don't know if they changed it by then. If they did, then this thread is way too late!

GrumpySmurf1002

This does make a ton of sense, it's a wonder it hasn't been brought up before on here.

Unless.......

Daiches

If you wouldn't lose points from season, it would radically change how the game is played and it would reward those staying low hitting 75 after 75. You would need 100k just to finish season t100. No one would purchase a shield ever again. Etc... lol

JHawkInc

Daiches said:

If you wouldn't lose points from season, it would radically change how the game is played and it would reward those staying low hitting 75 after 75. You would need 100k just to finish season t100. No one would purchase a shield ever again. Etc... lol

No it wouldn't. Not the way the OP proposed it.

Qubort

You could just pick a buddy and retal each other garbage teams. People would hit season progression in the 1st event. Shields would be used like sim where everyone uses just one to finish the event.

What you really want is more rewards for less effort. I'm in agreement with you of that aspect. Season rewards are way too low. If event progression is 1200, then season progression should be 12,000. Add in another tier of rewards. The rewards themselves are a joke considering the length of the season.

Huntah86

JHawkInc said:

Daiches said:

If you wouldn't lose points from season, it would radically change how the game is played and it would reward those staying low hitting 75 after 75. You would need 100k just to finish season t100. No one would purchase a shield ever again. Etc... lol

No it wouldn't. Not the way the OP proposed it.

How would it not change things? For the individual PVP's it wouldn't change anything but for the overall season rankings it would completely change everything.  Keeping your points low makes it easier to find high point matches and if you have a buddy you can just retal off each other over and over again and it would be the easiest climb imaginable since you couldn't care less about other people hitting you.

acescracked

I thought OP quit the game? And do I only read the bold parts of the post?

Wonko33

because major alliances would exploit the hell out of it.... they are why we can't have nice things

aesthetocyst

What is the "problem" with PvP and how does this fix the "whole" in it?

The net effect would be ..... Would beeeeeeeeee....

(are you ready for it?)

... Making season progresssions a bit easier to reach. Assuming those milestones werent just cranked upwards. 

Currently the season progression rewards are pitifully easy to achieve. And they arent lifechanging.

And .... "Who benefits most"? ...  People who dont bother shielding out, or who don't shield at all.

Yeah, the devs are totally incentivized to incentivize that.

broll

aesthetocyst said:

What is the "problem" with PvP and how does this fix the "whole" in it?

The net effect would be ..... Would beeeeeeeeee....

(are you ready for it?)

... Making season progresssions a bit easier to reach. Assuming those milestones werent just cranked upwards. 

Currently the season progression rewards are pitifully easy to achieve. And they arent lifechanging.

And .... "Who benefits most"? ...  People who dont bother shielding out, or who don't shield at all.

Yeah, the devs are totally incentivized to incentivize that.

Yes the devs should absolutely incentivize those not shielding because if everyone was shielded 100% of them time we'd all just be staring at each other with a few hundred points from the starter teams.

You and I have very different definitions of easy btw.

GrumpySmurf1002

broll said:

Yes the devs should absolutely incentivize those not shielding

This is correct

because if everyone was shielded 100% of them time we'd all just be staring at each other with a few hundred points from the starter teams.

However this is not.

Devs goal (among other things) is to encourage spending.  Creating easy to reach progression goals if anything will discourage spending, and thus won't happen.

revskip

My big problem with the OP is that Season rewards themselves are competitive both individually and as an alliance.  
This would benefit snipers who dump points to snipe and those who float and reclimb without ever using shields and punish guys who use shields effectively to climb.  It would also make picking certain slices even more important if were planning to try for any of the higher season rewards.  As it stands now you have a much easier time hitting top 10/25/50 if you are in slice 4 because of the massive scores that happen in that slice.  This would exacerbate that.

Milk Jugz

OMG!!!! Another fix PVP scoring thread!!!! I guess we haven't had one yet..... this week......

Removing point loss from ANY part of PVP completely invalidates the point of PVP.

I know, why don't we call it PVE+, make everyday have a 50 node sub, with the last one being an 8 wave node. As long as you beat everything over the 28 days you get 500 CP at the end!!!!

PVP scoring works as intended, PVP MMR, well, works for the most part. If you can't score high IT IS BECAUSE YOUR ROSTER IS NOT READY FOR THAT LEVEL YET!!!!!!!

Build your roster and the rewards will come......

Side note, apparently ignoring someone doesn't stop you from seeing threads they create. I clicked, read, then saw who...... And, now, have to comment......

Pants1000

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

Milk Jugz

Pants1000 said:

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

More mindless grinding.......

Why do you deserve those rewards? There are 2 other modes that give you rewards just for playing. It took me almost 2 years to build my roster to the point that I can consistently earn the 4* cover in PVP. (2 more 900s this season and it will be my first season of 900+ in every event). PVP scoring works as intended and I really, really, really hope the devs do not make progression win based. Just because it's there doesn't mean it should be handed to you.... Earn it!!!

Ducky

Milk Jugz said:

Pants1000 said:

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

More mindless grinding.......

Why do you deserve those rewards? There are 2 other modes that give you rewards just for playing. It took me almost 2 years to build my roster to the point that I can consistently earn the 4* cover in PVP. (2 more 900s this season and it will be my first season of 900+ in every event). PVP scoring works as intended and I really, really, really hope the devs do not make progression win based. Just because it's there doesn't mean it should be handed to you.... Earn it!!!

The devs think that he should have an easier chance at those rewards, apparently. If they're making PvP progression rewards win-based, it's probably in part because engagement with PvP is down with most of the player base. If PvP was working as intended, they wouldn't be having tests to change anything, so obviously something isn't working for them.

What a lot of the "vets" on this board always forget is that they make up a minuscule percentage of the player base and that the vast majority of the people who play this game have an experience in PvP that is miles and away different than they have. This is then even further manipulated, in terms of their experience versus Joe MPQ, due to etiquettes and cooperation that were never intended. The players put up these constructs and it seems as if the devs are working to start to dismantle some of them, or at least their effects on the playerbase as a whole.

Milk Jugz

Ducky said:

Milk Jugz said:

Pants1000 said:

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

More mindless grinding.......

Why do you deserve those rewards? There are 2 other modes that give you rewards just for playing. It took me almost 2 years to build my roster to the point that I can consistently earn the 4* cover in PVP. (2 more 900s this season and it will be my first season of 900+ in every event). PVP scoring works as intended and I really, really, really hope the devs do not make progression win based. Just because it's there doesn't mean it should be handed to you.... Earn it!!!

The devs think that he should have an easier chance at those rewards, apparently. If they're making PvP progression rewards win-based, it's probably in part because engagement with PvP is down with most of the player base. If PvP was working as intended, they wouldn't be having tests to change anything, so obviously something isn't working for them.

What a lot of the "vets" on this board always forget is that they make up a minuscule percentage of the player base and that the vast majority of the people who play this game have an experience in PvP that is miles and away different than they have. This is then even further manipulated, in terms of their experience versus Joe MPQ, due to etiquettes and cooperation that were never intended. The players put up these constructs and it seems as if the devs are working to start to dismantle some of them, or at least their effects on the playerbase as a whole.

I had much of the same feelings that these players who keep suggesting changes to PVP scoring have when my roster was young. I wasn't in the forums at that time or maybe I would have joined them, maybe not, IDK. What I do know is that I built my roster and now I can consistently compete. What isn't working right? If "player vs. player" (I think people forget that's what PVP stands for) is truly to be PVP, then the higher powered rosters will be at the top and the lower powered rosters at the bottom. I've started this in other posts, but I will again, I play PVP solo. I don't coordinate hops, climbs, grills, or shields. It is possible to score highly if your roster is strong enough without coordination. Nerfing the scoring system by making the rewards guaranteed by just playing, rather than strategizing your climb times/shield times defeats the purpose of player vs. player. 

Ducky

Milk Jugz said:

Ducky said:

Milk Jugz said:

Pants1000 said:

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

More mindless grinding.......

Why do you deserve those rewards? There are 2 other modes that give you rewards just for playing. It took me almost 2 years to build my roster to the point that I can consistently earn the 4* cover in PVP. (2 more 900s this season and it will be my first season of 900+ in every event). PVP scoring works as intended and I really, really, really hope the devs do not make progression win based. Just because it's there doesn't mean it should be handed to you.... Earn it!!!

The devs think that he should have an easier chance at those rewards, apparently. If they're making PvP progression rewards win-based, it's probably in part because engagement with PvP is down with most of the player base. If PvP was working as intended, they wouldn't be having tests to change anything, so obviously something isn't working for them.

What a lot of the "vets" on this board always forget is that they make up a minuscule percentage of the player base and that the vast majority of the people who play this game have an experience in PvP that is miles and away different than they have. This is then even further manipulated, in terms of their experience versus Joe MPQ, due to etiquettes and cooperation that were never intended. The players put up these constructs and it seems as if the devs are working to start to dismantle some of them, or at least their effects on the playerbase as a whole.

I had much of the same feelings that these players who keep suggesting changes to PVP scoring have when my roster was young. I wasn't in the forums at that time or maybe I would have joined them, maybe not, IDK. What I do know is that I built my roster and now I can consistently compete. What isn't working right? If "player vs. player" (I think people forget that's what PVP stands for) is truly to be PVP, then the higher powered rosters will be at the top and the lower powered rosters at the bottom. I've started this in other posts, but I will again, I play PVP solo. I don't coordinate hops, climbs, grills, or shields. It is possible to score highly if your roster is strong enough without coordination. Nerfing the scoring system by making the rewards guaranteed by just playing, rather than strategizing your climb times/shield times defeats the purpose of player vs. player. 

I think most of the vets on this board know I play solo as well, but our experience is still molded by all of those constructs that players have put in place.

And I think the reason they moved the CP to placement is because they want people to compete for those rewards and make it actually Versus, and not Co-OP. 

If they moved all the progression rewards from Versus (it's never actually been called PvP officially by the devs) to placement rewards, would you cry foul then? Would that then be distributing the rewards in the most "earning it" type of way?

Edit: Fixed typos

Milk Jugz

Ducky said:

Milk Jugz said:

Ducky said:

Milk Jugz said:

Pants1000 said:

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

More mindless grinding.......

Why do you deserve those rewards? There are 2 other modes that give you rewards just for playing. It took me almost 2 years to build my roster to the point that I can consistently earn the 4* cover in PVP. (2 more 900s this season and it will be my first season of 900+ in every event). PVP scoring works as intended and I really, really, really hope the devs do not make progression win based. Just because it's there doesn't mean it should be handed to you.... Earn it!!!

The devs think that he should have an easier chance at those rewards, apparently. If they're making PvP progression rewards win-based, it's probably in part because engagement with PvP is down with most of the player base. If PvP was working as intended, they wouldn't be having tests to change anything, so obviously something isn't working for them.

What a lot of the "vets" on this board always forget is that they make up a minuscule percentage of the player base and that the vast majority of the people who play this game have an experience in PvP that is miles and away different than they have. This is then even further manipulated, in terms of their experience versus Joe MPQ, due to etiquettes and cooperation that were never intended. The players put up these constructs and it seems as if the devs are working to start to dismantle some of them, or at least their effects on the playerbase as a whole.

I had much of the same feelings that these players who keep suggesting changes to PVP scoring have when my roster was young. I wasn't in the forums at that time or maybe I would have joined them, maybe not, IDK. What I do know is that I built my roster and now I can consistently compete. What isn't working right? If "player vs. player" (I think people forget that's what PVP stands for) is truly to be PVP, then the higher powered rosters will be at the top and the lower powered rosters at the bottom. I've started this in other posts, but I will again, I play PVP solo. I don't coordinate hops, climbs, grills, or shields. It is possible to score highly if your roster is strong enough without coordination. Nerfing the scoring system by making the rewards guaranteed by just playing, rather than strategizing your climb times/shield times defeats the purpose of player vs. player. 

I think most of the vets on this board now I play solo as well, but our experience is still molded by all of those constructs that players have put in place.

And I think the reason they moved the CP to placement is because they want people to compete for those rewards and make it actually Versus, and not Co-OP. 

If they moved all the progession rewards from Versus (it's never actually been called PvP officially by the devs) to placement rewards, would you cry foul then? Would that then be distributing the rewards in the most "earning it" type of way?

I have to say, I actually like that more than making progression win based. I play STORY mode to build my roster, same with the DDQ. But, VERSUS, has a different feel/aspect that I like A LOT. It takes the grinding out of the game and makes you strategize your moves. Changing it to another grind will just make it feel like more of the same...... 

carrion_pigeons

My personal experience in PvP:

Enter the event, do the seeds.  Do one more fight against a team of 270s, get super bored, realize I have to do at least 10 more and probably more like 30 more before I get anything worthwhile at it, and quit.

I expect that's a pretty typical experience among non-LINE players.  PvP sucks.

shardwick

Milk Jugz said:

Pants1000 said:

I'm curious if they'll do another win-based test this off season, and if they'll tweak anything.  Who knows, maybe in another season or two we'll end up with win-based season progression rewards.  

More mindless grinding.......

Why do you deserve those rewards? There are 2 other modes that give you rewards just for playing. It took me almost 2 years to build my roster to the point that I can consistently earn the 4* cover in PVP. (2 more 900s this season and it will be my first season of 900+ in every event). PVP scoring works as intended and I really, really, really hope the devs do not make progression win based. Just because it's there doesn't mean it should be handed to you.... Earn it!!!

Except that they are earning it by putting in the time and effort to get those rewards. You act like people are doing three wins and being handed all of the rewards on a silver platter or something.