How should Caltrops be nerfed?

Colognoisseur

I agree with those who have already mentioned that there are many ways of dealing with Caltrops and Turn to Smoke and Threaten, and Pistol and Flamethrower and on and on and on.

This is a game where there are challenges which should require a strategy on how to deal with them. Not all nodes should be winnable by just using the heaviest hitter and clubbing the other team to death. Kishu requires a diiferent strategy and i hope they don't change it.

Buret0

Lerysh wrote:

It's a villain only thing that you (mostly) only see in EotS. Does it inspire hatred of Kishu and all that they stand for? Yes. Should you probably kill that Kishu even before Wolverine? Probably. The ability is fine tho, it's annoying as hell but what do you expect from a villain?

I could see making it target specific tho and increasing it's damage. Say instead of 1,000 group damage you get 1,500 to whoever is tanking that tile. That could lead to insta gibbs where you match 2 or 3 of them together tho.

Yeah, but lower damage AoE is easier to defeat with protect tiles. Yes, it might be doing 2,250 damage every time you trip one, but it is really doing 750 damage to all three. That means that the value of the protect tile is actually tripled. So when Squirrel Girl (160, 5/3/5) drops her four yellow 185 strength protect tiles, she negates 740 of the 750 damage to each member of the party. So if I can get nine yellow AP, the Kishu's might as well be called Kittens.

Unknown

For me, the most annoying part is when I use 2*'s mags purple, or some multiple match power to clear the board and all of a sudden I get 5 Caltrops traps hitting me at once. Meh. I like the element and the strategy that I have to employ to take out that character out first, but the no warning as far as how many traps are out throws me off.

Malcrof

with abilities like that, top row is always the safest, chances are no traps since much of it has dropped AFTER the traps were set... generalization, but works really well.

Unknown

wow im surprised so many agree with me and think its fair. I thought as usual I'd just be a voice against a mob

TLCstormz

WHOEVER voted for "it's fair"........omfg.

You people.

ClydeFrog76

LXSandman wrote:

I think the only change required is that they don't go off if the Kishu is stunned, and they don't go off when you kill the Kishu with the match. Those seem reasonable enough.

They suck, obviously, but I tend to agree that you need to have some challenge in the game. I just think they should have a way included to manage that challenge with forethought and strategy. As it is now you really can't manage it at all without just killing them.

LXSandman

Off topic, but there sure are a lot of users on here who sign their posts. There's no need. We know it's you who made the post because your username is right there.

Unknown

ClydeFrog76 wrote:

LXSandman wrote:

I think the only change required is that they don't go off if the Kishu is stunned, and they don't go off when you kill the Kishu with the match. Those seem reasonable enough.

They suck, obviously, but I tend to agree that you need to have some challenge in the game. I just think they should have a way included to manage that challenge with forethought and strategy. As it is now you really can't manage it at all without just killing them.

LXSandman

Off topic, but there sure are a lot of users on here who sign their posts. There's no need. We know it's you who made the post because your username is right there.

but how else would I advertise my stream without writing my name at the bottom *kappa*

-raisinbman

Lidolas

TLCstormz wrote:

WHOEVER voted for "it's fair"........omfg.

You people.

I enjoy the challenge.

Buret0

I like that the OP began with the proposition that Caltrops should be nerfed.

It is one of the most aggravating abilities in the game, but it certainly isn't OPed and doesn't require Thor's nerfhammer Meowlneer.

Just like Hexbolt didn't, God rest its soul.

GurlBYE

IReallyHatePVP wrote:

[Engage sarcasm mode]

You mean that game-breaking Hand ability that can only be defeated by the games most powerful moves like Hailstorm?

It should just be scrapped entirely.

[Sarcasm mode disengaged]

Colognoisseur wrote:

I agree with those who have already mentioned that there are many ways of dealing with Caltrops and Turn to Smoke and Threaten, and Pistol and Flamethrower and on and on and on.

This is a game where there are challenges which should require a strategy on how to deal with them. Not all nodes should be winnable by just using the heaviest hitter and clubbing the other team to death. Kishu requires a diiferent strategy and i hope they don't change it.

GuntherBlobel wrote:

Caltrops are fine by me, although it seems a little weird thematically that they disappear when the Kishu dies and that they do team damage. I also wish that Daredevil could see or disarm traps for theme.

It's true that I always target the Kishu first because of Caltrops, but I don't find it OP. In my opinion, trap powers should be threatening, because they are easily countered. Traps are really only effective against teams that cannot spam special tiles or tear apart the board.

In the current EoS run, you can very effectively fight against Caltrops with the following buffed characters:
removes traps + protects
protects
removes traps
removes traps
removes traps


This might also be a good time to look outside the buffed characters for characters that are better counters:
removes traps
removes traps

Let me be the first in line for one of you guys to give ,me these characters with 3 covers in the powers you guys suggested when they implement that.

It's lovely that there are hard checks. Those hard checks aren't on every team.
Also magnetos both require matches to activate and these all require ap to use.
What do you suggest i do on gorgon kishu kishu node, or any new player.

I agree it isn't a broken power but it also isn't anything but an annoyance as opposed to challenging.
The named character is supposed to be the threat not the goon following them around.

I'd be in favor of a damage increase but choosing 1 character or not being able to use these tiles on consecutive turns (in exchange for them using them from the beginning of the match)

Buret0

GurlBYE wrote:

Let me be the first in line for one of you guys to give ,me these characters with 3 covers in the powers you guys suggested when they implement that.

It's lovely that there are hard checks. Those hard checks aren't on every team.
Also magnetos both require matches to activate and these all require ap to use.
What do you suggest i do on gorgon kishu kishu node, or any new player.

I agree it isn't a broken power but it also isn't anything but an annoyance as opposed to challenging.
The named character is supposed to be the threat not the goon following them around.

I'd be in favor of a damage increase but choosing 1 character or not being able to use these tiles on consecutive turns (in exchange for them using them from the beginning of the match)

In 2* land you've got Bullseye for protect tile generation, OBW for healing, Captain Marvel's yellow can overwrite the trap tiles with TU, Magneto can blow up a 5x5 chunk of the board for AP generation/damage/board shake/caltrops removal or he can use his **** blue for much less effect. Depending on where you are in the transition, Juggernaut can blow up a lot of tiles with his Green and 1Storm can use hailstorm or her green.

If you don't have many 3*s well covered to deal with the caltrops this time around, you will by the time Enemy of the State comes up again.

blinktag

Hm. Forum seems to have eaten my previous post.

I'm fine with caltrops, except when Kishu is scaled past 200. Then the damage gets a bit out of hand.

But, I know about his power, so he gets targeted first. I use the mitigation methods mentioned earlier in the thread, and try to keep my matching to top tiles which are more likely to be clean.

The players have many, many advantages. It's okay for the goons to be difficult, now and again.

LXSandman

ClydeFrog76 wrote:

Off topic, but there sure are a lot of users on here who sign their posts. There's no need. We know it's you who made the post because your username is right there.

It's a habit thing mostly. Also I don't have a sig attached to my posts, kind of the same thing really. Maybe I should make one that says something Witty!

But this time I'll help you out and omit it.. ...

.
..
...

Kappa

Esheris

I think Caltrops should be seen, but let me explain.

They get their red tiles passivley AND when set out Caltrops cannot be seen. At least with other characters that can set out invisible tiles you have to let them collect their tiles. Daredevils can only be set on red, so you can work with that. Caltrops feels like there is no puzzley way to work around them.

Malcrof

Esheris wrote:

I think Caltrops should be seen, but let me explain.

They get their red tiles passivley AND when set out Caltrops cannot be seen. At least with other characters that can set out invisible tiles you have to let them collect their tiles. Daredevils can only be set on red, so you can work with that. Caltrops feels like there is no puzzley way to work around them.

Demolition...

Leave them as is, they are an annoyance, but one you get used to and plan around.

Esheris

Malcrof wrote:

Esheris wrote:

I think Caltrops should be seen, but let me explain.

They get their red tiles passivley AND when set out Caltrops cannot be seen. At least with other characters that can set out invisible tiles you have to let them collect their tiles. Daredevils can only be set on red, so you can work with that. Caltrops feels like there is no puzzley way to work around them.

Demolition...

Leave them as is, they are an annoyance, but one you get used to and plan around.

Yes, but you have to let Fury earn his blue tiles. They will get red passivley without earning it or being able to deny red. I said that above.

Unknown

Esheris wrote:

Malcrof wrote:

Esheris wrote:

I think Caltrops should be seen, but let me explain.

They get their red tiles passivley AND when set out Caltrops cannot be seen. At least with other characters that can set out invisible tiles you have to let them collect their tiles. Daredevils can only be set on red, so you can work with that. Caltrops feels like there is no puzzley way to work around them.

Demolition...

Leave them as is, they are an annoyance, but one you get used to and plan around.

Yes, but you have to let Fury earn his blue tiles. They will get red passivley without earning it or being able to deny red. I said that above.

goons get to do things players cant

Esheris

raisinbman wrote:

Esheris wrote:

Malcrof wrote:

Esheris wrote:

I think Caltrops should be seen, but let me explain.

They get their red tiles passivley AND when set out Caltrops cannot be seen. At least with other characters that can set out invisible tiles you have to let them collect their tiles. Daredevils can only be set on red, so you can work with that. Caltrops feels like there is no puzzley way to work around them.

Demolition...

Leave them as is, they are an annoyance, but one you get used to and plan around.

Yes, but you have to let Fury earn his blue tiles. They will get red passivley without earning it or being able to deny red. I said that above.

goons get to do things players cant

I never said they didn't! ^_^ The move itself just doesn't feel puzzley. But I'm in no place to argue, it's all opinon in the end.

Unknown

Esheris wrote:

I never said they didn't! ^_^ The move itself just doesn't feel puzzley. But I'm in no place to argue, it's all opinon in the end.

I think its the ultimate irony that Improved Daredevil and Elektra were released right around the time Kishu(the trap ninja) were. Kishu's trap SHEEPs all over both of them.