*** Colossus (Classic) ***



  • NorthernPolarity
    NorthernPolarity Posts: 3,531 Chairperson of the Boards
    kalirion wrote:
    locked wrote:
    JoseMartins (I think that's the IGN) often runs featured/Colossus/GSBW at high scores (1200-1400, maybe higher). I have no idea how that works, you need 13 black to launch GSBW and then pray she lands a Rifle? Sure Colossus red can finish the job too. Maybe it works since 2/3 times it leads to Sniper Rifle anyway? (Airborne DecTactics into regular Rifle or Airborne Rifle.) I'm so curious!

    Forgot about gsbw because of how bad she is in pve, but yeah, that would make 3.

    Bad in PVE? Not really - useful for a node or two before she starts needing healthpacks at least.

    Typo, meant pvp, specifically on defense.
  • ErikPeter
    ErikPeter Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
    According to 'Marvel Puzzle Quest' User Statistics (Heroes & Abilities) Fastball Special is the least-used, non-Bagman power! I know Colossus is a pretty rare character, but I'm surprised there's not more people exploiting this great power to pop 13-black Sniper Rifles and stuff like that.
  • lukewin
    lukewin Posts: 1,356 Chairperson of the Boards
    I only have a 1 cover (yellow) level 40 Colossus. So I rarely use him. I suspect the power is rarely used because the character is rarely used. There aren't too many characters with a black ability, so that wouldn't be the reason. Since he's relatively new, he's likely to be not covered or possessed by many, and those that do have him, probably have a lot more characters that they use before him.
  • simonsez
    simonsez Posts: 4,663 Chairperson of the Boards
    We're at the point now where a lot people would rather spend their black on Surgical Strike
  • I tried it. It feels a bit expensive and random, and if you don't get the power you were hoping for it'll set you back 4 turns.
  • wirius
    wirius Posts: 667
    The only people who have him maxed are those that spent hp. There haven't been enough covers awarded to fully build him yet,
  • It's exceedingly pricy, kinda random, Colossus is a very rare hero, and black currently has two very noteworthy "I win the game" powers already that most people would rather run. Honestly, the main issue is price. How many heroes are there where spending 13 black is worthwhile to wait 3 turns get off a random power and deal a little extra damage? I can think of maybe one or two. Patch (but only because Berserker Rage lays down its strike tiles before the damage from fastball special), GSBW (who you shouldn't be using anyways because she's ****)... I can't think of anyone else.
  • NorthernPolarity
    NorthernPolarity Posts: 3,531 Chairperson of the Boards
    Yay for people realizing that it's not a good ability! The fact that D3 hasn't released enough covers to max him out is probably the main reason though.
  • It's not supposed to be a good because his base HP is Thor class and they actually remembered that characters with the highest HP aren't supposed to be doing the most damage on him.

    Even ignoring the existence of Surgical Strike/Rage of the Panther it's probably something you'd use if it's your only black power and you're forced to use Colossus (limited roster most likely, because PvP events you'd likely have Panther or X Force available).
  • GuntherBlobel
    GuntherBlobel Posts: 987 Critical Contributor
    Oh, I've have plans for it when I finally have enough covers. Because of where I am in the game, I need at least 3 covers for an ability to be useful.
  • LegendReborn
    The ability is super expensive so even the fights where I bring in Collosus, I'm not aiming to collect black to cast it since it will take an additional 3 turns for the ability to hit. His red and yellow are much better with less covers.

    Also, it hurts your own character a good amount when it only has one cover in it. 500 damage isn't much to a well leveled 3 star but the people who would have only one cover in fastball are people who are using two stars.

    I do think his best defensive build is 5/3/5 as long as you aren't defending with a character who uses black since it's really easy to dodge a super strong punch when you're against the AI as long as you are paying attention.
  • IamTheDanger
    IamTheDanger Posts: 1,093 Chairperson of the Boards
    But you got to admit, Fast ball on Big Thor is always useful. And also Steve Rogers, as you get the damage from Colossus, ability from Cap, and the Ap return from Caps CD tile. icon_twisted.gif

    Fast ball may not be the best power in the game, but with the right combo, it can still be very effective. icon_e_biggrin.gif
  • It's designed as a support ability as opposed to 'first to Surgical Strike wins' kind of ability, but because 'first to Surgical Strike/World Rupture' type abilities exist in the game, there's not much compelling reason to go for an ability that already has a 'first to X wins' ability in the same color.
  • babinro
    babinro Posts: 771 Critical Contributor
    The character is too new.

    To illustrate, I'm in a top 50 alliance and most of us still haven't fully leveled/covered Captain Marvel. There's been several other characters since her among them is Colossus. At this point, I'd imagine only the 'whales' have had a chance to really play with this character seriously and they'd make up a tiny percentage of the overall player base.

    On paper this skill looked like a MUST have at first...since his release I've cooled on it to the point where I'd only put 3 covers into it. It's just too expensive. Maybe I'll change my mind when I get some more hands on with the leveled character a few months down the line.
  • NorthernPolarity
    NorthernPolarity Posts: 3,531 Chairperson of the Boards
    But you got to admit, Fast ball on Big Thor is always useful. And also Steve Rogers, as you get the damage from Colossus, ability from Cap, and the Ap return from Caps CD tile. icon_twisted.gif

    Fast ball may not be the best power in the game, but with the right combo, it can still be very effective. icon_e_biggrin.gif

    LazyCap is a terrible partner for Colossus because the whole point why you bring either character on your team is because of their red ability. This means that all Cap would be doing is throwing peacemakers, or all Colossus would be doing is throwing fastballs and his defensive ability, both of which is definitely NOT worth a character slot on your team. The only good characters that have some sort of synergy with fastball and actually contribute something meaningful to the team otherwise are LazyThor, GSBW, and Nick Fury, and even then, the combinations are extremely slow since all of your good abilities cost 12+.
  • I don't have many Colossus covers (he's only had the PVE and PVP event so far), but from my experience, he's a clunky **** character.

    On offense, he's slow.
    Really slow. 11 AP for red, 13 AP for black and his yellow is 8 AP.

    Now, 8 AP isn't all that bad for yellow, but it does no damage.

    So, that's his first problem.

    The second problem is his black stuns one of your teammates and damages him. Not a huge deal, but stuns and self damage are never good.

    The third problem is his black does nothing if he's the last person remaining.

    Granted, if his yellow was used properly, he would never be the last one standing, but having a dead ability at any point in the game is never appealing.

    The fourth, and potentially largest, problem is 13 AP is still very very large amount of AP. In fact, it could potentially be much larger than any ability that you could hope to use with Fastball special.

    Let's look at his most likely teammates:
    Patch. He has a 14 AP red and a 9 AP green. So you have an approximately 50% chance of saving 1 AP if you use it on Patch. Also, a 50% chance of wasting 4 AP. And it stuns Patch for at least 1 turn. Not that great of a trade off, to be honest. Plus, the dynamic of tanking for Patch and making his TBTI useful simultaneously is very difficult.

    GSBW. Now, this is actually a good scenario if she gets off her sniper rifle. But that's only a 33% chance (I'm not 100% sure if you can activate deceptive tactics via FBS). In the other scenarios, you're using a terrible ability in pistol or a cheaper ability in deceptive tactics.

    Thor. This is a potentially good matchup. He has three active abilities, all strong. only one is more expensive than FBS. But then again, Thor doesn't need to be protected, which is Colossus' strong suit.

    Human Torch. All of Human torch's abilities are lower cost than fastball special, making the use of fastball special unnecessary.

    I could go on, but I think the point is made.

    It is an expensive ability on a clunky, slow character and the time spent farming black to have a 33 to 50% chance of getting a positive AP result from the ability could be spent farming for the ability that you actually want to see used.

    IE. the ability is only useful if black is the only color on the board and you're forced to farm it.

    Its a very deceptively weak skill. On paper, it sounds great. But there's a reason all the top players run him at 5/5/3.
  • Main reason is the power used is random and may not be the one you want and have it pay off. At most, you could use it as Grant Invisibility.

    However, you are much better off spending 12 Black on Rage of the Panther, 11 on Surgical Strike, 9 on Hypersonic Punch. Even 8 for Inferno or 7 for Molotov Cocktail.
  • Wonko33
    Wonko33 Posts: 985 Critical Contributor
    fastball the **** out of gsbw, her powers are deadly but cost way too much ap.
  • theshadeofopal
    theshadeofopal Posts: 93 Match Maker
    I feel like colosuss was designed with too much of a best case scenios in mind, resulting in him being much worse than he should be particularly on defense. His yellow is moderately over priced but still relatively useful when placed by a player. On defense its highly unlikely to last five turns or be of much use against the many strike tile or board shake characters. Red is a solid damage per ap but too dependant on him being in the front to be of reliable on defense. 1565 damage for 11 ap is beyond laughable. His black fairs worst having to deal with either partner being picked or having them be dead. Its hard to describe how bad his it is, a roulette spin that might never go off priced like a game ender.

    I really wanted to like him as I'm a big fan of the character but I think devs were so concerned about making piotr the next high health powerhouse that they turned him into something he's rarely been portrayed as: unreliable. Anyway, end slightly off topicc rant. I just hope iceman isn't as bad if he ever comes out.
  • russreid91
    russreid91 Posts: 151 Tile Toppler
    I was playing against Sim 39 in the Gauntlet and the AI had enough black to cast both Hypersonic punch and Fastball special, I also had enough green to down Colossus with XForce so I let the AI play hoping the AI would use the more expensive Fastball special and then I could down him and not get hit with either.

    The AI did Fastball Special and threw Marvel, I followed up by taking down Colossus with XForce and I would have thought that would have negated Fastball special and brought Marvel back down. Nope she got of her red blasts for 2.3k of damage and then followed up with her regular red blast for 2.3k downing XForce.

    I was able to finish her off with my other characters but that isn't how the power is supposed to work is it? I'm pretty sure that I did in Colossus PvP and when they downed Colossus my character came back down as well.