How much feedback is necessary?

MissChinch
MissChinch Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
in MPQ General Discussion

@Dave Guskin

You recently answered a series of questions concerning vaulting and commented:


"If enough people voice concern, would you be willing to end vaulting?

Yes. We've made it very clear that we're interested in player feedback, and willing to adjust accordingly. Player feedback has guided..."


Since then, and for a while prior, the subject of vaulting has turned this forum into a cesspool of bickering and complaints.  Its easily the most divisive topic we've had.  Seemingly unrelated threads devolve into a referendum on vaulting within the first page...  Its quickly becoming a deterrent, I'm now sure that when I visit the forums to check on game matters, 90% of what I see is going to be the same complaints that have been persisting for months.

 

Whats the threshold for feedback before we get more information, and whats the best format for said feedback?


At this point I'd stipulate that any decisive answer is better than continuing to let the notion dangle that more feedback should be given...

«134

Comments

  • Beer40
    Beer40 Posts: 826 Critical Contributor
    Well said. This isn't going to die down until someone with authority gives a threshold we need to meet or says "This is the way it is".
  • Straycat
    Straycat Posts: 963 Critical Contributor
    Well, they did just send out another 1 question survey. The feedback they get from that might be the catalyst for something to happen
  • Ducky
    Ducky Posts: 2,255 Community Moderator
    The forum consists of a tiny fraction of the player base and I assume they get feedback from other sources as well (CS tickets, in game surveys, Reddit, Twitter, Facebook, etc), so they are probably weighing that feedback as well. It may also not be in the same light as the feedback on forums. Different strokes for different folks and all that jazz.

    Also, I am sure that their metrics are also giving them another form of feedback to consider. I'd gather it's also the most important type of feedback that they are considering as well since it's the most tangible.
  • Magic
    Magic Posts: 1,199 Chairperson of the Boards
    @Ducky  Sure - there are other means of communication. But how many players display their opinion with CS tickets? I know I wouldn't do that - i have a forum for that.

    And even if the forum is a fraction it's the most dedicated players. Or the players who want to have a deep understanding of the game. And I am sure nobody (forum users or casual players) was asking to cut out 75% of covers, put the nice rewards from intercepts behind pay wall (even if it's a decorative fence that's easy to jump over with 2$) or increasing the grind from 4 to 6 clears (and you need 6 clears if you don't play on the optimal schedule). 

    The developers only listen to one group - the accountants in the company. 
  • Wumpushunter
    Wumpushunter Posts: 627 Critical Contributor
    In the last survey I dropped my rating 2 points specifically because of vaulting. The only things that keep me playing is my alliance and some one at Demiurge can think of a better way to make cash that isn't unfair to anyone starting the game now or in the future.

    Hulk buster is vaulted, Hulk buster is required for the Hunt, vaulting is taking tokens right out of my hands.
  • mpqr7
    mpqr7 Posts: 2,642 Chairperson of the Boards
    We get a lot of surveys about customer satisfaction. I answer them every time. However I think the surveys should have more questions, other than just "what do you rate us" and "why is that". They should ask about more specific features.
  • GurlBYE
    GurlBYE Posts: 1,218 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2017
    @ Feedback given on reddit etc.

    The forum is the most divided place on opinions on this game.

    Everywhere else, discord etc are all more echochambers. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but don't go to any of them for neutral discussions on the game. 

    There could be 5 positive posts and 1 negative here and 6 people will quote the negative one and wonder why the discussion focuses on it.


    Then throw in the pot the fact that most people will only post something about the game when it hinders them from playing or makes them enjoy the game less.

    The size of huge threads with new posters posting gives a great idea of that. I'll leave it at that. 
    The longest threads with people generally in agreement lately (with only specific posters just entering these threads, not to state their opinions or discuss, but literally go on a post by post quoting rampage on why your opinion and experiences don't reflect their opinion mind you) seem to be on vaulting.
  • MissChinch
    MissChinch Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    Ducky said:
    The forum consists of a tiny fraction of the player base and I assume they get feedback from other sources as well (CS tickets, in game surveys, Reddit, Twitter, Facebook, etc), so they are probably weighing that feedback as well. It may also not be in the same light as the feedback on forums. Different strokes for different folks and all that jazz.

    Also, I am sure that their metrics are also giving them another form of feedback to consider. I'd gather it's also the most important type of feedback that they are considering as well since it's the most tangible.


    I agree completely, I think soliciting more feedback on this forum like they did is bound to be interpreted as a request for more feedback in the same medium in which the request for more feedback originated.


    I would actually LOVE a "shut up about it already" post from the devs, citing that they have many times more information from sources that are a more accurate representation of the entire player base than these forums...  Tell us that they will use these forums as a means (through Brigby) to disseminate whatever decision they come up with, no more information is necessary and poor Brigby can post "status normal, still actively discussing the problem, no point in asking again" weekly or whatever.

  • Pogo
    Pogo Posts: 185 Tile Toppler
    MissChinch said:

    Since then, and for a while prior, the subject of vaulting has turned this forum into a cesspool of bickering and complaints.  Its easily the most divisive topic we've had.  Seemingly unrelated threads devolve into a referendum on vaulting within the first page...  Its quickly becoming a deterrent, I'm now sure that when I visit the forums to check on game matters, 90% of what I see is going to be the same complaints that have been persisting for months.

    Thisssssss^


    New Thread: VAULTING!
    New Thread: Vaulting, is it bad?
    New Thread: [Poll] What do you think of Vaulting?
    New Thread: I HATE VAULTING
    New Thread: The positive effects of Vaulting on new players
    New Thread: Your Questions About Vaulting
    New Thread: FIX VALUTING PLS
    New Thread: How can we find out which character is the next one to go in the disney vault?

    It would be at least something of a comfort to hear "we are exploring avenues that allow us to keep the fast-track effect for new players without screwing the deeper-invested players who are still missing legacy covers"

    It would be even more comforting to hear "here are some of the options we are considering, (but please understand we might not go this route)"
  • GrumpySmurf1002
    GrumpySmurf1002 Posts: 3,511 Chairperson of the Boards
    Magic said:
    @Ducky  Sure - there are other means of communication. But how many players display their opinion with CS tickets? I know I wouldn't do that - i have a forum for that.

    And even if the forum is a fraction it's the most dedicated players. Or the players who want to have a deep understanding of the game. And I am sure nobody (forum users or casual players) was asking to cut out 75% of covers, put the nice rewards from intercepts behind pay wall (even if it's a decorative fence that's easy to jump over with 2$) or increasing the grind from 4 to 6 clears (and you need 6 clears if you don't play on the optimal schedule). 

    The developers only listen to one group - the accountants in the company. 
    The changes to Carnage (1.0 -> 2.0) came about as a result of feedback about his (lack of) use.  Dunno about you, but I didn't see piles of forum threads bemoaning Carnage's self damage.  So that feedback had to be coming from somewhere else.  Similar for 2.0 -> 3.0, though there was obviously more forum feedback on that one.

    Accountants get a (major?) say on things like vaulting or anything else directly affecting in game economy sure, but don't sleep on the feedback coming from non forum sources (or the number of ultra-dedicated players that aren't on the forums for that matter)


  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Ducky said:
    The forum consists of a tiny fraction of the player base and I assume they get feedback from other sources as well (CS tickets, in game surveys, Reddit, Twitter, Facebook, etc), so they are probably weighing that feedback as well. It may also not be in the same light as the feedback on forums. Different strokes for different folks and all that jazz.

    Also, I am sure that their metrics are also giving them another form of feedback to consider. I'd gather it's also the most important type of feedback that they are considering as well since it's the most tangible.
    I'd believe this more if they actually asked the question in a survey vs just the 'how likely are you to recommend'.  It's crazy to me that they've never put a survey for such a major and controversial feature, unless they really don't want the negative feedback.
  • MissChinch
    MissChinch Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    GrumpySmurf1002 said:
    MissChinch said:

    Since then, and for a while prior, the subject of vaulting has turned this forum into a cesspool of bickering and complaints.  Its easily the most divisive topic we've had. 

    Your attempts to power creep the True Healing and 4Thorverine nerf threads have not gone unnoticed.

    You raise a valid point, perhaps the sinister strategy of de-sticky-ifying and ignoring has worked, at least on my simple brain and poor memory...
  • GurlBYE
    GurlBYE Posts: 1,218 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2017
    GrumpySmurf1002 said:
    MissChinch said:

    Since then, and for a while prior, the subject of vaulting has turned this forum into a cesspool of bickering and complaints.  Its easily the most divisive topic we've had. 

    Your attempts to power creep the True Healing and 4Thorverine nerf threads have not gone unnoticed.
    Those, and boss rush, unlike vaulting, didn't have a good chunk of the player base staunchly defending them at every avenue. 

    Those were the few (along with old man and a few other moments) were when even the forums were entirely in agreement 
  • MissChinch
    MissChinch Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    GurlBYE said:
    GrumpySmurf1002 said:
    MissChinch said:

    Since then, and for a while prior, the subject of vaulting has turned this forum into a cesspool of bickering and complaints.  Its easily the most divisive topic we've had. 

    Your attempts to power creep the True Healing and 4Thorverine nerf threads have not gone unnoticed.
    Those, and boss rush, unlike vaulting, didn't have a good chunk of the player base staunchly defending them at every avenue. 

    Those were the few (along with old man and a few other moments) were when even the forums were entirely in agreement 

    Bid deals all, but I don't think I'd say they were nearly as divisive or really as prevalent, lots of complaints, less of a schism really and those at least stayed in their own threads much better than this vaulting fiasco...  The True Healing thing definitely had staying power though...
  • GrumpySmurf1002
    GrumpySmurf1002 Posts: 3,511 Chairperson of the Boards
    GurlBYE said:
    Those, and boss rush, unlike vaulting, didn't have a good chunk of the player base staunchly defending them at every avenue. 

    Those were the few (along with old man and a few other moments) were when even the forums were entirely in agreement 
    True healing was defended plenty, that's why it was one of the longest threads the forums have seen.  That wasn't just 100+ pages of "this sucks."

    I didn't bother with the OML thread but it had to have defenders too; half the forums were calling for his nerf for a year.  (unless you mean the cruddy compensation, in which case yeah)
  • AXP_isme
    AXP_isme Posts: 809 Critical Contributor
    This may be the most brilliantly reductive thread I have ever seen. Everyone providing feedback on the nature of feedback to address a question about how much feedback is enoigh. Isn't the internet a magical place...
  • Wumpushunter
    Wumpushunter Posts: 627 Critical Contributor
    It's only takes about 8 people to keep a topic on top of the forum and alive. I know for one I will not let them ignore the fact that some of us find the current form of vaulting unfair in the extreme. Fix it, we won't go away till you do.

Categories