Crash of the Titans needs a change

24

Comments

  • Jaedenkaal
    Jaedenkaal Posts: 3,357 Chairperson of the Boards
    Well they did just add... 1000? ISO to DDQ. And an elite token (250-500 ISO any time you want). And a third taco token (more ISO, or rarely, HP). Sooooooo yeah. They're on it.
  • matthatter
    matthatter Posts: 151 Tile Toppler
    I too agree that there need be a more regular supply of 4*s, especially vaulted ones. That's been discussed ad nauseam. I really like the idea of the mini events like Antman, Chulk,Phil, etc. I'm not a developer, I have no idea what it takes to make those, but it's a fun little event, it seems to becoming a semi-regular thing w/ Star-Lord and R&G getting one now. Why not just have a 3 day mini event for all 4*s rewarding a cover at the end of it?
  • DaveR4470
    DaveR4470 Posts: 931 Critical Contributor
    edited May 2017
    Daily 4* rewards totally devalue virtually the rest of the game -- tokens, PvE prog/placement awards, PvE prog/placement awards, alliance awards.  Why would you spend hours grinding towards a top PvE or PvP reward 4* cover when you can just NOT play and wait until the cover rolls around in the daily CotT?  That's simply not a good design strategy.  The once-every-5-days is pretty generous (in context) as is.
  • veny
    veny Posts: 834 Critical Contributor
    Since vaulting, CoT needs to be on daily basis. Yes i am serious - there are too many 4*s (more than 3*s) and vaulting pretty much locked the oldest 4*s (you can get them from promoting 3*s or PvE/PvP, but we are talking about one specific cover for one specific character per couple of days).
  • Pogo
    Pogo Posts: 185 Tile Toppler
    I know this is not ideal for every user; this is my own thought based on where I am in the game at this time.

    Burrito: just straight-up award a taco instead of making the taco a final progression reward.
    Crash: Awards a cover for the mandatory character, not the same color as in the taco vault.

    Proposed new additional node: Thematically similar to Crash; Beatable once per taco cycle; awards LT/CP
    Follows one of these formats:
    • Player can form a team of 3 but is limited to characters from the newest twelve 4-stars
    • 1 Mandatory character from newest twelve 4-stars; mandatory changes daily (Opponent would need to change daily as well, in order to match the mandatory) but still locks upon victory.
    • Same, but instead of solo battle, the player can fill the remaining party slots from full roster

  • WirriesT
    WirriesT Posts: 10 Just Dropped In
    edited May 2017
    Edit: I sense entitlement. 

    They added bonus heroes, and the vaulting system to make it easier to get a more focused group of characters and you're still saying that you want a 4* cover every single day, AND a weekly LT crash. Pshhh. I strongly disagree. 
  • veny
    veny Posts: 834 Critical Contributor
    edited May 2017
    I am telling this again - Yes, we need CoT on daily basis. Especially after the vaulting...
    BUT instead of Legendary token, we should get 4* as a reward plus 5 CP at maximum points (dont remember how much it is now, 37999?) - with this, we would get 4* every day, same 5* chance in long run and no 5* inflation caused by obtaining 1 LT each day.
  • Jarvind
    Jarvind Posts: 1,684 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2017
    I go back and forth on this.

    On the one hand, the massive amount of 4*s in the game would seem to warrant more covers being available. 

    On the other, with vaulting in place I no longer really buy that it's hard to cover 4*s. Every team I see in SHIELD sim has Carols, Wasps, Blades, and Medusas in the 280s. Obviously, that doesn't address the issue of older characters being difficult to cover, but that's a separate conversation.

    You need to keep power creep in mind. Fourstars are already basically the new 3s, and 3*s are practically speed bumps - outside of being maxchamped with the essential boost, most are inconsequential at the 4*  level.

    Making 4*s even easier to obtain than they are now by offering a daily guaranteed cover pretty much also guarantees that one of the following scenarios happens:

    A: Everyone ends up with basically the same roster, with RNG-based 5* acquisition being the only way to pull ahead. Stagnation is rampant. I'll allow that vaulting is already pretty much putting us on this path, though at a slower rate.

    B: Scenario A happens, and devs are forced to make 5*s easier to acquire and then introduce a 6* tier, alleviating the stagnation but kicking power creep into warp drive.

    I don't have an easy solution to this. Just sayin'.


  • MissChinch
    MissChinch Posts: 509 Critical Contributor
    Jarvind said:
    I go back and forth on this.

    On the one hand, the massive amount of 4*s in the game would seem to warrant more covers being available. 

    On the other, with vaulting in place I no longer really buy that it's hard to cover 4*s. Every team I see in SHIELD sim has Carols, Wasps, Blades, and Medusas in the 280s. Obviously, that doesn't address the issue of older characters being difficult to cover, but that's a separate conversation.

    You need to keep power creep in mind. Fourstars are already basically the new 3s, and 3*s are practically speed bumps - outside of being maxchamped with the essential boost, most are inconsequential at the 4*  level.

    Making 4*s even easier to obtain than they are now by offering a daily guaranteed cover pretty much also guarantees that one of the following scenarios happens:

    A: Everyone ends up with basically the same roster, with RNG-based 5* acquisition being the only way to pull ahead. Stagnation is rampant.

    B: Scenario A happens, and devs are forced to make 5*s easier to acquire and then introduce a 6* tier, alleviating the stagnation but kicking power creep into warp drive.

    I don't have an easy solution to this. Just sayin'.



    I agree, but its the nature of the game, flesh out the 5* tier a bit more, introduce a new resource and bring on the 6* tier... two years after that bring on the 7* tier.  

    Its just too hard a job to take the current structure they have, try to rush all the new players to 4*s but still keep the 4* tier interesting for vets.  This is not me casting dispersions on the designers abilities to make it work, its me recognizing its a nearly impossible problem to solve... 

    They have a game where power creep is inherent, its required to keep the game interesting, just work with it...  5*s are interesting now and people want em, there's a significant 5* game, despite everyone saying SS was absurdly powerful when the 5*s were first released... 

  • orbitalint
    orbitalint Posts: 511 Critical Contributor
    edited May 2017
    MissChinch said:
     despite everyone saying SS was absurdly powerful when the 5*s were first released... 
    Maybe I'm not remembering it completely correctly but I'm almost positive it was the match damage and health of a max 5* (unsure if it was max though) that really gave that impression along with his blue heal. Any single max 5* could do the same vs the computer. He owned Carnage and two other 4*s of the day with those alone.

    I don't remember his v1.0 powers being any different after release, personally.

    Edit: disregard. You were making a point about power creep and using the 5* jump of ss release as evidence of it.
  • smkspy
    smkspy Posts: 2,024 Chairperson of the Boards
    Since I don't know ow to remove an accidental quote bar...


    what about a daily 4 star for vaulted heroes and on day 5 your standard LT. 

    People get greater access to those old vaulted characters are are undoubtedly not represented enough in the current reward structure and then there is still that standard pull once a week from the latest for those that like it the way the game currently stands.

    Cue, but the game economy will crash comments.
  • carrion_pigeons
    carrion_pigeons Posts: 942 Critical Contributor
    This is one of those suggestions like colorless covers, that is just never going to happen, no matter how often people bring it up.  I'd love for the 4* tier to be as accessible as this would make it, but we've had this suggestion come up maybe twenty separate times since DDQ was put into the game, and it's obviously a non-starter.

    The reality is that the devs clearly aren't interested in letting people farm out the 4* tier the way people do with the 3* tier.  The design intent seems to be for 4*s to be the incentive for people to get involved in competitive play.  Making them easier to get via DDQ interferes with that.  You might make the argument that as more people finish off the 3* tier, the game will lose a lot of its draw on the players who don't like MPQ's competitive play, although I don't know how true that really is.  But in any case, saying, "4*s aren't valuable so they should be even less valuable" isn't going to win any points from designers.

    You need to stage your arguments from the stance of "what will players find sufficiently engaging over the longest possible period of time, to keep them hooked?".  *That's* the perspective that the devs are coming from, treating the game like an addictive drug and themselves as dealers.  Making the game fun is only a valuable design goal inasmuch as it staves off *just enough* frustration to keep people going.  Anything more than that just invites players to accomplish their goals faster and be done with the game, which hurts their bottom line in the long term.
  • vinsensual
    vinsensual Posts: 458 Mover and Shaker
    Why not just make it every 3 or 4 days instead of every 5?  Or maybe run something concurrently like the Thanos event that features the vintage 4s, because pve rewards/essentials has felt a lot more skewed towards the current 12 recently.
  • Felonius
    Felonius Posts: 289 Mover and Shaker

    How about Crash stays as is, 1v1 for LT every 5 day.  I can see why players would want to keep this because an LT equals a chance at 5*, chance for a BoHe, plus that little extra XP for opening a token.  Plus, I like the challenge of the 1v1 match.  So, I'd vote to leave this as-is.

    But, I'm all for more access to 4* covers.  Get an extra 4* every day from DDQ?  Sure, I'm ok with that!  I do not think it would harm the game, either (especially considering how quickly they are releasing new characters).

    I've personally always hoped they'd add a node that awards a cover for the Essential 4* for the current PvE.  I think that's long overdue.  This node is locked behind The Big Enchilada, but also like TBE, the player can select anyone from their roster to complete it.  I'd be fine getting a cover a day for the PvE Essential, but that's likely going to be considered too much by D3/Demiurge.  So, maybe they would allow it to run similar to Crash, in that the player gets X amount of days to complete the node, and it can only be completed once during that time.  The X = the number of days of the current PvE event (so when Enemy of the State is running, you have 7 days, when Heart of Darkness is running, only 3, etc.).

  • DeltaAlpha75
    DeltaAlpha75 Posts: 11 Just Dropped In
    Past day 1000 and I simply don't get how people want more 4*. i think the current pace earns you more than enough 4* covers to get all new 4* championed. So yeah, that means completing old ones will get a real pita.

    I never get a 4* from reward, maybe when i play intense on the new release event. i just earn daily CP and LTs from DDQ, 25cp from pve, 10 cp from pvp.

    i earn them faster than they rotate out. 

    So why the hype for old covers? completitionists? i mean with the current CP income you could probably just buy the covers when you are really in desperate need to get them.

    But a daily 4* cover? c'mon ...
  • ZeiramMR
    ZeiramMR Posts: 1,357 Chairperson of the Boards
    In the past, I have argued that having a daily 4* up-for-grabs is too good of an increase for gamelife sustainability. Now that we have the change that archives characters in tokens? A daily 4* cover is still too good of a change. I think the next improvement to DDQ rewards in line with their current rewards would be a daily Vintage Heroic token, possibly with more ISO.

    As much as people here hate them for some reason beyond the same chance of a 2*, it will provide a little more help to all the people who have greatly slowed their progression in champion levels since the archiving/bonus hero change, and allow for saving those tokens until you are ready to open them. On average, that comes out to two 4* covers, a handful of 3* covers in the champed characers that are now sluggish, and a bonus cover or two each season.
  • ZeiramMR
    ZeiramMR Posts: 1,357 Chairperson of the Boards
    In the past, I have argued that having a daily 4* up-for-grabs is too good of an increase for gamelife sustainability. Now that we have the change that archives characters in tokens? A daily 4* cover is still too good of a change but not by as much.

    I think the next improvement to DDQ rewards in line with their current rewards would be a daily Vintage Heroic token, possibly with more ISO. As much as people here hate them for some reason beyond the same chance of a 2*, it will provide a little more help to all the people who have greatly slowed their progression in champion levels since the archiving/bonus hero change, and allow for saving those tokens until you are ready to open them. On average, that comes out to two 4* covers, a handful of 3* covers in the champed characters that are now sluggish, and a bonus cover or two each season.

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