How has hoarding changed for you since vaulting?

Daredevil217Daredevil217 Posts: 2,965 Chairperson of the Boards
edited May 2017 in MPQ General Discussion
Basically trying to get a pulse on the community. There's been a lot of debate over whether or not hoarding has increased or not.  The lead developer stated that vaulting shouldn't lead to increased hoarding but I know for me it is worse than ever. I don't spend CP on tokens anymore and have to rush to get Iso before opening any tokens I accumulate.  

I think I'm sitting on around 500 CP and that's after buying some covers directly (so I don't have covers dying on the vine).

While it is true the Iso needs are the same as they've always been, the fact is they are more concentrated and there is now a time crunch that was never there before, because we know that once a character leaves tokens we are likely never to have a reliable chance to get them again.

So I'm curious as to what the rest of the community is experiencing. I understand not everyone is in the same situation. I imagine that those who don't treat this like a part time job (casuals) would have even more incentive to hoard.

How has hoarding changed for you since vaulting? 142 votes

I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
66%
ShuinoDauthiDragon_NexusStarfuryfirethorneHadronicLegallyUndeadrixmithkillercooltrat73Bryan LambertseshomaWolarsenshobi6669slaxer723HoutroKiera13GrimSkaldNajboljiorbitalint 94 votes
I hoard less since vaulting has been implemented
5%
mpqr7tdglory49OrionajfahreTetsujinOniiron-n-wineHalleckbroll 8 votes
I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
28%
PuceMooseKolenceTwystaSpiritclawQuebbsterBowgentlexKOBALTxMojoWildbabinroPriceCzechGrumpySmurf1002frachrxidragonxiAionTeleosTrilateralusPongieCT1888NepentheEric1985MoosePrime 40 votes
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Comments

  • JarvindJarvind Posts: 1,684 Chairperson of the Boards
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    Hasn't changed for me. I stockpile ISO till I have enough for a champion, then I pull tokens till I get a 14th cover. Vaulting hasn't changed the strategy, it's just made it very difficult to see any growth on the older champs.
  • DauthiDauthi Age Unconfirmed Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    I never hoarded before, but now I have to. Doesn't seem to be an option though.
  • BowgentleBowgentle Posts: 5,038 Chairperson of the Boards
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    No change, I don't hoard.
    All 4s except Cloak and Dagger and Grocket champed, no reason to hoard.
  • udonomefooudonomefoo Posts: 1,630 Chairperson of the Boards
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    Yes, I didn't hoard CP before.  I was ok with selling some pulls of unchamp'd 4s when my chances of useful covers was higher, but now nearly all pulls will be for unchamped 4s.  So I'm currently stacking about 200k iso and then pulling until I get one that needs to be champed, then I stop.  

    I don't really like it, but I pulled so many unusable covers for Blade and Gwenpool that I just had to stop.
  • ajfahreajfahre Age Unconfirmed Posts: 16 Just Dropped In
    I hoard less since vaulting has been implemented
    I technically hoard less since vaulting has been implemented as I broke my hoard when both Iron Fist and Hawkeye were added to the vaults.  I didn't have any usable 4* Characters before and now I have the current 12 (minus C&D) well covered and usable.  

    The second part is that I am not spending any tokens for this season.  I Luke Cage and SpiderWoman are both Champs and they are leaving.  I am optimistic about Rocket & Groot and what Gamora is going to be.  I also am holding out for Star Lord to be added to the 3* group.  

    Vaulting gave me a reason to spend the hoard and push myself into four star land, but anticipating the rotation has be back to hoarding.
  • BrendoverBrendover Age Unconfirmed Posts: 11 Just Dropped In
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    I never hoarded before. I was happy with my slow, diluted 4* progression.

    Now that vaulting is a thing, I'm just going to hoard until I can fully cover some 5* characters.

    Vaulting has been an awful change that has sucked a lot of joy out of my daily play.
  • SteellatchSteellatch Posts: 84 Match Maker
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    I used to open LT when I had a 90% chance of getting a usable cover. Now I am hoarding until I have enough iso to champ all latest 12 at once so I don't waste any covers. Its all about efficiency for me and this was the only way I could see that would limit wasted covers
  • NepentheNepenthe Age Unconfirmed Posts: 283 Mover and Shaker
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    I had a temporary increase in hoarding when vaulting happened, because the new characters were getting covered quickly so I had to stop opening to let my iso catch up. Now I'm over that hump, have most of the latest 12 champed and am back to normal.  Most of the time my hoarding or not has to do with the 5* cycle, not 4*s.
  • crackninjacrackninja Posts: 438 Mover and Shaker
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    I used to hoard for a month or two at a time,  but now even without opening LT's I've been getting covers faster than iso.  I legitimately vow to make zero LT pulls until October for sure and possibly until December or later depending on how it goes.
    So far over a million in iso deficit, but 1156 cp's in the coffers.
  • MissChinchMissChinch Age Unconfirmed Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented

    Pre-Vaulting I hoarded because it was the most efficient use of CP when it comes to acquiring useful 5*s.


    The mechanic for pulling 5*s wasn't changed, so I still hoard CP to the same degree, HOWEVER, vaulting necessitated two very impactful changes:


    - I need to hoard more ISO -

    To be clear the gross amount of iso needed to champion as heroes are released did not change, but what DID change is that with vaulting I can be assured that when I finally pull my hoard only the most recent 12 4*s will be pulled, so not only will that guarantee its a 4* I haven't championed (because I've been hoarding) I'll also lose the benefit of the cover going toward champion rewards which would defray iso costs.  Now I have to hoard enough ISO to champion ~12 4*s if I don't want to lose a cover along with the ISO I would have had to hoard to champ 2 5*s


    - I can't progress my 4*s while hoarding -

    Pre-Vaulting my progress in the 4* tier was slowly made by championing with reward covers and covers from heroic tokens (and the odd even token).  These champions would be of help when pulling my hoard, because any cover I get for them is a cover I don't have to worry about wasting AND its a source of reward.  Now knowing these champions will not receive covers due to vaulting they wont be of help when I pull my hoard...  That coupled with the fact that I now need to hoard a ton of ISO and not just CP, investing CP into 4*s that have no chance of helping me when the hoard is pulled is not an efficient use of ISO.


    Net result:  Higher hoard threshold combined with no progress in the 4* tier.


    Of course I could elect to cripple my 5* progress and get on the train of pulling for 4* covers in the hopes that I hit 13 covers for em before they get retired.  The break even resource acquisition threshold for this method is actually pretty low, 4*s are coming in at about 1 every 21 days, so you need to average about 15 pulls and 375k-ish iso every 3 weeks and eventually you will converge on a state where you tread water in 4* land, championing at the same rate new characters come out and well covering them before they retire.  With this method you will NOT keep up with 5*s, for all practical purposes they will be locked behind substantial $$ investments.


    I recently broke down and pulled half my LT hoard (CP, keeping LT tokens) so I could get 13 covers for wasp, because I have little faith that d3/demi will fix this issue...  I've got enough covers for spiderwoman and luke cage that covering with bonus heros isn't going to be THAT painful if I want to champ them later (11 and 12 covers) so I'll have to reassess whenever the next 4* will get retired 

  • Black DukeBlack Duke Posts: 694 Critical Contributor
    edited May 2017
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    I hoard LTs & CP since there aren´t much covers of the latest 12 left I really need (all championed or fully covered, except of C&D). I only spend a small amount of CP on Classics in order to get covers of the newbies at the beginning of the season.

    My long term goal is to champion all of the latest 12 (Mordo, IF and C&D are missing) and to accumulate so much LTs (88 right now) that I´m able to fully cover an enticing 5* character (maybe 5* Thor?) within one opening session.
  • revskiprevskip Age Unconfirmed Posts: 696 Critical Contributor
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    I've always hoarded to try and minimize waste so the net change hasn't really affected me other than dictating who I champ.  I do have a crazy hoard of heroics and event tokens at the moment in addition to 20 Latest and 963 CP since I don't want to pull any additional 4*s until I can champ the available guys who I have at 13 covers.  Have 6 of the 12 champed with Riri, Gwenpool and Luke all at 13 covers.  Coulson is at 12 covers with the newer ones both with less than 6 covers.  

    My plan is to wait until Luke and Gwenpool leave tokens before pulling anything.  I have a Riri progression cover that I'll be trying to use within the next 10 days and then just saving ISO until June or so.  At that point I should be able to turn in all my heroics and event tokens and pick up enough 4*s just from those to work on the remaining non-vaulted characters while continuing to hoard my CP and legendary tokens.  
  • StraycatStraycat Posts: 962 Critical Contributor
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    I voted no change, but thats because I never hoard, don't have the patience even tho I really should. I still pull since there's a good chance at champ levels or usable covers, but recently its been the 14th cover more than I would like.

    I had 18 champs and about 3 fully covered non champ 4*s when vaulting happened. I didn't really need to hoard. Now I have 25 champs, 5 in the latest, 8 fully covered vaulted, 3 fully covered latest.

    The first month of vaulting was great, getting Blade and Carol from 4 covers to champed was awesome and almost wasting no pulls. These last few weeks haven't been as great, where I had to sell a lot of covers since I couldn't get iso fast enough.
  • FightmastermpqFightmastermpq Age Unconfirmed Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    When you say "hoard" are you talking about withholding opening for a couple days, weeks, months, or all of the above?

    Are we talking about hoarding CP to help facilitate a 5* transition, or are you specifically talking about the 4* tier only?
  • MissChinchMissChinch Age Unconfirmed Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    When you say "hoard" are you talking about withholding opening for a couple days, weeks, months, or all of the above?

    Are we talking about hoarding CP to help facilitate a 5* transition, or are you specifically talking about the 4* tier only?


    I think people have been chiming in across the entire problem set you mention...


    My contention is that vaulting is a short term speed bump for those that are focused on solely on 4*s and didn't hoard for 5*s pre-vaulting, but a substantial PITA for those who are in the practice of hoarding CP to more efficiently cover 5*s.


    With the addendum of: "I thought 5* progress was an area of concern before all this...  all vaulting did w.r.t. 5* progress was kick it in the nuts."

  • MissChinchMissChinch Age Unconfirmed Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    *Oh and the internal team that devised vaulting as a solution and pushed it, must hate the team the developed the championing mechanic...  like full on people stealing other people's lunch out of the work fridge level of hate....
  • OrionOrion Posts: 1,295 Chairperson of the Boards
    I hoard less since vaulting has been implemented
    I hoarded before vaulting came into existence.  Now that I've opened my hoard, I don't need to keep hoarding, since I have 10 of the current 12 champed.  By the time Rocket and Groot enter into the packs, I'm sure I'll have Agent Venom and Cloak and Dagger champed so I won't have to hoard again.
  • FightmastermpqFightmastermpq Age Unconfirmed Posts: 995 Critical Contributor
    I hoard the same amount as I always have since vaulting has been implemented
    When you say "hoard" are you talking about withholding opening for a couple days, weeks, months, or all of the above?

    Are we talking about hoarding CP to help facilitate a 5* transition, or are you specifically talking about the 4* tier only?


    I think people have been chiming in across the entire problem set you mention...


    My contention is that vaulting is a short term speed bump for those that are focused on solely on 4*s and didn't hoard for 5*s pre-vaulting, but a substantial PITA for those who are in the practice of hoarding CP to more efficiently cover 5*s.


    With the addendum of: "I thought 5* progress was an area of concern before all this...  all vaulting did w.r.t. 5* progress was kick it in the nuts."

    I'm not convinced this is really something new created by vaulting so much as vaulting just REALLY quantifies it and brings it into the spotlight.

    There was a thread on 5* hoarding a while back where I think it was jobob that made a recommendation on the  amount of 4* champs you should have before you go through a hoard for 5*s basically thinking that you don't want to waste a ton of 4* covers when you pull for 5*s.  My take was that it really doesn't matter - it's the 5*s that are going to make you more competitive not the 4*s, and virtually any amount of 4* waste is acceptable if the end state is success at the 5* tier.  I think it's silly to stall 5* progress for fear of wasting 4* champ levels.  And that's really no different now except that now you know that you are going to pull covers for 12 and only 12 4*s, and you know exactly how much ISO you will need to make sure no cover for those goes to waste. 

    Most of us didn't have all the 4*s champed under the old system and so when we went through our hoards there was going to be some level of waste that had to be accepted unless we were willing to champ everyone.  Champing everyone was obviously viewed as a much longer term play and so we all accepted some level of waste.

    Now though "champing everyone" really means champing the latest 12 which is far more attainable and so it kind of feels like vaulting has created this massive ISO need for anyone hoarding when I don't think it really has.
  • waywrethwaywreth Posts: 285 Mover and Shaker
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    I used to open all my CP and Legendary tokens.  Now, that'd be a waste of CP and Legendary tokens.  It's the ISO not the covers that's the issue.  I'm around 850 CP with no end in sight, I still have over a dozen fully covered 4* characters with no ISO to share.
  • smkspysmkspy Posts: 2,024 Chairperson of the Boards
    I hoard more since vaulting has been implemented
    Never hoarded before vaulting, and now I'm forced into it two later. Basically, just trying to catch up on champing the fully covered 4s while also waiting for new characters to enter to the pool.

    I would probably start hoarding everything but elite tokens too, but really depend on the 2 star farm for that iso boast when champing.
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