All Alliances Increasing To 20 Member Slots

1…910121415

Comments

  • Unknown
    Unknown
    So how much does it cost now to start a 20 person alliance? Did they change the price at all?
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Hopefully this does not get lost, but I decided to see what the rewards were gathered since the alliance scheme came into play, I am only approximating, and not including any tokens/covers, only pure ISO/HP:
    high    top 10    mid top 500   low top 1000
                iso       hp      iso   hp     iso  hp
3/1/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
3/8/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
3/15/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
3/22/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
3/29/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
4/5/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
4/12/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
4/19/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
4/26/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
5/3/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
5/10/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
5/17/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
5/24/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
5/31/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
6/7/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
6/14/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
6/21/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
6/28/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
7/5/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
7/12/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
7/19/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
7/26/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
8/2/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
8/9/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
8/16/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
8/23/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
8/30/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
9/6/2014		 15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
9/13/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
9/20/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
9/27/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
10/4/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
10/11/2014	  15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
10/18/2014	  15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
10/25/2014	  15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
11/1/2014		15000	  300	  3000	150	1500	0
totals		  540000	10800	108000  5400  54000   0
		          High	top 25	Mid	top 500	Low	top 5000
season rewards	7000	350	3500	175	980	0
totals		  547000	11150	111500	5575	54980	0

    so with the totals, sure a person that bought only a few slots could have reaped the rewards, but even one of those that bought 1/2 to all the slots would have to place in the top brackets continuously and still not made back the amount they spent. So D3's argument about the people that did this already reaped the rewards is only true for those that bought maybe 4 or fewer slots.
  • dr tinykittylove
    dr tinykittylove Posts: 1,459 Chairperson of the Boards
    DuffManOhYeah wrote:
    So how much does it cost now to start a 20 person alliance? Did they change the price at all?

    Still costs just a bunch of iso when I saw it today. Had a bad connection and the game logged me in as having no alliance. :p

    A lot of the really small alliances are bleeding out though. I looked up my old alliance that I founded and it had just 3 members left, and there are lots of others sitting around half empty.
  • orionpeace
    orionpeace Posts: 344 Mover and Shaker
    edited November 2014
    As many of you on the forums well know, Heroes are cool. They're a great way of winning covers, having fun with friends, and competing with other players on the leaderboards. And the bigger the roster, the more that's the case. Conversely, the process to get to that bigger roster just isn't very fun. It costs a decent amount of Hero Points per slot when you get up there in Heroes and the methods for paying is a bit odd (the common practice of slot trading).

    Overall, we look at rosters as something that everyone should be able to get involved in and want to encourage players to have as large a roster as possible.

    To that end, we have decided that we're going to set all rosters to the old maximum of 100 slots. This means that any player, newly-started ones, or long time veterans are on the same playing field in regards to roster capabilities. Which of course, translates to increased cover gathering, Team-Up sharing, and competition for those high end rewards. Those newly-joined players probably won't be able to take on the vaunted likes of the X-Men, Immortal Rage, 5DV and the like, but now those same players will have a feel for what a useful roster can really be like instead of being only a shadow of what a functional 3* one can achieve.

    ~Modified IceIX Quote
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Got all 3 pages for blade... Was really excited to get him... But now I don't trust spending money on him if he's just gonna get nerfed. Why spend money on a character if it might get nerfed or if they might just decide to give all the covers out for free next week.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    At least I created my own empty passive alliance just in case they decide to change the creation cost to some arbitrary HP price or some 100k+ ISO. I'll just have it ready when I want to join back in the future icon_e_biggrin.gif
  • Nellobee
    Nellobee Posts: 457 Mover and Shaker
    So, new thought: Take the amount of HP each player spent on alliance roster spots. Subtract their HP earned in alliance rewards. Give that out. That way, no one has lost HP, the successful alliances are considered to have been already compensated, etc.
  • Raffoon
    Raffoon Posts: 884
    orionpeace wrote:
    As many of you on the forums well know, Heroes are cool. They're a great way of winning covers, having fun with friends, and competing with other players on the leaderboards. And the bigger the roster, the more that's the case. Conversely, the process to get to that bigger roster just isn't very fun. It costs a decent amount of Hero Points per slot when you get up there in Heroes and the methods for paying is a bit odd (the common practice of slot trading).

    Overall, we look at rosters as something that everyone should be able to get involved in and want to encourage players to have as large a roster as possible.

    To that end, we have decided that we're going to set all rosters to the old maximum of 100 slots. This means that any player, newly-started ones, or long time veterans are on the same playing field in regards to roster capabilities. Which of course, translates to increased cover gathering, Team-Up sharing, and competition for those high end rewards. Those newly-joined players probably won't be able to take on the vaunted likes of the X-Men, Immortal Rage, 5DV and the like, but now those same players will have a feel for what a useful roster can really be like instead of being only a shadow of what a functional 3* one can achieve.

    ~Modified IceIX Quote

    I like what you did. I'll try!

    As many of you on the forums well know, Maxed-Level Heroes are cool. They're a great way of winning covers, having fun with friends, and competing with other players on the leaderboards. And the higher the hero's level, the more that's the case. Conversely, the process to level up your heroes just isn't very fun. It costs a decent amount of ISO per level when you get up there in levels and the methods for paying is a bit odd (the common practice of holding down a button and waiting for 2 seconds, repeated 60 times).

    Overall, we look at levels as something that everyone should be able to get involved in and want to encourage players to have as large a roster as possible.

    To that end, we have decided that we're going to set all hero levels to the maximum of 50/94/166/270. This means that any player, newly-started ones, or long time veterans are on the same playing field in regards to roster capabilities. Which of course, translates to increased cover gathering, Team-Up sharing, and competition for those high end rewards. Those newly-joined players probably won't be able to take on the vaunted likes of the X-Men, Immortal Rage, 5DV and the like, but now those same players will have a feel for what a useful roster can really be like instead of being only a shadow of what a functional 3* one can achieve.

    ~Modified IceIX Quote
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    This kind of decision needed at least a month-long lead-in for people to wrap their heads around it and give feedback.

    It should've been approached like this:

    "In a month or so, all alliances will be going to 20 slots. We're giving you this heads-up for two reasons:

    1. You can stop spending HP on alliance slots now if you want, and

    2. We want to hear from alliance leaders in the forum about your reactions to this news - obviously you'll have questions about whether there will be compensation, how we came to this decision, and how it will affect all of you going forward."

    There. That's it. You don't leave any doubt that the change ISN'T happening, but you get the community involved. That's the whole point of Will's position, right?

    It's not rocket science to realize that if people perceive they have more of a say in how things are going forward (re: compensation for HP spent on alliance slots, if any), they're much more likely to be invested in the outcome, WHATEVER IT IS.

    (this same post was in a different thread but I'm posting it here, also, because I'm...like...WAY lazy, y'all)
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    This change fills me with absolute rage. I spent a lot of my own money to buy those slots. The idea that I earned extra covers and resources for that money means you can completely strip that benefit from me with zero compensation is so aggravating. I feel well and truly cheated.
  • woopie
    woopie Posts: 311 Mover and Shaker
    Am I the only one reading this as: HP spend related to alliance spots has slowed to the point where we're okay with cutting it. This will help people get more covers and drive future HP spend towards roster slots
  • Vohnkar
    Vohnkar Posts: 158 Tile Toppler
    For the ones that were asking if we would be refunded. I sent a mail to CS asking for a refund or something to compensate the amount of HPs wasted. and this is the response, and I quote:

    "Greetings D3P Customer,
    Thank you for your email in regards to Alliance slots.
    For those that opened Alliance slots and have participated in them for an extended amount of time, the rewards have outweighed the cost. The team is very excited to offer this new feature to the game, for all players to enjoy and to reap the rewards of what the Alliances are meant to provide in the game. In the meantime, the team will be reviewing feedback and sharing any updates on the forums.
    If you have any further questions or concerns, please feel free to contact us again.
    Best Regards,
    D3Publisher Customer Support Team (AJG)
    "

    So nice to see this, and no, my alliance didnt make it to top 100 in any season, we were top 250 on s1 and after that we've been top 500 and even top 1000. This is a nice update for new players but makes the money people spend on the game useless. Yeah, the message is clear and received, I'm a F2P from now on.
  • Lystrata
    Lystrata Posts: 322 Mover and Shaker
    Still wondering if anyone's going to address this... ever.. or if the news about the staggered end times is meant to be the appeasement that distracts us all from the ridiculousness of alliance slots?

    Not that the news of staggered end times isn't good and all, but it does show you've clearly had people online, and this thread is clearly causing people concern / anger, and you are clearly not addressing it.

    How does "You've participated in an alliance for an extended period of time" automatically equate to "So you've obviously won back the thousands of HP it cost you to open the slots." ? Because it clearly isn't the case, for many alliances.
  • Moon Roach
    Moon Roach Posts: 2,863 Chairperson of the Boards
    A day into the alliance change and not one of the Roaches has left to start a new alliance. And that gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

    I'm still a tad irritated at the way the changes have happened and the digitus impudicus aimed at those of us who paid for HP to expand, but the guys (and gals? who knows) rock.
  • MojoWild
    MojoWild Posts: 765 Critical Contributor
    I've waited for a while to throw my two cents in.
    Some background: I come from a casual 9 person alliance. I was about half of any given score. I paid for the extra slots we had (with HP that I won at C2E2 last April) and my son and gf are in it among other friends. So although I could be doing a lot better alliance-wise, I'm kind of obligated to stay. icon_e_smile.gif No one wanted to shell out the HP for more slots, so 9 people was where we were at for the last 6 months. With this change, we could now add some friends that wanted to join. My investment was minimal, but so were our rewards, since we were rarely even in the top 1000, let alone top 100.
    Now to my two cents:
    I don't think that people should ask for refunds because of all the extra rewards they didn't get. Just because you have a 20 person alliance, doesn't mean you're guaranteed a top 100 spot. What you're guaranteed is a better SHOT at a top 100 spot. What you do with your 20 person alliance is up to you. Maybe you'll be the next X-Men, maybe you won't. So just because your alliance didn't earn back what you spent so you should get a refund, is not a viable argument to me. Otherwise, everyone who buys a token hoping to get a Blade but gets a Bullseye will want a refund.
    ]That being said, I do think there should be SOME compensation for how much time you were allowed at that chance to get top 100 or whatever it would take to recoup your expenses. I think there should be a pro-rated refund system, something like up to one month gets 100% back, 3 months half back, 6 months nothing. Just a loose suggestion there.
    Anyway, these are my thoughts and maybe they won't be popular. Don't hate me for them icon_e_smile.gif
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    The alliance system was a bad idea from the start and nothing good could've come from it, mostly because there's literally nothing in this game that involves teamwork unless you count 'don't attack your own guys' or shield-hopping trickery as teamwork. By tying a large advantage for those who would spend on a broken system the whole thing is bound to crash at some point and that's where we're at now. I have no doubt people will try to con HP/money from D3 if any refund is allowed but this is their own fault. Hopefully they use that as a lesson and realize that bad decisions have a way of leading to nasty consequences later on.

    I don't think the roster size or max level analogy works because roster size gives you almost no meaningful advantage, while max level characters is sometimes detrimental in PvE due to scaling. More importantly both naturally ties into character progression so they should be rewarded, while it's hard to justify how spending 20K HP into an alliance is supposed to be some kind of natural character progression, even though it's one of the most important one you can make as a group. If there are team-based events in MPQ then it'd be perfectly fair, but no such events exist.
  • DrNitroman
    DrNitroman Posts: 966 Critical Contributor
    I know the unwritten first rule of MPQ is that rules may change at any moment
    It's not fair, but let's be optimistic, change can be refreshing

    Time passes, my motivation slowly fades away and I'm almost a lurker again.
    I'm hardly enthusiastic or angry about debatable changes anymore
    Ironically it was the creation of alliance that made me quit lurking

    Back in the very first days of alliances, I joined my alliance for free when it was a public alliance.
    Then I spent 1000 imcoin.png (more or less) to help the alliance's growth. I was made "commander" for that
    If I have to think in term of "investment" so no doubt I had my return on investment

    But for me it was not just an investment. It was a participation. A participation to our collective effort to build a 20 members alliance. A participation to the new alliance feature introduced by the devs.
    This game is in constant evolution, rules change, devs try to propose new features and involved players support actively the game by playing with the new rules, genuinely, entirely.

    Whatever we gained with our paid alliance-slots, devs could make a gesture to thank us. Because we really brought these alliances to life: we played the game. I don't ask for a refund. But a symbolic gift such as cover or tokens would be nice to reward dedication to the game. And, as stated many times in this thread, these gifts are virtual so devs could be generous icon_e_wink.gif

    TDLR; Alliance slots are free now, so be it. A gift for players who supported the alliance feature by buying slots would be a nice gesture.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    I'm not saying I want my hp back(though that would be nice) I would happily settle for a 3 star token for every slot I bought. Then I would at least have a chance at getting something useful.
  • homeinvasion
    homeinvasion Posts: 415 Mover and Shaker
    "David wrote:
    Moore"]We do feel though, that players who spent Hero Points in the past to expand their Alliances have reaped substantial benefits for doing so (increased Iso, covers, rewards, etc.) that compensate for the Hero Points spent to expand.


    What a weak excuse HiFi, I could have joined a top 100 rather than a new alliance to try to help new players transition and got far more rewards for NOT spending money, weak excuse, my estimation of you hit a new low.
  • Teddybabes
    Teddybabes Posts: 66 Match Maker
    How can I have REAPED THE BENEFITS in just two month?

    Ok, for a person buying ONE slot, BUT I JUST PAID $100 FOR ALL 20 SLOTS, have I got back 20.000 HP?

    NO I HAVENT!

    I too got the standard happy answer that they wont reimburse nothing. I will keep replying until I get a full refund. I will use Swedish laws to blacklist the company here if they think theft is ok.

Categories