Selling 2* champions - stop the bad math

Zikato

With all these calculations post, many have gone with bad math.
I want to set people right. While it is a great change it has some drawbacks and I want people to make their decision based on real data.


ISO rewards and costs:

Selling 2* =

+65.000
Using 13 covers (which would have been sold otherwise) = -3.250
Re-maxing the 2* to level 94 + champion fee = -74.529
Using 50 covers to max a champion (which would have been sold otherwise) = -12.500
ISO rewards for championing = +17.500

Total: -7.779

Non-ISO rewards

375

= 125 from selling, 250 from champion rewards
5x heroic tokens (can equal 1.250 if sold)
3x hero specific 3* (can equal 1.500 if sold)
5


So basically for - 7.779 ISO (in the loooong run before you get all 63 needed covers for one champion) you will get the Non-ISO rewards mentioned above).

It's up to you to decide.

Edited one value, thanks.

Mercator

talking about bad math: how is 5 Heroics only 1000 iso?

Bulls

I guess that ppl who will decide to so it will benefit from those 3* champing them and pushing forward 3* championing rewards as I really don't see a point in doing that to sell those 3* covers for 500 iso. Also if you're doing 2* recycing on big scale you can basicly count that 5 heroic tokens as 10% progresion in recycled 2* (in worst case - as you can also score 3 or 4* from it as well)

Pylgrim

Note that people going over the trouble of selling and rebuilding, most likely already have championed 3*s meaning that the three 3* covers from the 2* champion path are 500 iso at minimum as they will be used to level up champions. They can be 1k iso, HP, tokens, CP or even 4* covers. Moreover, the heroic tokens hare 250 iso at minimum as well. They can provide 3* and 4*s from time to time. All things considered, I believe that a one could treat the net loss as a mere DDQ worth of iso.

Pollozz

Very well done Zikato, did the same math, those numbers are accurate. Another thing that people may overlook is that those 2 max champions, if u decide to sell them they act like a bank lending u money. Example: Have a 4 character that want to champ, and one of those covers are in reserve and about to expire and short on more than 100k. Well, solution simple, sell 2 max champ, get the instant iso needed, champion ur 4. Indeed u will lose some Iso, but is completely worth it. Think about those 2's like a bank and with some better benefits on the long run (talking about the xtra Hero Points and 3covers, and the RNG that comes with the 5 heroic tokens)

OneLastGambit

As pointed above the 2* covers which add levels and give you a 3* cover are worth more that on the 250iso you're giving them. They're even worth more than the 500 iso which you would make from selling the 3* cover.

My next 3 LThor covers will give me 500 iso, 1k iso and a purple rulk. So if I championed baby Thor then the 3 covers I get for LThor would be that value to me.

Saying all the covers at 2* level are worth 250 iso is both simplistic and incorrect.

Chipster22

OneLastGambit wrote:

As pointed above the 2* covers which add levels and give you a 3* cover are worth more that on the 250iso you're giving them. They're even worth more than the 500 iso which you would make from selling the 3* cover.

My next 3 LThor covers will give me 500 iso, 1k iso and a purple rulk. So if I championed baby Thor then the 3 covers I get for LThor would be that value to me.

Saying all the covers at 2* level are worth 250 iso is both simplistic and incorrect.

I'm ok with the math in the OP, but I'm always thinking of it as a worst case scenario. It will almost certainly be better, but this shows the minimum you would get.

There are lots of variables that will affect how much the rewards will be worth to a player. You could even convert the 375HP into a minimum of 937.5 ISO if you want to by buying the Daily Deal of the Heroic Tokens. 100HP will buy one heroic token per day which guarantees at least a 2* or better.

mikepro

The OP is correct there's a net loss of 7800 iso but think about the bigger picture. Iso 8 was upped in daily resupply rewards from 10 iso 8 up to 100 iso8 so if you have an active alliance who plays daily that's 2k iso right there. Plus ddq which is about 3500+ (provided the cover can be used for champ levels which is minimal 500 iso 8) or possibly better like a 4* or cp. So playing 1 full clear of either pve or a few pvp matches in a day you make up the difference in no time. I for one will be doing the 2* build and sell and I'll take the 7800 hit. 2* mags gives me covers for 3*mags which in turn gives me px cover yes please. Same with 2* obw gives me gsbw which I can use for winfinte. How about patch. Sure he gives xfw how about loki sure gives gr. I could go on and on and spending 1k per slot nope. I'll keep a few slots open for selling purposes of toons I could care less about like grocket or beast same with marvel. But I'll keep the top teir 3* since the rewards are worth it. Plus if I have 2 champed of most 2* that's a major iso boost if I've got a cover or 2 dupes in line waiting for champ. 65k per 2*. I sell off 5 of them and that's 1 full 4* almost champed by doing that. Seems good to me cause then I'll get more iso via champ 4* covers and higher cp rewards and same with hp.

smkspy

It still feels like a slick way for them to appear generous while still sticking it to us. They're not addressing the real issue that rewards need to adjusted.

we shouldn't have to cruch numbers and squint our eyes to make this look like a great thing.

Pollozz

smkspy wrote:

It still feels like a slick way for them to appear generous while still sticking it to us. They're not addressing the real issue that rewards need to adjusted.

we shouldn't have to cruch numbers and squint our eyes to make this look like a great thing.

And they are not gonna change, they are not gonna give u more iso because their revenue will go down. This is a game but also a business. So don't complain too much and be grateful for the changes.

elwhiteninja

Personally I feel this change is a step in the right direction but it should be a bit more. It takes along time to collect 50 of the same 2* , a longer time to collect 100 of the same 3* and forever to collect 100 of the same 4*.

Then if you start over and do it all again it should be worth more because of time spent. Sure you get the non iso rewards but my time is worth more than a few heroic tokens and a few cp. Not to mention the dramatic drop in power.

I'm not saying it should be huge but if it was even:
A 5k gain for 2*
A 20k gain for 3*
A 100k for 4*

I think that would be reasonable and personally I would actually be motivated to champion all the 2* and 3* I have been selling.

It would be a major investment because my usable iso would go way down before it goes up. Thereby rewarding people who play more/longer.

I don't think that small of a gain could be abused either

Quebbster

smkspy wrote:

It still feels like a slick way for them to appear generous while still sticking it to us. They're not addressing the real issue that rewards need to adjusted.

we shouldn't have to cruch numbers and squint our eyes to make this look like a great thing.

I think it is a way to speed up the 2* -> 3* transition a little more. By building duplicate Champions, you can get more covers for certain three-star characters. Thor, Steve Rogers, Captain Marvel, Patch, Daken, Iron Man 40, GSBW, Bullseye, Mohawk Storm and Ragnarok... There's a lot of useful stuff for a beginning 3* player there.

GrumpySmurf1002

The issue with doing the math this way is it makes it seem like if you did it infinitely, you'd run out of iso. You won't.

As others have pointed out, it's a loss compared to just selling the covers rather than championing, but farming itself is a net positive. Everytime you build and max a champion, it's worth 7971 iso + the other stuff.

It's your decision whether you want the most iso (just selling the covers), or a lesser amount of iso plus other things.

smkspy

Pollozz wrote:

smkspy wrote:

It still feels like a slick way for them to appear generous while still sticking it to us. They're not addressing the real issue that rewards need to adjusted.

we shouldn't have to cruch numbers and squint our eyes to make this look like a great thing.

And they are not gonna change, they are not gonna give u more iso because their revenue will go down. This is a game but also a business. So don't complain too much and be grateful for the changes.

Increasing the rewards even by double is not going to hurt their revenue. Having an increasingly difficult game for newcomers to get into will.

Love you be grateful and don't complain guys though, I've paid my fair share towards this game, so I'll complain all I want thank you very much. It's how consumerism works.

Pongie

Wasn't going to sell my 2* champions but I had covers expiring (6x23 covers). Sold 2* wolverine Since I never use him and had a cover from a token to replace.

I also have 5 xfw covers expiring, but I would need to sell another four 2* for enough ISO. I only have obw, bulleyes, mags, Thor and cap and would like to at least keep Thor and mags. So I have to earn 70k in the next few days. Even if I do, I'm not sure is it even worth losing three 2*.

PeeOne

After reading the initial post I was dead against selling.... But now reading the other comments... I'm for it again!!

Especially when I think that I rarely use Ares and I have a champion 3* Thor....

I have Sam Wilson at 165 and 2 covers waiting....

Off to contemplate

CT1888

PeeOne wrote:

After reading the initial post I was dead against selling.... But now reading the other comments... I'm for it again!!

Especially when I think that I rarely use Ares and I have a champion 3* Thor....

I have Sam Wilson at 165 and 2 covers waiting....

Off to contemplate

Honestly, I'd sell Thor, then rebuild at a later date for extra 3*Thor covers, and use Ares in Ddq instead.

Hendross

it's worth noting the 5 heroic tokens are worth a minimum of 1,250 (with a maximum of 5,000, <1% chance)

Personally, I think of them as a 65k iso loan when you're in an ISO crunch with covers expiring.

action711

Thanks for the math.

Paying 5000 ISO (net loss of 7.7k - token cash-in) for the extra rewards plus the ability to harvest up to 14 X 65k + HP is well worth it to me.

That's just 6 to max a 4*.

I'm also just a few weeks away from cashing in 600 Tacos, so will be nice for all those 2* to get used...

Plus with a farm of 14 those other non-ISO rewards add up quite nicely to 70CP and 3500HP

Now all I need to do is buy an Asgard to complete my farm. Shoulda known this change would involve getting my wallet out!

mckauhu

I just sold my 2* Thor for a great amount of iso8 and upped my Goddess Thor several levels. I think it was really worth it and I can build my 2* Thor (or some other 2* character) later on.

mikepro

Hmmmm on another note how many people play the lr every week. So if u get in at the start there's a ton of seed teams which could give you 2* covers and get you 2* rebuild done faster. Plus all the iso and tokens it can be done fairly quickly if you play a decent amount of lt. Not to mention the ddq tokens as well. How many 2* real wards are in there. I'd say probably about 200 are 2* reward teir. So save up for a few weeks till there's a 4* cover you want and open them all. Or do as 1 guy said hoard 600 tokens and open them all on the last day to clear the vault completely and rebuild then.