Are the Gods Godlike?

shteev

wereotter said:

shteev said:

babar3355 said:

Amadeus said:

shteev said:

So... Cast Out is not a problem and everyone should have it at uncommon, but Mythics like Rhonas and Hazoret should be rubbish.

This really doesn't make any sense to me.

Rhonas  + Mantle of Webs is unstoppable 

Um, no.  You can kill his other creatures so he cant attack or block.  You can bounce him back to hand with disperse or anchor to the aether.  You can disable him in white, blue, or any color with deadlock trap and then kill him with destroy spells.

Oh, or you can give him -1/-1 counters to kill him.

Rhonas + mantle + Kefnet or GR... get you closer to unstoppable.. but still can be disabled or bounced.

You don't even need to go up to rare cards like SBonds and DWave or Harbinger to stop Rhonas. Winds of Rebuke costs 4 mana. I hear Cast Out is good, too. Alchemist's Vial is still a card that exists. Try Ruthless Sniper! Cycling is crazy broken, after all! Although why you'd bother with the Sniper and not just go straight for Faith of the Devoted and kill your opponent, I'm not sure.

Honestly, If you can't deal with a Rhonas, then you're not going to be able to compete at Platinum Tier. If you're not AT Platinum level, and you think it's unfair that you should be playing against Mythic creatures like Rhonas that are way above your personal power level while you're only Silver or Bronze, then, well, I agree with that.

Those are all solutions, yes, but what is your answer for someone playing Nissa, Koth, or Liliana running into these things? Do you really think you should tell someone with those decks to run Alchemist's Vial "just in case", and then hope you draw another copy of it every turn so you can keep that reach Rhonas disabled until you can kill it.

Yes! Run Alchemist's Vial just in case! And then run Deadlock Trap when you get it! Yes! Your deck should have the tools to deal with a wide variety of cards! Put cards that deal with things into your deck! If your deck can't deal with things then put cards into it that do! And maybe, just maybe, because of the color pie, certain colors just ARE weak to certain threats, and you should just give up trying to find a great, common answer to that threat in a particular color and play someone else instead.

'Nissa 1 doesn't have enough common cards that I like to deal with this' is a ludicrous, ludicrous reason for nerfing a card.

babar3355

I still don't understand why you don't get the big drawback of Rhonas... he can only attack or block with a big fatty buddy.  remove the big fatty buddy...

If he is running with a Gaea's Revenge which you cant deal with... then you can't deal with Gaea's Revenge regardless of Rhonas... you just die faster or lose the race. 

I guess mono-green lost their only removal with scour, so if you are stupid enough to run mono-green perhaps you cant deal with Rhonas (without colorless disables), but you also cant deal with anything in the game...

Phase

babar3355 said:

I still don't understand why you don't get the big drawback of Rhonas... he can only attack or block with a big fatty buddy.  remove the big fatty buddy...

If he is running with a Gaea's Revenge which you cant deal with... then you can't deal with Gaea's Revenge regardless of Rhonas... you just die faster or lose the race. 

I guess mono-green lost their only removal with scour, so if you are stupid enough to run mono-green perhaps you cant deal with Rhonas (without colorless disables), but you also cant deal with anything in the game...

Mono green can deal with Rhonas easily with their own Rhonas

babar3355

I would also like to point out... that perhaps they do nerf this and it is seen as a bug.  But my point to the post is not... "Will they be nerfed" but "Should they be nerfed"

wereotter

shteev said:

wereotter said:

shteev said:

babar3355 said:

Amadeus said:

shteev said:

So... Cast Out is not a problem and everyone should have it at uncommon, but Mythics like Rhonas and Hazoret should be rubbish.

This really doesn't make any sense to me.

Rhonas  + Mantle of Webs is unstoppable 

Um, no.  You can kill his other creatures so he cant attack or block.  You can bounce him back to hand with disperse or anchor to the aether.  You can disable him in white, blue, or any color with deadlock trap and then kill him with destroy spells.

Oh, or you can give him -1/-1 counters to kill him.

Rhonas + mantle + Kefnet or GR... get you closer to unstoppable.. but still can be disabled or bounced.

You don't even need to go up to rare cards like SBonds and DWave or Harbinger to stop Rhonas. Winds of Rebuke costs 4 mana. I hear Cast Out is good, too. Alchemist's Vial is still a card that exists. Try Ruthless Sniper! Cycling is crazy broken, after all! Although why you'd bother with the Sniper and not just go straight for Faith of the Devoted and kill your opponent, I'm not sure.

Honestly, If you can't deal with a Rhonas, then you're not going to be able to compete at Platinum Tier. If you're not AT Platinum level, and you think it's unfair that you should be playing against Mythic creatures like Rhonas that are way above your personal power level while you're only Silver or Bronze, then, well, I agree with that.

Those are all solutions, yes, but what is your answer for someone playing Nissa, Koth, or Liliana running into these things? Do you really think you should tell someone with those decks to run Alchemist's Vial "just in case", and then hope you draw another copy of it every turn so you can keep that reach Rhonas disabled until you can kill it.

Yes! Run Alchemist's Vial just in case! And then run Deadlock Trap when you get it! Yes! Your deck should have the tools to deal with a wide variety of cards! Put cards that deal with things into your deck! If your deck can't deal with things then put cards into it that do! And maybe, just maybe, because of the color pie, certain colors just ARE weak to certain threats, and you should just give up trying to find a great, common answer to that threat in a particular color and play someone else instead.

'Nissa 1 doesn't have enough common cards that I like to deal with this' is a ludicrous, ludicrous reason for nerfing a card.

Sorry, but no. I'm not going to run Alchemist's Vial in all my decks just in case there's a threat of a god coming at me just so I can hold off the death of all my creatures by ONE turn. This card is situationally good at best if the threat isn't there. The fact remains that in paper magic, colors are weak in certain areas and strong in others. Green can deal with an awakened Rhonas in paper magic through numbers and size combined with trample. In paper magic one Rhonas can't block an entire army in one swing, and so is much less of a threat even with reach, indestructible, and deathtouch.

By the very nature of the combat system in this game being different from the combat system in paper magic, the restrictions on the number of creatures one can have in play, and the retaining of the strengths and weaknesses of each color, certain adjustments to cards MUST be made in order to accommodate this. You can't just say "run this one card which is the ONLY card that can deal with it" and think that's a fair solution to 60% of the colors who would not be able to interact with the problem outside of that.

The gods should be powerful, they should be intimidating, I absolutely agree there. But they also should be something that can be addressed by every color, and not just something that forfeits the game when you encounter one. Thats why I still say make them truly indestructible, make them immune to kill spells, make them not take combat damage when blocked, but also make them entirely unable to ever block.

majincob

wereotter said:

shteev said:

wereotter said:

shteev said:

babar3355 said:

Amadeus said:

shteev said:

So... Cast Out is not a problem and everyone should have it at uncommon, but Mythics like Rhonas and Hazoret should be rubbish.

This really doesn't make any sense to me.

Rhonas  + Mantle of Webs is unstoppable 

Um, no.  You can kill his other creatures so he cant attack or block.  You can bounce him back to hand with disperse or anchor to the aether.  You can disable him in white, blue, or any color with deadlock trap and then kill him with destroy spells.

Oh, or you can give him -1/-1 counters to kill him.

Rhonas + mantle + Kefnet or GR... get you closer to unstoppable.. but still can be disabled or bounced.

You don't even need to go up to rare cards like SBonds and DWave or Harbinger to stop Rhonas. Winds of Rebuke costs 4 mana. I hear Cast Out is good, too. Alchemist's Vial is still a card that exists. Try Ruthless Sniper! Cycling is crazy broken, after all! Although why you'd bother with the Sniper and not just go straight for Faith of the Devoted and kill your opponent, I'm not sure.

Honestly, If you can't deal with a Rhonas, then you're not going to be able to compete at Platinum Tier. If you're not AT Platinum level, and you think it's unfair that you should be playing against Mythic creatures like Rhonas that are way above your personal power level while you're only Silver or Bronze, then, well, I agree with that.

Those are all solutions, yes, but what is your answer for someone playing Nissa, Koth, or Liliana running into these things? Do you really think you should tell someone with those decks to run Alchemist's Vial "just in case", and then hope you draw another copy of it every turn so you can keep that reach Rhonas disabled until you can kill it.

Yes! Run Alchemist's Vial just in case! And then run Deadlock Trap when you get it! Yes! Your deck should have the tools to deal with a wide variety of cards! Put cards that deal with things into your deck! If your deck can't deal with things then put cards into it that do! And maybe, just maybe, because of the color pie, certain colors just ARE weak to certain threats, and you should just give up trying to find a great, common answer to that threat in a particular color and play someone else instead.

'Nissa 1 doesn't have enough common cards that I like to deal with this' is a ludicrous, ludicrous reason for nerfing a card.

Sorry, but no. I'm not going to run Alchemist's Vial in all my decks just in case there's a threat of a god coming at me just so I can hold off the death of all my creatures by ONE turn. This card is situationally good at best if the threat isn't there. The fact remains that in paper magic, colors are weak in certain areas and strong in others. Green can deal with an awakened Rhonas in paper magic through numbers and size combined with trample. In paper magic one Rhonas can't block an entire army in one swing, and so is much less of a threat even with reach, indestructible, and deathtouch.

By the very nature of the combat system in this game being different from the combat system in paper magic, the restrictions on the number of creatures one can have in play, and the retaining of the strengths and weaknesses of each color, certain adjustments to cards MUST be made in order to accommodate this. You can't just say "run this one card which is the ONLY card that can deal with it" and think that's a fair solution to 60% of the colors who would not be able to interact with the problem outside of that.

The gods should be powerful, they should be intimidating, I absolutely agree there. But they also should be something that can be addressed by every color, and not just something that forfeits the game when you encounter one. Thats why I still say make them truly indestructible, make them immune to kill spells, make them not take combat damage when blocked, but also make them entirely unable to ever block.

So much nesting! I love it.

In my opinion, the gods are fine as they are currently implemented. In regards to the question of design of the cards, they already have several hoops you have to jump through to activate them as attackers or potentially blockers and you have to add cards in to make them blockers.

You should be building decks with the current meta in mind for PVP events. If vial is your best option, then run it. If you don't include answers to powerful strategies currently being employed by player made decks, expect to lose a percentage of the time when the AI manages to cobble together a combo.

Magic is a game of rock-paper-scissors, part of deckbuilding is to decide what position you want to take. If you think Rock is going to be the most fielded deck, you take Paper and expect to lose sometimes to Scissors, but make up for that by beating the more likely faced Rock decks. Don't complain that your Scissors deck loses to Rock most of the time.

The issue of nerfing is suitable when Rock decks start defeating Paper decks because the usual weaknesses of Rock are removed. In our case the Gods have plenty of cards that can deal with either them or their activation conditions. It is up to the deckbuilder to decide if the risk of facing a potential god is worth adding in the answer.

wereotter

majincob said:

wereotter said:

shteev said:

wereotter said:

shteev said:

babar3355 said:

Amadeus said:

shteev said:

So... Cast Out is not a problem and everyone should have it at uncommon, but Mythics like Rhonas and Hazoret should be rubbish.

This really doesn't make any sense to me.

Rhonas  + Mantle of Webs is unstoppable 

Um, no.  You can kill his other creatures so he cant attack or block.  You can bounce him back to hand with disperse or anchor to the aether.  You can disable him in white, blue, or any color with deadlock trap and then kill him with destroy spells.

Oh, or you can give him -1/-1 counters to kill him.

Rhonas + mantle + Kefnet or GR... get you closer to unstoppable.. but still can be disabled or bounced.

You don't even need to go up to rare cards like SBonds and DWave or Harbinger to stop Rhonas. Winds of Rebuke costs 4 mana. I hear Cast Out is good, too. Alchemist's Vial is still a card that exists. Try Ruthless Sniper! Cycling is crazy broken, after all! Although why you'd bother with the Sniper and not just go straight for Faith of the Devoted and kill your opponent, I'm not sure.

Honestly, If you can't deal with a Rhonas, then you're not going to be able to compete at Platinum Tier. If you're not AT Platinum level, and you think it's unfair that you should be playing against Mythic creatures like Rhonas that are way above your personal power level while you're only Silver or Bronze, then, well, I agree with that.

Those are all solutions, yes, but what is your answer for someone playing Nissa, Koth, or Liliana running into these things? Do you really think you should tell someone with those decks to run Alchemist's Vial "just in case", and then hope you draw another copy of it every turn so you can keep that reach Rhonas disabled until you can kill it.

Yes! Run Alchemist's Vial just in case! And then run Deadlock Trap when you get it! Yes! Your deck should have the tools to deal with a wide variety of cards! Put cards that deal with things into your deck! If your deck can't deal with things then put cards into it that do! And maybe, just maybe, because of the color pie, certain colors just ARE weak to certain threats, and you should just give up trying to find a great, common answer to that threat in a particular color and play someone else instead.

'Nissa 1 doesn't have enough common cards that I like to deal with this' is a ludicrous, ludicrous reason for nerfing a card.

Sorry, but no. I'm not going to run Alchemist's Vial in all my decks just in case there's a threat of a god coming at me just so I can hold off the death of all my creatures by ONE turn. This card is situationally good at best if the threat isn't there. The fact remains that in paper magic, colors are weak in certain areas and strong in others. Green can deal with an awakened Rhonas in paper magic through numbers and size combined with trample. In paper magic one Rhonas can't block an entire army in one swing, and so is much less of a threat even with reach, indestructible, and deathtouch.

By the very nature of the combat system in this game being different from the combat system in paper magic, the restrictions on the number of creatures one can have in play, and the retaining of the strengths and weaknesses of each color, certain adjustments to cards MUST be made in order to accommodate this. You can't just say "run this one card which is the ONLY card that can deal with it" and think that's a fair solution to 60% of the colors who would not be able to interact with the problem outside of that.

The gods should be powerful, they should be intimidating, I absolutely agree there. But they also should be something that can be addressed by every color, and not just something that forfeits the game when you encounter one. Thats why I still say make them truly indestructible, make them immune to kill spells, make them not take combat damage when blocked, but also make them entirely unable to ever block.

So much nesting! I love it.

In my opinion, the gods are fine as they are currently implemented. In regards to the question of design of the cards, they already have several hoops you have to jump through to activate them as attackers or potentially blockers and you have to add cards in to make them blockers.

You should be building decks with the current meta in mind for PVP events. If vial is your best option, then run it. If you don't include answers to powerful strategies currently being employed by player made decks, expect to lose a percentage of the time when the AI manages to cobble together a combo.

Magic is a game of rock-paper-scissors, part of deckbuilding is to decide what position you want to take. If you think Rock is going to be the most fielded deck, you take Paper and expect to lose sometimes to Scissors, but make up for that by beating the more likely faced Rock decks. Don't complain that your Scissors deck loses to Rock most of the time.

The issue of nerfing is suitable when Rock decks start defeating Paper decks because the usual weaknesses of Rock are removed. In our case the Gods have plenty of cards that can deal with either them or their activation conditions. It is up to the deckbuilder to decide if the risk of facing a potential god is worth adding in the answer.

You're right to a degree, and in further thinking, every color can deal with Rhonas or Oketra after they have a defensive buff except green still. The problem here isn't that green doesn't have the tools in its color philosophy, it's that those tools have been denied green in this game in multiple ways:

First and most importantly, green's primary creature removal spell has not been translated into the game despite two printings of it since launch. Prey Upon was printed both in Eldritch Moon and in Aether Revolt, but because it's a green staple, it was printed at common rarity, and because it was a common card in a small set, D3 ignored it. Prey Upon if in the game would give green an opportunity to remove other creatures and put the god back to sleep.

The other issues come with how mechanics have translated to the game. Granted some must change for simplicity, but in paper magic, reach doesn't mean a creature must block, only that it can block fliers. Additionally, apart from special circumstances, one creature can not block multiple attaches. So green could theoretically do what it does well, and go wide. One god couldn't block an army of tokens. Problem is the translation of that here both treats all the tokens as one creature, that you can only have three creatures out at once, and that one creature can block all attackers.

Last problem here, green excels at destroying equipment and enchantments, but that's not been translated well here as many effects that would be enchantments, and thus should operate like a support, have been translated into spells. Mantle of Webs, in this case, is an enchantment, meaning green should be able to remove the +1/+3 and reach from the creature, but in this game it can not.

Ultimately, this isn't a problem of that color not having the tools, or being paper if the gods are scissors in your comparison, but is more the result of a year and a half of neglect for one color and incorrect implementation of card mechanics. So, while correcting course on these issues would be best in the long term, in the short term, something needs done to correct the mistake allowing all players to be able to play what they enjoy. 

Steeme

For PVP In platinum level, it's always safest to run a planeswalker that splashes multiple colours.  You run a very high risk by limiting your card selection.

@wereotter if you are dead-set in running mono-green, you can run Rogue's Passage.  It gives unblockable to your first creature.  It was one of the few solutions to getting around RC with reach.

There aren't many solutions to ultimate combos, but you can either

a) Prevent yourself from getting into that position (ie. choose a more versatile planeswalker) or

b) Prepare yourself with tools to get out of that position

majincob

wereotter said:

majincob said:

wereotter said:

shteev said:

wereotter said:

shteev said:

babar3355 said:

Amadeus said:

shteev said:

So... Cast Out is not a problem and everyone should have it at uncommon, but Mythics like Rhonas and Hazoret should be rubbish.

This really doesn't make any sense to me.

Rhonas  + Mantle of Webs is unstoppable 

Um, no.  You can kill his other creatures so he cant attack or block.  You can bounce him back to hand with disperse or anchor to the aether.  You can disable him in white, blue, or any color with deadlock trap and then kill him with destroy spells.

Oh, or you can give him -1/-1 counters to kill him.

Rhonas + mantle + Kefnet or GR... get you closer to unstoppable.. but still can be disabled or bounced.

You don't even need to go up to rare cards like SBonds and DWave or Harbinger to stop Rhonas. Winds of Rebuke costs 4 mana. I hear Cast Out is good, too. Alchemist's Vial is still a card that exists. Try Ruthless Sniper! Cycling is crazy broken, after all! Although why you'd bother with the Sniper and not just go straight for Faith of the Devoted and kill your opponent, I'm not sure.

Honestly, If you can't deal with a Rhonas, then you're not going to be able to compete at Platinum Tier. If you're not AT Platinum level, and you think it's unfair that you should be playing against Mythic creatures like Rhonas that are way above your personal power level while you're only Silver or Bronze, then, well, I agree with that.

Those are all solutions, yes, but what is your answer for someone playing Nissa, Koth, or Liliana running into these things? Do you really think you should tell someone with those decks to run Alchemist's Vial "just in case", and then hope you draw another copy of it every turn so you can keep that reach Rhonas disabled until you can kill it.

Yes! Run Alchemist's Vial just in case! And then run Deadlock Trap when you get it! Yes! Your deck should have the tools to deal with a wide variety of cards! Put cards that deal with things into your deck! If your deck can't deal with things then put cards into it that do! And maybe, just maybe, because of the color pie, certain colors just ARE weak to certain threats, and you should just give up trying to find a great, common answer to that threat in a particular color and play someone else instead.

'Nissa 1 doesn't have enough common cards that I like to deal with this' is a ludicrous, ludicrous reason for nerfing a card.

Sorry, but no. I'm not going to run Alchemist's Vial in all my decks just in case there's a threat of a god coming at me just so I can hold off the death of all my creatures by ONE turn. This card is situationally good at best if the threat isn't there. The fact remains that in paper magic, colors are weak in certain areas and strong in others. Green can deal with an awakened Rhonas in paper magic through numbers and size combined with trample. In paper magic one Rhonas can't block an entire army in one swing, and so is much less of a threat even with reach, indestructible, and deathtouch.

By the very nature of the combat system in this game being different from the combat system in paper magic, the restrictions on the number of creatures one can have in play, and the retaining of the strengths and weaknesses of each color, certain adjustments to cards MUST be made in order to accommodate this. You can't just say "run this one card which is the ONLY card that can deal with it" and think that's a fair solution to 60% of the colors who would not be able to interact with the problem outside of that.

The gods should be powerful, they should be intimidating, I absolutely agree there. But they also should be something that can be addressed by every color, and not just something that forfeits the game when you encounter one. Thats why I still say make them truly indestructible, make them immune to kill spells, make them not take combat damage when blocked, but also make them entirely unable to ever block.

So much nesting! I love it.

In my opinion, the gods are fine as they are currently implemented. In regards to the question of design of the cards, they already have several hoops you have to jump through to activate them as attackers or potentially blockers and you have to add cards in to make them blockers.

You should be building decks with the current meta in mind for PVP events. If vial is your best option, then run it. If you don't include answers to powerful strategies currently being employed by player made decks, expect to lose a percentage of the time when the AI manages to cobble together a combo.

Magic is a game of rock-paper-scissors, part of deckbuilding is to decide what position you want to take. If you think Rock is going to be the most fielded deck, you take Paper and expect to lose sometimes to Scissors, but make up for that by beating the more likely faced Rock decks. Don't complain that your Scissors deck loses to Rock most of the time.

The issue of nerfing is suitable when Rock decks start defeating Paper decks because the usual weaknesses of Rock are removed. In our case the Gods have plenty of cards that can deal with either them or their activation conditions. It is up to the deckbuilder to decide if the risk of facing a potential god is worth adding in the answer.

You're right to a degree, and in further thinking, every color can deal with Rhonas or Oketra after they have a defensive buff except green still. The problem here isn't that green doesn't have the tools in its color philosophy, it's that those tools have been denied green in this game in multiple ways:

First and most importantly, green's primary creature removal spell has not been translated into the game despite two printings of it since launch. Prey Upon was printed both in Eldritch Moon and in Aether Revolt, but because it's a green staple, it was printed at common rarity, and because it was a common card in a small set, D3 ignored it. Prey Upon if in the game would give green an opportunity to remove other creatures and put the god back to sleep.

The other issues come with how mechanics have translated to the game. Granted some must change for simplicity, but in paper magic, reach doesn't mean a creature must block, only that it can block fliers. Additionally, apart from special circumstances, one creature can not block multiple attaches. So green could theoretically do what it does well, and go wide. One god couldn't block an army of tokens. Problem is the translation of that here both treats all the tokens as one creature, that you can only have three creatures out at once, and that one creature can block all attackers.

Last problem here, green excels at destroying equipment and enchantments, but that's not been translated well here as many effects that would be enchantments, and thus should operate like a support, have been translated into spells. Mantle of Webs, in this case, is an enchantment, meaning green should be able to remove the +1/+3 and reach from the creature, but in this game it can not.

Ultimately, this isn't a problem of that color not having the tools, or being paper if the gods are scissors in your comparison, but is more the result of a year and a half of neglect for one color and incorrect implementation of card mechanics. So, while correcting course on these issues would be best in the long term, in the short term, something needs done to correct the mistake allowing all players to be able to play what they enjoy. 

I agree with your assessment of the underlying problem but disagree with the conclusion that the gods should be changed to make up for the deficit in green.

Instead of a nerfing that would devalue a very flavorful, useful, and mythic ability, they should differentiate "prevent damage" and "Indestructable" in their code and add in more answers. 

With the planned release of extra cards to sets more often than once every 3 months, adding in more answers should not take much more time than changing and testing the current code.

I think the rub in my mind is that "allowing all players to be able to play what they enjoy" also includes allowing players to play with their (rightfully) powerful gods. I do not currently own any gods, but I'm hoping to earn enough unobtanium to get one before they leave the vault. I'll be a sad panda when they nerf it right after I've spent all my unobtanium on it.

Phase

I think long term Indestructible could be healthy if we had more exile effects but it's definitely too soon right now to go in that direction. Perhaps after this block and moving into the next set six months from now we might have the chance to revisit it after getting more exile effects.

Until then we have bigger problems, like how we are going to react to a 1000 crystal, 3-color Nicol Bolas planeswalker in a few months...

Laeuftbeidir

It's nicol announced?
We didn't get Ugin.. I don't think we'll get this dragon.
Three colors would be a total overkill.
I like the indestructible design of the gods. I'll have my fun with it, but don't cry when they'll get nerfed. I was always possible to work around it, when I faced them. Even with reach :can't block won't block.

babar3355

3 color PW will be a little less busted in standard.  Honestly in legacy I already have to bench cards I really want in my decks for the 10 card maximum.  I wish they would stretch the deck size a bit.  Obviously it makes building harder, but in a good way.

wereotter

Laeuftbeidir said:

It's nicol announced?
We didn't get Ugin.. I don't think we'll get this dragon.
Three colors would be a total overkill.
I like the indestructible design of the gods. I'll have my fun with it, but don't cry when they'll get nerfed. I was always possible to work around it, when I faced them. Even with reach :can't block won't block.

We never got Ugin because he was a planeswalker from Fate Reforged, and that was prior to the release of this game. Bolas is the promo art for Hour of Devastation, so he will absolutely be in the set, most likely in Grixis colors, but given what they did with Nissa this set and Tamiyo on Eldritch Moon, nothing is a certain in my mind till I see it.

I do wonder if they will skip adding him because of the power three colors gives if indeed he is a Grixis color walker considering they skipped Tamiyo in Eldritch Moon, probably because she was three colors. 

Corn_Noodles

wereotter said:

I do wonder if they will skip adding him because of the power three colors gives if indeed he is a Grixis color walker considering they skipped Tamiyo in Eldritch Moon, probably because she was three colors. 

I think it really depends on how much D3 wants to fleece people for money at this point. I don't think any other consideration (such as power level) really matters beyond simple greed.

wereotter

Corn Noodles said:

wereotter said:

I do wonder if they will skip adding him because of the power three colors gives if indeed he is a Grixis color walker considering they skipped Tamiyo in Eldritch Moon, probably because she was three colors. 

I think it really depends on how much D3 wants to fleece people for money at this point. I don't think any other consideration (such as power level) really matters beyond simple greed.

If that were the case, then I think they would have released Tamiyo too. White, green, blue is a pretty powerful color combination, and she's a pretty well-loved planeswalker. There must be another reason we didn't get her, which may impact Bolas. 

gruntface

Bolas will be a 3 color PW, with +6 gains for his primaries and +1 for the other 2. He will only be available for purchase, at the bargain price of $299.99.

Will be bundled with 10,000 runes, 100 crystals, 5 unobtanium and a basic booster.

Corn_Noodles

I'd expect $99.99 for a 3-color Bolas.

Sirchombli

They could always make indestructible a keyword and differentiate between the two. I don't necessarily have an issue with gods being indestructible. They all require an outside element to be able to attack or block. Cards like UC were never meant to be indestructible, and shouldn't be. This is another issue in which it would be helpful for d3 to confirm or deny. We obviously have no idea what's going on. We're still wading through the rather ridiculous amount of bugs from the current update. 

gruntface

Corn Noodles said:

I'd expect $99.99 for a 3-color Bolas.

To quote a wiser man than me

Corn Noodles said:

Satire is never appreciated.

Phase

wereotter said:

I do wonder if they will skip adding him because of the power three colors gives if indeed he is a Grixis color walker considering they skipped Tamiyo in Eldritch Moon, probably because she was three colors. 

They didn't do Taimyo because frankly no one cares about 3 color Tamiyo, though it is a good point to say that she wasn't made. Tamiyo wasn't worth breaking that wall down. Bolas is a huge deal, literally the big baddie from 20+ years of Magic lore (props to Yawgmoth of course!) and is the focus of the entire Amonkhet plane. He will be here, and there is no way he will be less than three colors. Prepare your wallet!