You tackled vaulting! Now can we discuss the iso shortage?

Daredevil217
Daredevil217 Posts: 3,967 Chairperson of the Boards
edited July 2017 in MPQ General Discussion

First let me say that I was vehemently against vaulting and am very happy that there is once again an avenue to progress older characters while not having to wait years to cover new ones. I absolutely love this change (especially with Bonus Heroes in the mix).

That said, drop rates of old vs. new characters feels secondary to me to the iso shortage problem. I don't think I've spent a single CP since vaulting started because I have been getting covers way faster than I can champ them. I have over 2500 CP, and 36 LT (not by choice!) Between Heroic tokens, PVE placement/progression, PVP progression, etc. by the time I would want to buy a token with CP or open a LT, it's time to champ someone else. This is true whether it's vintage or latest. I need iso for both!  I think with sustained play you can champ a 4 every two weeks, but they're released every three.  That is a super long road for a new player to slog through who also needs a complete set of 2s and 3s. Since character releases will not slow down to allow us to play catch up or get ahead of the curve (I know many on here are probably already ahead of the curve) I think we need either:

1) Double iso for all rewards and/or

2) lower costs for champing characters (especially 4*s)

The economy of the game changes the more fish you add to the pond, and I think it is time to revisit iso, which to me is the biggest problem in this game.

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Comments

  • Dragon_Nexus
    Dragon_Nexus Posts: 3,701 Chairperson of the Boards
    Yeah, we do need more regular double ISO events tbh.

    I dunno though, the flow of ISO is a lot better than it used to be. I took Drax from 180 to 270 and champed in 6 days.

    I'm hoarding like you, but I don't find it too bad. Once all my flipped 2*s are back in fighting form and the dupe 3*s are as high as I can get them, I open legendaries until I get one I have 13 covers for. Then I stop opening and pour all my ISO into them. Rince and repeat.

    I guess I'm speaking as someone who's played the game for 3.5 years though...I'm near the end of the 4* run, relatively speaking, with only a few older 4*s left to champ.

    It would probably be way harder for someone still in 3* land to make a go of 4*s now...
  • Tony_Foot
    Tony_Foot Posts: 1,816 Chairperson of the Boards
    Again all it needs is a cheaper 4 star champion 200-250k. Other prices are fine for now and so would the flow be.
  • dramatist
    dramatist Posts: 225 Tile Toppler
    At least a double Iso-8 event as another test. :smiley: I champed Cloak and Dagger last night, 4* champ 28. I then pulled nine classics until I got a 14th cover for Professor X, so he'll be my next champ. While pulling I got cover 13 for Spider Woman and now have Spider Woman, Ghost Rider, Flaptain and Drax at 13 covers waiting for me to champ Prof X and get a 14th for one of them.

    Anyway, long story short, I keep falling behind on Iso. I need more Iso-8. This is coming from someone that really just does 2 of the 3 play types, max progression on PvE and DD. I only dabble in PvP. I get about 35-40 K a day and it's nowhere near enough.  I have 35 Latest and 588 CP because pulling is waiting on Iso-8.

  • DrDevilDinosaur
    DrDevilDinosaur Posts: 436 Mover and Shaker
    Daiches said:
    Ehm, they just made iso deficit worse by "tackling vaulting". So easy fix. Roll it back. Boom. Deficit gone again.
    I'm thinking that they could just remove most of the characters from the game. Leave one each of wolverine, spider-man, and the MCU Avengers. That's like 10 characters total, should be easy enough for everyone to max.
  • STOPTHIS
    STOPTHIS Posts: 781 Critical Contributor
    killerkoala said:
    6th color covers should be addressed more .
    Agreed. I get that the ISO crunch can be tough, especially for newer players/transitioners, but the current ISO situation is leagues better than it used to be. PvE nodes now give a set reward out, the node rewards have been increased, champing rewards, SHIELD ranks drop a nice chunk of ISO, they've increased ISO progression in both PvE and PvP, and there's probably stuff I'm forgetting.

    That's not to say that it couldn't be improved or that I would say no to extra ISO! But when I was in the process of champing 3* when champing first became a thing, it took a week to get the ~100K that I needed to champ a 3* from 114. Now, it takes me a roughly a week to get 340K to champ a 4* from 150.

    You just got to pick and choose who and how you want to champ. I know it's not always fun and it can be frustrating, but this is a process. Slow and steady. My strategy pre-vaulting was to pull until I had a 14th cover for character, then focus on champing them. When vaulting came along it shifted me to focus more on the current 12, but the strategy was largely the same and I was still able to champ many vaulted 4* in that time. Now, it's basically back to the old way for me.
  • Maceo511
    Maceo511 Posts: 67 Match Maker
    You just need to play more.  A few of us were saddened they got rid of being able to buy standard tokens.  We don't have anything to spend our ISO on.
  • Daiches
    Daiches Posts: 1,252 Chairperson of the Boards
    Maceo511 said:
    You just need to play more.  A few of us were saddened they got rid of being able to buy standard tokens.  We don't have anything to spend our ISO on.
    Even with a Standard token store, you still wouldn't have that to spend ISO on BECAUSE IT IS A STUPID IDEA TO DO SO, THAT'S WHY THEY REMOVED IT. Lol
  • Ducky
    Ducky Posts: 2,255 Community Moderator
    Daiches said:
    Maceo511 said:
    You just need to play more.  A few of us were saddened they got rid of being able to buy standard tokens.  We don't have anything to spend our ISO on.
    Even with a Standard token store, you still wouldn't have that to spend ISO on BECAUSE IT IS A STUPID IDEA TO DO SO, THAT'S WHY THEY REMOVED IT. Lol
    They removed standard tokens because standard tokens have a 100% chance to get a 3* bonus hero. Also, don't post in all caps, it's against the rules. Plus it just looks silly.
  • Maceo511
    Maceo511 Posts: 67 Match Maker
    Guaranteed 3* bonus heroes in Standards, And if you nothing to spend your 4 million ISO on, why not?
  • shardwick
    shardwick Posts: 2,121 Chairperson of the Boards
    They can fix 6th covers with a store that lets you trade in your extras. But you can't trade unless you have a special token, kinda similar when you unlock a vault in Strange Sights, that you could get from progression rewards and the ddq vault. 1 token for 2*s, 2 for 3*s, 3 for 4*s and 5 for 5*s and rares. The store would get in new stock every week so if you had a blue Mordo and wanted that black Vulture then if it was in the store and you had three tokens then you could make the trade for it.

    Anyway, the biggest concern for me would be making pve progression only so people can play on their own schedule, throughout the day if they want, and where the only element of time is finishing before the event ends. Placement rewards are built into progression and could even be set up as bonus rewards in a bonus sub that gets unlocked after you do a certain amount of clears. Busy week with work? Play the whole event in one day if you want and get all of the rewards without worrying about having to be in the top ten to do it.
  • Dotproduct
    Dotproduct Posts: 217 Tile Toppler
    If you didn't draw covers too quickly you wouldn't need to level them so often. So the obvious solution to the devs to maintain their bottom line is to reduce the ability to gain so many 4* and 5* for free and then we would all be back to where we were a year ago. No thanks.

    Ducky said:
    They removed standard tokens because standard tokens have a 100% chance to get a 3* bonus hero.
    Easy fix right? Just lower that probability to something more manageable - 10%?
  • jgomes32
    jgomes32 Posts: 381 Mover and Shaker
    edited July 2017
    Agree to some extent. I have only myself to blame for most cases of iso shortage cause i'm bad at hoarding. But in cases like Wasp, Winter Soldier and Miles all being rewarded the same week and they just happen to be among the 4* i have left to champ i'm faced with a decision to drop one from my champ plans (Wasp). 

    Playing both Pvp and Pve i'm getting 40-50k iso per day. I can champ a 4* in roughly a week and if i can keep this pacing will eventully get caugh up. Problem is most people don't make half of that.

    Double iso or lowering 4* champ cost (300k maybe?) isn't a personal issue, personally i don't see a "iso shortage" per say (the iso is all there, you just have to play, a lot)... Yes, i'd really welcome a double iso soon, but i think overall having more double iso events/week can only help D3.

    New players will feel progress faster and transitioning like me can take some time to breath from the constant iso grind. 

  • Dotproduct
    Dotproduct Posts: 217 Tile Toppler
    jgomes32 said:
    Problem is most people don't make half of that.
    It's a false problem. You don't have to have everyone covered and maxed out to enjoy this game, especially at the casual and non paying level which I gather where most of the complaints are being made.
  • jgomes32
    jgomes32 Posts: 381 Mover and Shaker
    edited July 2017
    Dotproduct said:
    jgomes32 said:
    Problem is most people don't make half of that.
    It's a false problem. You don't have to have everyone covered and maxed out to enjoy this game, especially at the casual and non paying level which I gather where most of the complaints are being made.
    If you stay casual long enough without any significant progress it's a matter of time before you even forget to login a couple of days and eventually go back to the candy game. A small boost here and there could go a long way. 

    Last double iso was in december. Another one wouldn't hurt. I just feel it's a lot of content to catch up.

    Edit: But i agree, you don't necessarily need to a competitive player or have everyone covered/champed to enjjoy.
  • Ayasugi-san
    Ayasugi-san Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
    mexus said:
    I'd also like somekind of winning streak system with increased victory rewards based continuous wins etc.
    That means stronger rosters will have even more motivation to battle weaker rosters and keep them from getting too high a score, though. Rich getting richer and the poor staying poor is already enough of a problem in PVP.
  • DarthDeVo
    DarthDeVo Posts: 2,178 Chairperson of the Boards
    If I had to guess, I would say that unfortunately we probably won't see double ISO until anniversary time. It's only about two months from now. I would be really surprised if they did double ISO events twice over the span of two months. I certainly wouldn't complain if they proved me wrong though. 

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