The upcoming X-Force nerf: The final nail in the coffin?

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  • DrStrange-616
    DrStrange-616 Posts: 993 Critical Contributor
    I would like to call for a vote of no confidence.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    onimus wrote:
    bknfoodie wrote:
    onimus wrote:
    Jameson2014 wrote:
    Xforce isn't even a huge problem. He's a great board shaker, but damage wise, he's pretty on par. Dismantling him if far more unreasonable than finding new ways to counter him. Nerfing him is just silly at this point.

    The devs need to be more creative than that.
    If this were true, then Xforce wouldn't be in 100% of team comps past 200 points.

    He's pretty obviously imbalanced.

    But I blame D3 for never releasing anyone that could stand up to him and nerfing the one character that came close.


    Where does this stop though? Once the 4* are ****, Then the best 3* are used in 100% of high end comps. So, let's nerf them too because they're "overpowered"? Thor/Hood/Loki. Let's just nerf everyone and play bejeweled? In any competitive game there has to be a power curve OR counters. You can't have counter strategy in this game because their goal is to release more characters/mechanics.

    How does it make any sense that LThor whos 3* better than 4* characters once Xforce is nerfed?

    This must be your first competitive game.

    ...Because that's exactly what is going to happen.

    Competitive balance in every game is always a merry go round of buffing and nerfing.

    This must be your first game ever. If there are tiers and 1* < 2* < 3* then you can expect 3* < 4*, if 4* tier is not better than others, then call it "trophy" or something else - not misleading your players.
  • Arondite
    Arondite Posts: 1,188 Chairperson of the Boards
    onimus wrote:
    bknfoodie wrote:
    onimus wrote:
    Jameson2014 wrote:
    Xforce isn't even a huge problem. He's a great board shaker, but damage wise, he's pretty on par. Dismantling him if far more unreasonable than finding new ways to counter him. Nerfing him is just silly at this point.

    The devs need to be more creative than that.
    If this were true, then Xforce wouldn't be in 100% of team comps past 200 points.

    He's pretty obviously imbalanced.

    But I blame D3 for never releasing anyone that could stand up to him and nerfing the one character that came close.


    Where does this stop though? Once the 4* are ****, Then the best 3* are used in 100% of high end comps. So, let's nerf them too because they're "overpowered"? Thor/Hood/Loki. Let's just nerf everyone and play bejeweled? In any competitive game there has to be a power curve OR counters. You can't have counter strategy in this game because their goal is to release more characters/mechanics.

    How does it make any sense that LThor whos 3* better than 4* characters once Xforce is nerfed?

    This must be your first competitive game.

    ...Because that's exactly what is going to happen.

    Competitive balance in every game is always a merry go round of buffing and nerfing.


    Yes and no, actually.

    In a competive but tierless game, such as League of Legends, there exists the proverbial merry-go-round you describe. Even in other tierless but competitive games, though, the merry-go-round may be forgone by a single or double pass at the extreme outliers, such as Street Fighter IV and Marvel Vs Capcom 2.

    But in a game with tiers? The tiers are supposed to be balanced internally - IE, all 1 Stars are comparably powered with maybe some sligth outliers. All 2 Stars are comparably powered with slight outliers, but all notably stronger than even the best 1 Star. All 3 Stars are comparably powered with slight outliers, but all notably stronger than the best 2 Star. All 4 Stars are comparably powered with slight outliers, but all notably stronger than the best 3 Star, etc. That's how tiers are supposed to work. That's the operating definition of a "tier" altogether.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    I quit when they nerfed Thoress but I still lurk around waiting for things to change. Looks like MPQ hasn't done anything worth mentioning in the last few months. If I were still playing and they nerfed XF, I'd quit. I don't bust my butt grinding long hours and staying dedicated to a game to max a character and then have it ripped out from underneath me. If I wanted to be baited and switched I'd... well no one wants to be baited and switched.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    DrStrange-616 wrote:
    I would like to call for a vote of no confidence.

    You win mate icon_e_biggrin.gif
  • wymtime
    wymtime Posts: 3,762 Chairperson of the Boards
    Xforce the unic. The devs must must really want us to play Xforce as 3,5,5. The think that little yellow countdown tile will create more interesting game play becuase if you let the cd go he heals back to full health, but if you match it it kills you.
    xforced green was not the problem. His problem was sergical strike generated AP. That is what made Xforce overpowered. I shall morn, as Xforce is now a Unic. The fact that Beasts old green is better than a 4* direct damage ability is a sad, sad day.
  • ojcAust
    ojcAust Posts: 140
    DrStrange-616 wrote:
    I would like to call for a vote of no confidence.

    Nice try Dr, but this seems to be a Dictatorship not a Democracy. There seems to be not much replying coming from the people in the seats of power.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Yeah, because service provider/customer relations very seldom have anything to do with forms of governing.
  • bknfoodie
    bknfoodie Posts: 53
    I don't think anyone should quit because of this change, but certainly don't level/buy 4* until they have a clue on to what they want 4* to do. It really doesn't make sense that all the 4* will be worse than most 3*.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    bknfoodie wrote:
    I don't think anyone should quit because of this change, but certainly don't level/buy 4* until they have a clue on to what they want 4* to do. It really doesn't make sense that all the 4* will be worse than most 3*.

    Perhaps for some ppl the lack of a meaningful 4* tier to work towards, obtain and use is reason enough to quit? The 3* game is nothing more than a hamster wheel once you reach a certain point anyway since only 3 characters can be used at any one time. Having another character you'll never use by choice isn't enough for some ppl.

    IMO the devs have already shown what they want the 4* tier to be and that's a small enough improvement over the 3* tier to have a limited functional impact on gameplay (mainly because the AI is so bad you need a BIG advantage to have any meaningful impact). They also believe a number of their 4* mechanics are better than they are in practice (from comments they've made), which impacts what you should expect to come.
  • Vinmarc43
    Vinmarc43 Posts: 266
    X-force is a lean mean fighting machine, every player like's him, fights are short and sweet but by no mean's was unkillable. They should have kept him the same way except for SS collecting ap and maybe 10 green at the worst. Now a dozen 3* schmucks are more powerful then a 4*.
    Also maybe get rid of all 4*, nerf them all to 3*, less problems and more balanced pvp. Reduce char health, don't boost it, I want to play less, not more.
  • greengiant33
    greengiant33 Posts: 24
    Interesting point. I do not want to play longer so I agree there.
  • greengiant33
    greengiant33 Posts: 24
    Nerf is here and the bait and switch was a success. Bait us into spending hp then nerf him. Which bait and switch is next. Xforce is a 3* now so please remove a star. He was over nerfed and not useable against the choices of 3* out there.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    I think if they wanted to fix it, they should up x-force damage slightly and have it steal 2 random AP.

    A properly balanced character should have three powers that offer three different, viable playstyles depending on the player's choice. There should never be one definitive build.

    Getting a legendary character to level 270 represents a commitment of time and/or money that has to be respected by the developers, or they risk removing any incentive to make gamers continue with their game. Legendary characters should be balanced with each other but superior to the rest. If not, then their HP cost needs to be lowered.

    It took me a year to get covers and max Wolverine. It's quite disconcerting to see him reduced to this degree.
  • Raffoon
    Raffoon Posts: 884
    Fitzhume wrote:
    I think if they wanted to fix it, they should up x-force damage slightly and have it steal 2 random AP.

    A properly balanced character should have three powers that offer three different, viable playstyles depending on the player's choice. There should never be one definitive build.

    Getting a legendary character to level 270 represents a commitment of time and/or money that has to be respected by the developers, or they risk removing any incentive to make gamers continue with their game. Legendary characters should be balanced with each other but superior to the rest. If not, then their HP cost needs to be lowered.

    It took me a year to get covers and max Wolverine. It's quite disconcerting to see him reduced to this degree.

    Well put.
  • Jonny1Punch
    Jonny1Punch Posts: 440 Mover and Shaker
    Fitzhume wrote:

    Getting a legendary character to level 270 represents a commitment of time and/or money that has to be respected by the developers, or they risk removing any incentive to make gamers continue with their game. Legendary characters should be balanced with each other but superior to the rest. If not, then their HP cost needs to be lowered.

    It took me a year to get covers and max Wolverine. It's quite disconcerting to see him reduced to this degree.

    Agreed 1000%. A 4* is a truly sacred character that represents so much sacrifice and effort. They should never be altered post-release unless absolutely necessary. They should also be play tested extensively before a release to ensure the vicious nerfcycle of XF/THORESS doesn't continue as it's beyond sloppy and creates massive distrust in d3. I can deal with a 3* getting tweaked a bit...... But a 4*???!? That should come guaranteed with a no-nerf contract or a guarantee of a complete ISO and HP refund.
  • bknfoodie
    bknfoodie Posts: 53
    Jonny1Punch wrote:
    Fitzhume wrote:

    Getting a legendary character to level 270 represents a commitment of time and/or money that has to be respected by the developers, or they risk removing any incentive to make gamers continue with their game. Legendary characters should be balanced with each other but superior to the rest. If not, then their HP cost needs to be lowered.

    It took me a year to get covers and max Wolverine. It's quite disconcerting to see him reduced to this degree.

    Agreed 1000%. A 4* is a truly sacred character that represents so much sacrifice and effort. They should never be altered post-release unless absolutely necessary. They should also be play tested extensively before a release to ensure the vicious nerfcycle of XF/THORESS doesn't continue as it's beyond sloppy and creates massive distrust in d3. I can deal with a 3* getting tweaked a bit...... But a 4*???!? That should come guaranteed with a no-nerf contract or a guarantee of a complete ISO and HP refund.


    Just wait until the transitioners whine about the kingpin/professor x wall. That combo owned my xforce/GT pre-nerf. Be warned, if you spend money on Kingpin/Prof X, they will be nerfed once the entitled transitioers whine about that wall.
  • Jonny1Punch
    Jonny1Punch Posts: 440 Mover and Shaker
    Agreed as well. I really enjoy kingpin and prof x, I even think the new IW has huge potential..... But I'm hesitant to level them up or spend actual money on them.

    I am sure they along with any decent 4* in the future will be overnerfed down to 3* status. So if you have those characters enjoy them for the next few months before they get "funbalanced ".

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