Too Many Secrets - Season V opener

FierceKiwi

Phantron wrote:

4* has always been at 1300 but putting Fury available at 1300 is roughly like selling him for somewhere around 300-500 HP for those who could've afforded him (people without that kind of HP to burn on shields would never have bought him to begin with). This either means they're willing to take a 80%+ discount to their long term profit, or that they had no idea what their long term profit plan is and will just take a quick buck instead.

I think you probably vastly overestimate the amount of people who will buy a ton of (maybe any?) Fury covers. The number of people who will blow through HP to sheild hop is probably substantially larger.

Nonce Equitaur 2

It seems that the optimal player-based play is to hit 1300 and to NOT shield. Sharing the juicy ladder points.

We'd need a convenient forum that allows massive name listing with easy look-up.
There, a person above 500 going for 1300 would add their name to the CLIMBING list.
When they get to 1300, they'd add their name to the HIT ME list.

Climbing players would look for HIT ME players so they wouldn't claw each other down.

Unknown

dragma wrote:

Here we are all assumineing it is going to be a PvP, it could be a PvE.

Considering we have never had a 4* PvP.....

Just throwing my 2 cents into the ring.

Well, looks like I was wrong. I think I will be taking this easy, already fully Pun covered, and Fury does not interest me in the slightest.

Unknown

FierceKiwi wrote:

Phantron wrote:

4* has always been at 1300 but putting Fury available at 1300 is roughly like selling him for somewhere around 300-500 HP for those who could've afforded him (people without that kind of HP to burn on shields would never have bought him to begin with). This either means they're willing to take a 80%+ discount to their long term profit, or that they had no idea what their long term profit plan is and will just take a quick buck instead.

I think you probably vastly overestimate the amount of people who will buy a ton of (maybe any?) Fury covers. The number of people who will blow through HP to sheild hop is probably substantially larger.

The last known breakdown of HP expenditure in this game was comic packs > ability ypgrade > roster expansion > (shield + boost + health pack).

Let's say roster expansion is only paid with HP earned in game, but ability upgrade at 1250 HP per 3* and tokens at ~300 a pop is far beyond what can be reasonably earned in game so I have to assume they come from primarily from spending money, and we'll assume all shield/boosts/health packs HP expenditure is 100% money too even though HP is interchangeable. Nick Fury at 1300 leads to more profit in the (shield + boost + health pack) section. Nick Fury not available at 1300 leads to more profit in the token + ability upgrade section, and those two sections of the pie chart are considerably bigger than the shield hopping expenses combined.

Now the breakdown for profit may have changed, or maybe it turns out people regularly saved up 1250 HP for 3* upgrade or 3800 HP for a 10 pack special. Or perhaps it turns out that nobody was buying Nick Fury covers to begin with. The former would be very bizarre behavior, while the latter would make me wonder where does revenue come from in this game in the first place?

Unknown

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

It seems that the optimal player-based play is to hit 1300 and to NOT shield. Sharing the juicy ladder points.

We'd need a convenient forum that allows massive name listing with easy look-up.
There, a person about 600 going for 1300 would add their name to the CLIMBING list.
When they get to 1300, they'd add their name to the HIT ME list.

Climbing players would look for HIT ME players so they wouldn't claw each other down.

You won't need anything fancy like that if people all just agreed to not shield too much. And if you can't people to agree then it wouldn't help because the few guys that are not shielded will get pounded as always and will be going nowhere. It takes a relatively fixed number of games before the first 1300 guy emerges and the only question is does that guy stay unshielded so that he remains in the pool of eligible sources for other players to climb, or does he shield himself and thus eliminating a huge chunk of points from the available source to hit 1300.

Spoit

Wait, I thought you wanted shield hoping, since it injects 'free' points into the system

vudu3

Phantron wrote:

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

It seems that the optimal player-based play is to hit 1300 and to NOT shield. Sharing the juicy ladder points.

We'd need a convenient forum that allows massive name listing with easy look-up.
There, a person about 600 going for 1300 would add their name to the CLIMBING list.
When they get to 1300, they'd add their name to the HIT ME list.

Climbing players would look for HIT ME players so they wouldn't claw each other down.

You won't need anything fancy like that if people all just agreed to not shield too much. And if you can't people to agree then it wouldn't help because the few guys that are not shielded will get pounded as always and will be going nowhere. It takes a relatively fixed number of games before the first 1300 guy emerges and the only question is does that guy stay unshielded so that he remains in the pool of eligible sources for other players to climb, or does he shield himself and thus eliminating a huge chunk of points from the available source to hit 1300.

Both would be great plans if more than a small fraction of the game's user base were on these forums.

Unknown

Spoit wrote:

Wait, I thought you wanted shield hoping, since it injects 'free' points into the system

Shield hopping is good for a small subset of people, but even if 5 guys got to 2600 and then donated their points to everyone by repeatedly losing that still creates at most 10 more guys with 1300 points and would not have much of an effect on the general populace. At the level of even just all the forum population it's out of the question to try to coordinate when to hit people are shielded and you'd be better off to just have anyone who successfully hit 1300 agree to always stay in the pool to get hit by other guys who haven't hit 1300 until they drop to about 600 or so.

What might work is if you've a small subset of guys doing shield hopping and then agree to just stay unshielded at 1300 for everyone else to benefit, though those guys would be making a lot of sacrifice since they'd have to use a lot of HP and then not even hold their place.

Unknown

vudu3 wrote:

Phantron wrote:

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

It seems that the optimal player-based play is to hit 1300 and to NOT shield. Sharing the juicy ladder points.

We'd need a convenient forum that allows massive name listing with easy look-up.
There, a person about 600 going for 1300 would add their name to the CLIMBING list.
When they get to 1300, they'd add their name to the HIT ME list.

Climbing players would look for HIT ME players so they wouldn't claw each other down.

You won't need anything fancy like that if people all just agreed to not shield too much. And if you can't people to agree then it wouldn't help because the few guys that are not shielded will get pounded as always and will be going nowhere. It takes a relatively fixed number of games before the first 1300 guy emerges and the only question is does that guy stay unshielded so that he remains in the pool of eligible sources for other players to climb, or does he shield himself and thus eliminating a huge chunk of points from the available source to hit 1300.

Both would be great plans if more than a small fraction of the game's user base were on these forums.

Well, Kyipgate shows us that it is possible to coordinate as a community, even if that turned out to be an accident.

I'm guessing activity will be high from Nick Fury, but whether any plan turns out to be successful depends on how willing the guys who hit 1300 to stay unshielded to allow other people a shot too. If people just shield up for the rest of the event at 1300 then it never gets any easier for anyone else to hit 1300 so the only people that will hit 1300 are the guys who could've hit it normally, which probably aren't the guys who need Nick Fury in the first place.

vudu3

Kyipgate shows that people will attach someone worth a lot of points. I think we intuitively already knew that.

There's no way you can communicate to the general populous not to hit certain people because they're trying to pass an arbitrary threshold.

Unknown

vudu3 wrote:

Kyipgate shows that people will attach someone worth a lot of points. I think we intuitively already knew that.

There's no way you can communicate to the general populous not to hit certain people because they're trying to pass an arbitrary threshold.

Of course that's impossible, but you can certainly communicate something like 'don't shield after you hit 1300'. Whether people will go with that plan, of course, is up to debate. I don't expect anything different in terms of the first 1300s. They'll get there like how they normally do. The question is whether they'll stay shielded and thus make it hard for everyone else to get there or if it's possible to convince some of those guys to make themselves available as a target via not shielding.

OnesOwnGrief

Just realized that was posted in the wrong topic.

Anyways, the 1300 for Fury was a given. 4* characters have always been at that number. What I'd like to know is if this is the first 4* tournament. I though IW had one ages ago but I could be wrong.

Has anyone kept track to see if there's any sort pattern with the 1300 reward for pvps? I'm wondering if Fury will show up at 1300 for the next couple of pvps before they rotate them.

Unknown

It's noticeable that Fury is the 1300 reward rather than first place. I suspect this results in more covers being released (esp if overall scores are high) and skewed towards the stronger rosters who have most use for him.

And as an aside it means folk with a complete Fury already don't need to feel guilty about winning their bracket at the expense of someone who needed the cover. I approve

jojeda654

mikeydollar7 wrote:

It's noticeable that Fury is the 1300 reward rather than first place.

That could be because the featured character is the never a placement reward and that there is always a progression reward of the featured character.

The1WhoKnocks

OP is updated with Rewards and level for Fury (base and max) for the pvp.

ThatOneGuyjp189512

so the max fury's finally get to play....

Bowgentle

ThatOneGuyjp189512 wrote:

so the max fury's finally get to play....

Yeah, looking forward to it
Once I tanked off the Nefarious Foes MMR of course lol.

Unknown

Watch out for this cheating **** called AKN. He hit me twice and a bunch of alliance mates - presumably with his lvl 999 hawkeye

Unknown

The only thing I absolutely hate about PvP is the unlike PvE you grind for points which are miniscule then when someone beats you they take your points away I think the highest I have gotten was like 600. Plus in the PvE events you get way more points per match. It needs to have some balance so the same people ain't always able to achieve higher points and give us lower scoring point guys a chance. Just saying.

jobob

The dang "point-stealing" element of the PVP is really killing the fun of the game for me. I can handle that I might not end up ranked highly, and I can handle having to grind my way to 1300 for a cover, but losing points each time you're attacked basically makes both of them about ranking, not grinding, which kind of sucks. I liked what I EXPECTED the mechanic to be... put in your time, and get a decent reward, be the best and get icing on the cake. But it seems like both are about being the best... not necessarily a huge deal in PVP, but it would be nice if it wasn't presented differently.

I won a battle and LOST points overall 'cause 3 separate guys attacked me while I was doing it. I'm barely at 500 points (probably lower in the time I've spent typing this) and I know I've lost AT LEAST another 180 points. Boo.