Upcoming PVE End Times Testing (*Updated)

Ryz-aus

Okin107 wrote:

DrUnpleasant wrote:

I'd love to know if the dev's read this stuff and either:

1. Think... 'oh yeah, we didn't think of that'
2. Think... 'suck it up you ungrateful gits, this event has 36hr subs - deal with it'
3. *Shrug*
4. Think... 'we've got enough work to do with making other changes, we'll get round to making everything 24/48hr subs eventually'
or,
5. Cackle and sport an evil grin

Yeah, I really can't find a reasonable explanation other than "Oops" for this. I mean, what's the point of having time slices when you still get screwed for half of the event? OK, not screwed, I may be exaggerating here, but you still can't take full advantage of this change.

The thing now is that it is bad for everyone and not just one timezone, so we've got that going which is nice.

Hey - I went from having two bad times for my subs to just one. It's a 50% improvement! *staying positive, looking for new elektra event to have 48 hr subs*

Unknown

Ryz-aus wrote:

Okin107 wrote:

DrUnpleasant wrote:

I'd love to know if the dev's read this stuff and either:

1. Think... 'oh yeah, we didn't think of that'
2. Think... 'suck it up you ungrateful gits, this event has 36hr subs - deal with it'
3. *Shrug*
4. Think... 'we've got enough work to do with making other changes, we'll get round to making everything 24/48hr subs eventually'
or,
5. Cackle and sport an evil grin

Yeah, I really can't find a reasonable explanation other than "Oops" for this. I mean, what's the point of having time slices when you still get screwed for half of the event? OK, not screwed, I may be exaggerating here, but you still can't take full advantage of this change.

The thing now is that it is bad for everyone and not just one timezone, so we've got that going which is nice.

Hey - I went from having two bad times for my subs to just one. It's a 50% improvement! *staying positive, looking for new elektra event to have 48 hr subs*

but i cant win the elektra for the coming elektra event.....positive? form -100 to - 90 and i cant look any positive

Unknown

RE: Time slice bracket fills. I joined my Slice 1 bracket at 6am (GMT) so 8hrs from the end of the first sub, and there were 350 players in that slice. Fine for me as I was just 1 clear behind the leaders and finished the sub in 6th place.

However, 8hrs later as the sub closed the bracket still only has 680 players. Pretty much anyone joining now, or in the next few hours is going to be utterly out of contention for rewards. Yeah, it's their fault to an extent because it's a gamble to join events so late, but I'm still of the opinion that 5 slices is too much.

Unknown

DrUnpleasant wrote:

I'd love to know if the dev's read this stuff and either:

1. Think... 'oh yeah, we didn't think of that'
2. Think... 'suck it up you ungrateful gits, this event has 36hr subs - deal with it'
3. *Shrug*
4. Think... 'we've got enough work to do with making other changes, we'll get round to making everything 24/48hr subs eventually'
or,
5. Cackle and sport an evil grin

1. Adding more end times is a quick, easy, low hanging fruit way to mitigate end times problems
2. Redesigning PVE to not have 12/36 hour subs is more complicated and who has time to do that when we have so much work to do breaking MMR even further

Unknown

Okin107 wrote:

DrUnpleasant wrote:

I'd love to know if the dev's read this stuff and either:

1. Think... 'oh yeah, we didn't think of that'
2. Think... 'suck it up you ungrateful gits, this event has 36hr subs - deal with it'
3. *Shrug*
4. Think... 'we've got enough work to do with making other changes, we'll get round to making everything 24/48hr subs eventually'
or,
5. Cackle and sport an evil grin

Yeah, I really can't find a reasonable explanation other than "Oops" for this. I mean, what's the point of having time slices when you still get screwed for half of the event? OK, not screwed, I may be exaggerating here, but you still can't take full advantage of this change.

The thing now is that it is bad for everyone and not just one timezone, so we've got that going which is nice.

Oops is when they do it the first time and the forums bring the outrage and point out the flaws. When they do it again for the next event, it is a big middle finger at all of us.

Unknown

papa07 wrote:

Oops is when they do it the first time and the forums bring the outrage and point out the flaws. When they do it again for the next event, it is a big middle finger at all of us.

A middle finger accompanied by "Sorry for this. We understand how this affects people negatively and produces frustration. We are actively working on a solution and we will inform you as soon as we have one." would make it a bit better.

However, they did say that this is a testing period for time slices so there's that. What I think could be done differently is the fact that we have testing during actual seasons. They are listening though and they are compensating for their mistakes, so it's not that bad.

acescracked

Are bugged levels a permanent result of PvE time slices? If so, how can we know which slice to join? As a point of reference; in the China sub of Prodigal Sun the Coercive Force node my levels are 227 in time slice 5. Whereas in slice 1 that same node is in the 60's.

Obviously, this allows others to reach progressions easier and helps them in PvP by not hurting their main characters and using no health packs. Not to mention saving on boosts. Can all time slices get set to the lower levels?

It was pointed out how time slices for PvP made the game harder or easier for certain slices and that fell on deaf ears. Now PvE slices have made the game harder or easier for certain players based on slices. Will this also fall on deaf ears? Most likely so.

Ryz-aus

acescracked wrote:

Are bugged levels a permanent result of PvE time slices? If so, how can we know which slice to join? As a point of reference; in the China sub of Prodigal Sun the Coercive Force node my levels are 227 in time slice 5. Whereas in slice 1 that same node is in the 60's.

Obviously, this allows others to reach progressions easier and helps them in PvP by not hurting their main characters and using no health packs. Not to mention saving on boosts. Can all time slices get set to the lower levels?

It was pointed out how time slices for PvP made the game harder or easier for certain slices and that fell on deaf ears. Now PvE slices have made the game harder or easier for certain players based on slices. Will this also fall on deaf ears? Most likely so.

It's worse than this, because it is player specific - not slice specific. In the prodigal son event thread, Phantron and lukewin both reported easy scaling while sumilea was seeing the regular hard opponents and they are all in time slice 2. Different difficulties by slice would suck, but at least you would be competing on an even level with your bracket. Instead, you get random players getting much easier opponents and being able to grind as much as they want.

Note - in both pve events I've had the easy scaling, and there is no way I should be seeing easy opponents based on my roster or past results. This is not at all the same as players with weaker rosters getting easier opponents then those with strong rosters as has been the norm.

Spoit

Ryz-aus wrote:

acescracked wrote:

Are bugged levels a permanent result of PvE time slices? If so, how can we know which slice to join? As a point of reference; in the China sub of Prodigal Sun the Coercive Force node my levels are 227 in time slice 5. Whereas in slice 1 that same node is in the 60's.

Obviously, this allows others to reach progressions easier and helps them in PvP by not hurting their main characters and using no health packs. Not to mention saving on boosts. Can all time slices get set to the lower levels?

It was pointed out how time slices for PvP made the game harder or easier for certain slices and that fell on deaf ears. Now PvE slices have made the game harder or easier for certain players based on slices. Will this also fall on deaf ears? Most likely so.

It's worse than this, because it is player specific - not slice specific. In the prodigal son event thread, Phantron and lukewin both reported easy scaling while sumilea was seeing the regular hard opponents and they are all in time slice 2. Different difficulties by slice would suck, but at least you would be competing on an even level with your bracket. Instead, you get random players getting much easier opponents and being able to grind as much as they want.

Note - in both pve events I've had the easy scaling, and there is no way I should be seeing easy opponents based on my roster or past results. This is not at all the same as players with weaker rosters getting easier opponents then those with strong rosters as has been the norm.

Do you have confirmation for this? All the incidences I've heard have been for the whole bracket, if not the whole time slice

EDIT: yeah, I got confirmation from 2 people in the same main in my alliance. That is so stupid, and I'm surprised the forums haven't burnt down from it yet

Unknown

Spoit wrote:

Ryz-aus wrote:

acescracked wrote:

Are bugged levels a permanent result of PvE time slices? If so, how can we know which slice to join? As a point of reference; in the China sub of Prodigal Sun the Coercive Force node my levels are 227 in time slice 5. Whereas in slice 1 that same node is in the 60's.

Obviously, this allows others to reach progressions easier and helps them in PvP by not hurting their main characters and using no health packs. Not to mention saving on boosts. Can all time slices get set to the lower levels?

It was pointed out how time slices for PvP made the game harder or easier for certain slices and that fell on deaf ears. Now PvE slices have made the game harder or easier for certain players based on slices. Will this also fall on deaf ears? Most likely so.

It's worse than this, because it is player specific - not slice specific. In the prodigal son event thread, Phantron and lukewin both reported easy scaling while sumilea was seeing the regular hard opponents and they are all in time slice 2. Different difficulties by slice would suck, but at least you would be competing on an even level with your bracket. Instead, you get random players getting much easier opponents and being able to grind as much as they want.

Note - in both pve events I've had the easy scaling, and there is no way I should be seeing easy opponents based on my roster or past results. This is not at all the same as players with weaker rosters getting easier opponents then those with strong rosters as has been the norm.

Do you have confirmation for this? All the incidences I've heard have been for the whole bracket, if not the whole time slice

EDIT: yeah, I got confirmation from 2 people in the same main in my alliance. That is so stupid, and I'm surprised the forums haven't burnt down from it yet

Working as intended. Easy to rig an election when one candidates votes are only worth 5% of a vote


Now that this pve is a complete cluster-f can we trickle down these covers and figure out why the enemy levels are so completely broken before releasing new characters

Unknown

Spoit wrote:

Ryz-aus wrote:

acescracked wrote:

Are bugged levels a permanent result of PvE time slices? If so, how can we know which slice to join? As a point of reference; in the China sub of Prodigal Sun the Coercive Force node my levels are 227 in time slice 5. Whereas in slice 1 that same node is in the 60's.

Obviously, this allows others to reach progressions easier and helps them in PvP by not hurting their main characters and using no health packs. Not to mention saving on boosts. Can all time slices get set to the lower levels?

It was pointed out how time slices for PvP made the game harder or easier for certain slices and that fell on deaf ears. Now PvE slices have made the game harder or easier for certain players based on slices. Will this also fall on deaf ears? Most likely so.

It's worse than this, because it is player specific - not slice specific. In the prodigal son event thread, Phantron and lukewin both reported easy scaling while sumilea was seeing the regular hard opponents and they are all in time slice 2. Different difficulties by slice would suck, but at least you would be competing on an even level with your bracket. Instead, you get random players getting much easier opponents and being able to grind as much as they want.

Note - in both pve events I've had the easy scaling, and there is no way I should be seeing easy opponents based on my roster or past results. This is not at all the same as players with weaker rosters getting easier opponents then those with strong rosters as has been the norm.

Do you have confirmation for this? All the incidences I've heard have been for the whole bracket, if not the whole time slice

EDIT: yeah, I got confirmation from 2 people in the same main in my alliance. That is so stupid, and I'm surprised the forums haven't burnt down from it yet

Yes this is me and LoreNYC. I got hit with the bug at the start of the 3rd set of subs and they did not.

lukewin

Spoit wrote:

Ryz-aus wrote:

It's worse than this, because it is player specific - not slice specific. In the prodigal son event thread, Phantron and lukewin both reported easy scaling while sumilea was seeing the regular hard opponents and they are all in time slice 2. Different difficulties by slice would suck, but at least you would be competing on an even level with your bracket. Instead, you get random players getting much easier opponents and being able to grind as much as they want.

Note - in both pve events I've had the easy scaling, and there is no way I should be seeing easy opponents based on my roster or past results. This is not at all the same as players with weaker rosters getting easier opponents then those with strong rosters as has been the norm.

Do you have confirmation for this? All the incidences I've heard have been for the whole bracket, if not the whole time slice

EDIT: yeah, I got confirmation from 2 people in the same main in my alliance. That is so stupid, and I'm surprised the forums haven't burnt down from it yet

The forums haven't burnt down from it yet because it is helping people and hurting people at the same time. I would be a lot more vocal about complaining if the bug wasn't in my favor. I feel real bad for Sumilea, as the bug is giving their opponents an unfair advantage, thus giving them a disadvantage. Sumilea is good people, in my book. If only the bug would put people I don't like at a disadvantage, I would have no problem with it at all. If more forum users were at a disadvantage, it would be a bigger issue. As it stands now, most people that have the advantage are milking it while they can, while the people that don't have it are having to play PVE as usual, against competition that isn't having to play PVE as usual.

Unknown

I noticed another issue with pve and sharding. Because the player base is being split into 5 different shards perhaps it's time to divide the main bracket sizes by 5? I'm currently in a main that at the current rate will take about three to four weeks to fill. Because the rubber banding is limited to subs only, this makes it impossible for anyone joining during a later. Sub to catch up or even enter a main with fresh people. Further the auto join requirement for subs forces everyone to play every clear of every sub if they want to place well in just a sub.

Just something to consider when restructuring the pve events

fmftint

"David wrote:

Moore"]Hello everyone,

We wanted to give you a heads-up that selectable Event end times testing for Story-based (PVE) content is set to begin with Iso-8 Brotherhood, arriving Friday, December 05, 2014.

We have waited to begin Story-based testing until after the Meet Rocket & Groot Event. While waiting made things harder for those outside of the Americas, the last thing we wanted was for the end times to make things worse for everyone due to unforeseen circumstances.

As with any testing, we expect that a few bugs may rear their ugly heads when the new feature is live. Should any issues occur we will work quickly to correct them. Please bear with us (and share your feedback) as we implement this exciting new feature.

Thank you!

*Update (12/03/14): The plan for this test is to have 5 selectable end times similar to how the Versus end time selection works. To keep variables down on the test, we're leaving the Sub-Event timers the same, which means that they're going to be 12 hour subs. This will help us to nail down any bugs that may appear. Specifically, we can rule out anything related to the changing of sub times.

A reminder - when selecting your end time, choosing a final end time in the afternoon may mean that previous subs end early in the morning.

so how'd that work out?

_RiO_

lukewin wrote:

I feel real bad for Sumilea, as the bug is giving their opponents an unfair advantage, thus giving them a disadvantage.

I think it's giving a direct disadvantage as well. Whenever I land on the bug's 'bad side', opponents immediately jump to lvl 130+ on even the lowest ranking nodes, outscaling my roster right from the get go. It's far, far more pronounced than on the 'regular old' PvEs. Really; only the nodes marked with Sentry's guest character remain playable, because they are locked at their unscaled lvl 45 starting point.

Given the complete lack of any developer responding to this issue, I have a sneaking suspicion that I'm going to share:

it's intentional.


I suspect the developers are running an A/B test, with half the brackets having community scaling applied and the other half with only personal scaling.

The locked guest character nodes are usually on the higher end of the base level spectrum; in this case 45. Lack of community scaling perfectly explains why brackets affected by this bug seem to have levels in the 25-80 range. The remaining level of individual fluctuation is explained by personal scaling. The unusually increased scaling on the brackets in the control group that do get community scaling? Well that would be a bug. Dollars to donuts someone either forgot to divide the accumulated community scaling factor by 2 before distributing it over half the effective population size, or forgot to exclude the group not affected by community scaling from generating community scaling (which they would happily do with a lvl 25-80 free ride...)


If this indeed turns out to be the developers A/B testing a new scaling system on a high-profile live event, then there should be hell to pay...

fmftint

I have a question, are we still TESTING PVE time sharding, or is this the new normal?

If we are still testing it is time to pull the plug
If this is the new normal I think I've had enough paying to beta test for you

GrumpySmurf1002

fmftint wrote:

I have a question, are we still TESTING PVE time sharding, or is this the new normal?

If we are still testing it is time to pull the plug
If this is the new normal I think I've had enough paying to beta test for you

It's a test with no rollback. The 'test' part is that they're openly futzing with settings as the event goes on.

They're still 'testing' PvP too, but since feedback is at a premium, it's hard to tell when they'll actually complete the 'test.'

_RiO_

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

fmftint wrote:

I have a question, are we still TESTING PVE time sharding, or is this the new normal?

If we are still testing it is time to pull the plug
If this is the new normal I think I've had enough paying to beta test for you

It's a test with no rollback. The 'test' part is that they're openly futzing with settings as the event goes on.

They're still 'testing' PvP too, but since feedback is at a premium, it's hard to tell when they'll actually complete the 'test.'

You haven't gotten the memo yet? They're adopting Google's model of perpetual beta...

(Not all snark; the game's patches are numbered with an 'r' prefix, which - together with 'rc' -, is most often used to indicate release candidates, i.e., public or privately disclosed beta versions of a final software product. Makes you think...)