**** Wasp (Janet Van Dyne) ****

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  • PolaresPolares Posts: 2,359 Chairperson of the Boards
    Tiger Wong wrote:
    3* Spider-Man
    3* falcon
    Wasp

    I've used this and it works. My wasp is only 2/1/1 but the synergy is clearly there. A big problem to me is that of the main shield casters, many of them use the same color as wasps tactical intuition. Magneto, Cap, and falcap all use yellow for the shields.

    But 3* falcon doesn't. And Spider-Man gets his on any purple match for your team. So get those shields up as much as you can and with falcons yellow passive, you're pumping up the strength of your tiles before and after the switches. You only need one falcon bird strike + tactical intuition to completely flip the match in your favor. But unlike bullseyes black passive, you don't have to struggle to kill a character to get it to go.

    Of course a big problem is you're only doing damage with strike tiles and wasps black. But this team works/will work. At least not on defense.

    This team might work, but I don't think it is a very viable team to pair a 4 with two 3s :S
    jobob wrote:
    Just try her in a wave PVE with 4Cage and PX. Granted, it's a limited situation... But she's phenomenal with those 2.

    This one, specially against Goons, is much more viable.

    But in the end she is a bit like Reed. Yeah there might be one team or two where she can work, but in the end, is far better and more effective in most scenarios just to bring a completely different team.
  • sambrookjmsambrookjm Posts: 1,408 Chairperson of the Boards
    My Wasp is a 4/1/1, and I've had to use her for the first time...pretty much ever in the latest Thick as Thieves event where she's the required 4-star. More often than not, I've had her yellow ability with no special tiles on the board. Granted, that's because Jean Grey and Scarlet Witch (essentially a Cheat Code team) are both boosted. I think her yellow could be fixed with a pretty simple addition.

    If there are no special tiles out, create a strength X attack and a strength Y protect tile. At LVL 5, take a page from 3-star Daken and create two of each at a lower strength.

    That way, no matter who her teammates are, she can still be of some use.

    I don't have much experience with her level blue and black powers, but I've gotten the blue one going once or twice and it seems OK. My Wasp doesn't have enough covers in those abilities to make a good judgment, though.
  • spatenflootspatenfloot Posts: 585 Critical Contributor
    Has anyone gotten enough covers to try wasp, medusa, and capt marvel together? I think it could be pretty good but can't test it myself.
  • VhailorxVhailorx Posts: 4,064 Chairperson of the Boards
    Has anyone gotten enough covers to try wasp, medusa, and capt marvel together? I think it could be pretty good but can't test it myself.

    I am sure someone has enough covers for that; but it's not me. So this is all though experiment:

    It's a fun idea, but I think color overlap and the sheer number of passives is a bit of a problem with this team. there are only 3/6 active colors (purple, black, yellow), and only 5 total active powers (1x purple, 2x yellow, 2x black).

    Plus you will get almost no value from Wasp's yellow since it will almost always be better to use Carol's yellow. And you will never use Wasp's black when you have Carol's. And Medusa's purple is really only great if the ai creates tiles. So if the board only provides red/green/blue ap you might be in trouble.

    I think Carol is better played with either wasp or medusa, but not both.
  • Tiger_WongTiger_Wong Posts: 380 Mover and Shaker
    Really, they don't match that well together. They have two colors that overlap (black and yellow) and you wonder why you should use Wasps blackflag.png over Carols blackflag.png

    After Janet gets her passive out, then maybe you can find a use for Carols active yellow to speed up the AP thieving and power up a special tile. But that's probably after Janet already switched some tiles with her own active yellow.

    You'd really only be using Carol for her yellow (and maybe green) passive.
  • VhailorxVhailorx Posts: 4,064 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2017
    No, the combo with wasp and carol is that janet's passive creates a cd that will proc every turn. And carol will buff tiles with every cd that procs. So if you get a few tiles out, and then collect 9 blue, those tiles will quickly become deadly.

    Also, wasp's yellow every once in a while will further boost tiles and can create defense in a pinch.

    But you could really use a green/blue/purple/red user with them!
  • Tiger_WongTiger_Wong Posts: 380 Mover and Shaker
    Yeah, like I said, you'd only be using Carol for her yellow (maybe green) passive. And that's after you get 9 blue for Janet. And that's probably after you use Janet's yellow to swap tiles (and boost) some shield/strike tiles.

    I was just looking at my roster to find a green/blue/red/purple user. I really think Wasp goes best with 3* Falcon. They both use blue passively and Falcons purple floods the screen with shields for Wasp to flip. And his yellow passive powers strengthens what's already strengthened with the flip.

    So they need a 3rd. I've been looking at......

    5 star icon_captainamerica.png (his red creates 11 yellow, you can hold onto his blue until late, and his own yellow wreaks havoc)
    icon_scarletwitch.png (creates purple for Sam which needs 12 to activate)
    icon_hulkcho.png ( his black is cheap and creates charged blue, his green wreaks havoc and his passive does damage. But it puts more green on the field which only he can do something with)
    icon_peggycarter.png (stalls with her yellow passive and her active blue. Also hits really hard with her red that's only 9 AP)
    icon_warmachine.png (his blue hits hard and activates at 11. His red puts a bunch of attack tiles on the field and his green creates havoc. The problem is, he makes the team really slow)
    4* icon_ironman.png (his blue creates shields but should I wait to activate it or not? He's a one man band, and can almost be used independently from Wasp and Falcon)
  • eidehuaeidehua Age Unconfirmed Posts: 521 Critical Contributor
    I do like Carol with wasp a lot.
    You could get 8 black with Carol, and then 9 blue and keep getting stronger and stronger strike tiles, and flip for defense if you need to block an attack
    Against goons, a great third would be star lord.
    Against other PVE teams IM40 + Wasp + Carol is pretty nice. Get out carol black early, then set up im40 yellow.

    For PVP I liked peggy + carol
  • CCW1208CCW1208 Posts: 139 Tile Toppler
    Tiger Wong wrote:
    Yeah, like I said, you'd only be using Carol for her yellow (maybe green) passive. And that's after you get 9 blue for Janet. And that's probably after you use Janet's yellow to swap tiles (and boost) some shield/strike tiles.

    I was just looking at my roster to find a green/blue/red/purple user. I really think Wasp goes best with 3* Falcon. They both use blue passively and Falcons purple floods the screen with shields for Wasp to flip. And his yellow passive powers strengthens what's already strengthened with the flip.

    So they need a 3rd. I've been looking at......

    5 star icon_captainamerica.png (his red creates 11 yellow, you can hold onto his blue until late, and his own yellow wreaks havoc)
    icon_scarletwitch.png (creates purple for Sam which needs 12 to activate)
    icon_hulkcho.png ( his black is cheap and creates charged blue, his green wreaks havoc and his passive does damage. But it puts more green on the field which only he can do something with)
    icon_peggycarter.png (stalls with her yellow passive and her active blue. Also hits really hard with her red that's only 9 AP)
    icon_warmachine.png (his blue hits hard and activates at 11. His red puts a bunch of attack tiles on the field and his green creates havoc. The problem is, he makes the team really slow)
    4* icon_ironman.png (his blue creates shields but should I wait to activate it or not? He's a one man band, and can almost be used independently from Wasp and Falcon)


    The 4 blade could be the third one
    4 blade create strike tile spontaneously
    wasp + cap could strength strike tile
  • TatercatTatercat Age Unconfirmed Posts: 930 Critical Contributor
    Based on some the ideas here discussed (and some alliance suggestions), I tried out my recently champed Wasp in this team:

    Lvl 273 wasp_icon.png 5/3/5
    Lvl 218 star.png star.png star.png icon_blade.png 3/5/5
    Lvl 145 (boosted level, norm is 70) star.png star.png star.png star.png icon_caroldanvers.png 3/3/3

    Basic idea was to use Blade’s green passive to quickly get out the red strike tiles so Wasp could have something to use her yellow on. For that combo, yellow was the strongest color due to champ Wasp, so Carol’s green passive fed it. Once Wasp’s blue and Blade’s black get going you’ve got two 1 turn countdowns setting off Carol’s yellow. Much buffage ensues.

    Did some of the trivial nodes in Venom Bomb and had some quick success, so I gave it a real test: Final node of the 2nd sub against lvl 329 Demolisher/Eddie Venom/Carrier (this was the 5th clear of the node).

    It was rough in the beginning with Venom being an active enemy, so he matched away red tiles and countdowns tiles with either turns or his green board shake. Took some hits, but at least one red defense tile remained, and by the end of the match it was stopping 8554 damage, (just that one tile) completely negating the symbiote countdowns when they went off. Red was scarce by that point so I wasn’t getting any new strike tiles, and didn’t do Wasp’s yellow flips until I could do it twice in a row to keep the shield, but by that point Carol was buffing Blades purple attack tiles too, so eventually they went down.

    So my thoughts are is that it’s a very effective and fun team, especially with a good board and once I’m able to start leveling Carol, with two significant caveats:

    1. It’s slow, at least with a low level Carol, so its not something I’ll turn to in a quick PVP climb or end of PVE sub grind.
    2. It’s really works best against goon teams who can’t move the board each turn. Regular enemies and Ultron Sentries would be considerably harder to pull off, especially against board shakers or a Teen Jean. Loki and Moonstone’s black could also be very deadly if timed right.

    But it is fun. And once 4* Carol gets to an equal level with Wasp, black might be the strongest color, maybe improving the overall game plan. I was disappointed that Wasp doesn’t work at all with Antman, that seems like it should have been a no brainer like Cage and IF. But I am eager to try out that 4* Cage /Prof X combo too.

    UPDATE: Just saw Buret0's thread on that same team, yowza!: https://d3go.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=58015
  • DesertTortoiseDesertTortoise Posts: 392 Mover and Shaker
    Update is significant. Here's a chart I threw together with the new and old figures:

    KyHpbwp.png

    Notes:
    • Her yellow is self sufficient now and costs 5AP instead of 8. That's pretty spammable especially if you pair her with Star-Lord who reduces its cost.
    • Blue is borderline a trap tile now. Does over 11K when boosted. You'll either be thrilled with the AP steal or happy they nuked themselves. Great change.
    • 7AP for 4,500 damage and a 3 turn stun is a great return. Great improvement.

    She's very unique and strong now. I'm looking forward to champing her and would have never thought she would have been improved to this degree. 3/5/5 in almost every case except for if you have an active blue user and an active black user that overshadows her.
  • VhailorxVhailorx Posts: 4,064 Chairperson of the Boards
    I am kind of thinking 5/5/3 might be the way to go. Especially if you build a team to spam tiles. At 5 ap it is cheap enough to cast multiple times. So paired with a strioe tile spammer (blade, oml, phoenix, etc) she could be strengthening by many thousands of points with each cast.

    And two matches to start blue is a real incentive to set it at 5, let alone the massive damage boost.

    With 5+k of strikes on the board, a little less damage from black isnct that big a deal.
  • CrowlCrowl Posts: 1,504 Chairperson of the Boards
    Vhailorx wrote:
    I am kind of thinking 5/5/3 might be the way to go. Especially if you build a team to spam tiles. At 5 ap it is cheap enough to cast multiple times. So paired with a strioe tile spammer (blade, oml, phoenix, etc) she could be strengthening by many thousands of points with each cast.

    And two matches to start blue is a real incentive to set it at 5, let alone the massive damage boost.

    With 5+k of strikes on the board, a little less damage from black isnct that big a deal.

    Whatever the build isn't it nice that we can actually discuss what his best build build rather than lamenting how rubbish she is, this seems like another good rework from them and Mr Fantastic must be wondering who he annoyed at mpq hq to only get his minor buff.
  • VhailorxVhailorx Posts: 4,064 Chairperson of the Boards
    Crowl wrote:
    Vhailorx wrote:
    I am kind of thinking 5/5/3 might be the way to go. Especially if you build a team to spam tiles. At 5 ap it is cheap enough to cast multiple times. So paired with a strioe tile spammer (blade, oml, phoenix, etc) she could be strengthening by many thousands of points with each cast.

    And two matches to start blue is a real incentive to set it at 5, let alone the massive damage boost.

    With 5+k of strikes on the board, a little less damage from black isnct that big a deal.

    Whatever the build isn't it nice that we can actually discuss what his best build build rather than lamenting how rubbish she is, this seems like another good rework from them and Mr Fantastic must be wondering who he annoyed at mpq hq to only get his minor buff.

    Yeah, the fantastic buff was extremely underwhelming. And much like 5*cap, wasp seems to have been a pretty easy character to buff. They made just about everyrhing about her better. Nothing subtle about making everything more powerful. Her usage and performance metrics must have been terrible.
  • DesertTortoiseDesertTortoise Posts: 392 Mover and Shaker
    The more I think about it, the more I'm inclined to think that 5/3/5 is the way to go unless you find someone with a way better black, then 5/5/3 is the way to go. 1AP difference to get her blue going along with the damage bonus probably isn't worth shelving her insane yellow and strong black.

    Some teams I came up with:
    • Carol/Wasp/Star-Lord would lack an active green and an active blue but it sure would be nasty. Carol and Wasp are a natural match because of their passives but they have 100% overlap, with Carol's black being better than Janet's and the opposite being true for their active yellows.
    • Wasp/4 Cage/Pun would be a pretty good one too. It's a full rainbow and you can use Pun's blue to generate strike tiles when you get 16 blue AP and his passive will buff your already massive strike tiles.
  • TatercatTatercat Age Unconfirmed Posts: 930 Critical Contributor
    I’m thinking 5/3/5 right now as well. That 5588 damage (or more if boosted) for Blue at 5 covers is nice, but that’s only if they match it, which can be very iffy due to the random color selection and the fact it’s just one a time. If it targeted the enemy’s strongest color like Countdown to What that would be a different story. I haven’t used her enough to see if one of those countdowns be destroyed by a Hulk or Juggs, does anyone know if that still triggers the damage?

    I tested Wasp with 4* Cage this week (Inside Job node repeats) and even with her old powers it’s a good team if you have him at 3/5/5 and just let her have all the yellow to start flipping his high protect tiles. I’m not sure on Max Punisher, I think his black is too strong to give that ap to Wasp. The blue is a good thought, but Cage would already be giving you a higher base strength tile to flip (only one at a time but it is passive and can be a bonanza against goons.)

    Either Carol or Starlord would good third too, for the Wasp/Cage pair. Just avoid board shakers, you want those special tiles you’ve buffed so much to stay out there as long as they can.

    In any case, it should be fun figuring it out this week.
  • Tiger_WongTiger_Wong Posts: 380 Mover and Shaker
    I wasn't a fan of my Carol/Wasp/Falcon 3* team before but after testing with the change, I'm all in.

    - because Janet's yellow is at 5, you only need 10 yellow to have both active. This is good because.....
    - with my 4/3/3 Wasp I only need 7 AP to steal 2 AP from a color and....
    - 5 AP for Sam to negate a special tile.

    So if there's more than one special tile on the field, I can activate Carols Executive Decision to speed up Sams cd (and boost my own special tiles) and get Sam ready to negate another on the next turn.

    And if Wasps passive is on a tile I want AP of (like black or purple) I can use it on the passive to get that AP immediately.

    My Carol is at 3/3/1 lvl 172. Wasp at lvl 188. So when Carols Energy Manipulation activates, I'm getting 2 more AP in yellow.

    It's really doing work right now. I'm falling in love.
  • Black DukeBlack Duke Posts: 670 Critical Contributor
    Wasp's health points at level 270 have increased from 12.211 to 13.934. She has now the same amount of health points as X-Force Deadpool, X-23 or Iceman.
  • JaedenkaalJaedenkaal Posts: 3,338 Chairperson of the Boards
    Black Duke wrote:
    Wasp's health points at level 270 have increased from 12.211 to 13.934. She has now the same amount of health points as X-Force Deadpool, X-23 or Iceman.

    Just came here to mention this. Increased from (Level+4) x 44.5 to (Level+4) x 51, about 15%.
  • FeloniusFelonius Posts: 289 Mover and Shaker
    Today's DDQ had a node that required Wasp, 3* Falcon, and 2* Bullseye... It was crazy efficient... Match was over once I fired Falcon's purple, then Wasp's yellow.
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