***** Gamora (Deadliest Woman) *****

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Comments

  • heybub
    heybub Posts: 297 Mover and Shaker
    Just played the first node of her introducing, and it did absolutely nothing to help me better understand her as a character.

    These introducing events are a waste of my **** time.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,012 Chairperson of the Boards
    ThaRoadWarrior said:
    entrailbucket said:
    ThaRoadWarrior said:
    entrailbucket said:
    Yeah, that's a team construction issue.  She needs to tank all of her colors and probably one more, + TU.  
    I mean, it is what it is, right? I do have a 5* RTF on her, so in PVE at least she tanks more.
    The funny thing is that if she's used like you're using her, she's actually not overpowered at all.  She's barely even good.

    If you squint, you can see the outline of a balanced character there.  The idea is that if you want her to boost powers, she has to match useless TU AP.  But in order to cast those powers, you have to have other characters match regular AP.  It's a tradeoff that limits her effectiveness significantly.

    What makes her overpowered is pairing her with characters that either generate their own AP, or do damage passively, so there's no tradeoff at all. 

    One might expect that the characters who generate their own AP or do damage passively would have bad powers, as a tradeoff for doing completely free stuff, but that's not how it works in practice, because nothing makes sense.
    I mean, I use her with Hulk or whoever like the rest of y'all, I just have to be a little more active about chasing yellow and team up. I don't use her that much in PVP ever since Wanda came out though. But I've foudn that Thor/Apocalypse was at least as fast on pick-2 nodes in PVE even though it's all active powers. 
    To circle this back to Gamora, she's going to play pretty much just like Apocalypse does.  Her best partner is Thor because he'll feed her yellow and red and she can boost his green.

    The difference is that Gamora's power boost is only a power boost against certain characters/powers, and her red/black powers are worse than Apocalypse in most cases.

    Will Gamora/Thor be a reasonable counter to SW/Colossus?  Maybe on offense.  Someone can test it at some point.  On defense it'll be quite bad, because Thor is bad on defense, and Gamora conflicts with Thor for yellow and red.
  • TheEyeDoctorsWife
    TheEyeDoctorsWife Posts: 832 Critical Contributor
    My first move in Introducing was a black Match 5, which killed Nova and Thanos finished the rest . So I never even got a chance to see any powers 
  • heybub
    heybub Posts: 297 Mover and Shaker
    Tony_Foot said:
    Changed my mind after seeing a few videos, will definitely wait for Gamora.
    Where did you see the videos?
  • Thanos
    Thanos Posts: 722 Critical Contributor
    Well, sadly, she's not so great on her own. Like I said before, her red is best used when there are two or less opponents. Her black is just garbage, of all the matches I played, I only got the bonus damage twice. It would have been better if once you hit the 10 counters it triggered, it's just too dang hard to trigger it otherwise. yellow is her best ability, too bad it's hard to keep the fricken repeater from getting destroyed. I don't get why they didn't fortify it, or at a bare minimum let you place it.
    As far as teammates go, I think Scarlet Witch is her best partner in match two. I never paid attention to SW's purple before, it boosts damage based on how many of the chosen color you have, reading is fundamental! In choose three, I think cable isn't terrible cause he can fortify her yellow repeater with just a yellow match. Thor/Okoye works decent as well.
    Overall, on her own, she's very mediocre, she really needs a damage booster to make her decent. If you have him, for the same color combo you're better off using Apoc. I know a lot of people want Shang-Chi, myself included, is one bad, one mediocre and one great 5* worth busting your hoard for? I'm really not sure, gonna have to wait and see what the next 5* has to offer.




  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    Is Magneto the 2*? I remember seeing someone use 2* Magneto, 3* Mystique and 5* Shang-Chi to create winfinite. 

    I hope tons of players pull for Gamora because she will be a common opponent with red as strongest colour.
  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 11,504 Chairperson of the Boards
    I don't think introducing events are ever that great to judge how good new 5's are although they at least stuck Lizard in this time so players could see the yellow in effect. Maybe we will get a wave node that might show off her red.
  • Srheer0
    Srheer0 Posts: 510 Critical Contributor
    As far as teammates go, I think Scarlet Witch is her best partner in match two. I never paid attention to SW's purple before, it boosts damage based on how many of the chosen color you have, reading is fundamental! In choose three, I think cable isn't terrible cause he can fortify her yellow repeater with just a yellow match. Thor/Okoye works decent as well.

    @Thanos For a long time, I thought W5nda only boosted the ap colour you chose as the pink target. But no, it increases ALL ally power damage by the excess ap you have at time of firing.  

    Managed to get a huge IMHB red firing when it was at 30 red and he was boosted. Damage was huge!  

    Use her with Ic5man and another annoying character and you can potentially get loads of blue stuns, or boosted green repeaters. It's even better if you use her colour on a passive one.  

    At the moment I am using her with IMHB and shangchi. Mostly pick red because pink isn't as reliable for stacking the combo points.
  • tonypq
    tonypq Posts: 557 Critical Contributor
    Thanos said:
     I know a lot of people want Shang-Chi, myself included, is one bad, one mediocre and one great 5* worth busting your hoard for? I'm really not sure, gonna have to wait and see what the next 5* has to offer.


    I feel exactly the same way. Plus the time it takes some of us to build a reasonable hoard, to be stuck having to waste resources on a couple 5s that will never be used unless boosted is tough. As much as I'd also like Shang, I don't think I want him bad enough to be forced to also spend on the other 5s in LLs now and when Gamora rotates in. 
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,643 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited October 2021
    Why have you left Black as it  devs, why Devs, WHY? It is useless that way! We told you it was useless. It is obvious it was useless.

    Devs are really soacking the enjoyment I have of the game with these new releases. And to make things worse now if you want Shang Chi you need to get two lame chars, there is no way around it. 
  • heybub
    heybub Posts: 297 Mover and Shaker
    DAZ0273 said:
    I don't think introducing events are ever that great to judge how good new 5's are although they at least stuck Lizard in this time so players could see the yellow in effect. Maybe we will get a wave node that might show off her red.
    I concur.  My point is that they should be.  It should be a marketing event to get players excited about the character.  I think they focus more on the comic tie in than the synergy or counter aspect relative to the game which would help players understand the value the character brings to the game.
  • wymtime
    wymtime Posts: 3,768 Chairperson of the Boards
    She is a 5,3,5 for me after playing her.  I tried multiple times to get her black CD to actually fire and get bonus damage and have not been able to do it.  Black while creative on paper is bad in practice.

    her red feels like it will be better in wave nodes, unfortunately I would still rather just bring Apocalypse and fire his red for 7AP.  Her yellow will be her best power and will be decent against certain characters.

    overrall a good creative effort, but poor quality in execution.  Hopefully she will go to the rebalance list quickly.
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,643 Chairperson of the Boards
    OMG black is even more useless than I thought! Managed to get it to 10+, targeted Lizard, he fired one attack but he stunned me, so the power did not fire! Then Superskrull fired a power, and as he is not the target, the power also didn’t fire! This power is so stupidly convoluted… and just for a bit of extra damage, it doesn’t even down the target…

    5/3/5 FOR SURE
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,012 Chairperson of the Boards
    I think you just need to treat her black power as "do x damage for 6ap" and ignore the countdown tile completely. 

    The rate on it isn't awful for 6ap, at least compared to the normal 5*.  If you compare it to the good 5*...well, don't compare anyone to the good 5*.
  • TheRiddler
    TheRiddler Posts: 291 Mover and Shaker
    heybub said:
    DAZ0273 said:
    I don't think introducing events are ever that great to judge how good new 5's are although they at least stuck Lizard in this time so players could see the yellow in effect. Maybe we will get a wave node that might show off her red.
    I concur.  My point is that they should be.  It should be a marketing event to get players excited about the character.  I think they focus more on the comic tie in than the synergy or counter aspect relative to the game which would help players understand the value the character brings to the game.

    And they could easily do both.
    Every one of these should have at least one node where you get to pick your teammates and go up against a wave. That way you can go through the powers, try out teams and just overall get a better feel for the character.
    Then you can still tell a story with the rest of the nodes.
    Another thing I don't understand is giving us a 5* character and then the loaner is a level 200?
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,643 Chairperson of the Boards
    entrailbucket said:
    I think you just need to treat her black power as "do x damage for 6ap" and ignore the countdown tile completely. 

    The rate on it isn't awful for 6ap, at least compared to the normal 5*.  If you compare it to the good 5*...well, don't compare anyone to the good 5*.
    You are probably right, but that is exactly what you don’t want in a power. We want reliable powers, powers we can predict and we know when we will be able to trigger them (mostly). So yeah, definitely not great :(
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,012 Chairperson of the Boards
    Polares said:
    entrailbucket said:
    I think you just need to treat her black power as "do x damage for 6ap" and ignore the countdown tile completely. 

    The rate on it isn't awful for 6ap, at least compared to the normal 5*.  If you compare it to the good 5*...well, don't compare anyone to the good 5*.
    You are probably right, but that is exactly what you don’t want in a power. We want reliable powers, powers we can predict and we know when we will be able to trigger them (mostly). So yeah, definitely not great :(
    Oh, you can predict it! 

    It'll predictably do 10,000 damage or whatever for 6ap, every time you cast it, and the countdown tile will reliably do nothing at all, ever. 

    It's about half as good as Colossus black, assuming Colossus is in front when you cast it (he is).
  • TheRiddler
    TheRiddler Posts: 291 Mover and Shaker
    entrailbucket said:
    Polares said:
    entrailbucket said:
    I think you just need to treat her black power as "do x damage for 6ap" and ignore the countdown tile completely. 

    The rate on it isn't awful for 6ap, at least compared to the normal 5*.  If you compare it to the good 5*...well, don't compare anyone to the good 5*.
    You are probably right, but that is exactly what you don’t want in a power. We want reliable powers, powers we can predict and we know when we will be able to trigger them (mostly). So yeah, definitely not great :(
    Oh, you can predict it! 

    It'll predictably do 10,000 damage or whatever for 6ap, every time you cast it, and the countdown tile will reliably do nothing at all, ever. 

    It's about half as good as Colossus black, assuming Colossus is in front when you cast it (he is).

    Electro's black at 8 AP does 20k outright and then another 18k if the TU tile stip is met.
    On a serious note. What odds would you say that countdown tile has of going off? You have to get it up to 10 (it goes down 1 each round on its own) which normally should take several turns. It can get matched away or destroyed. Once you get to 10 then the character you cast it on has to fire a power before it gets matched away or destroyed.
    I say 5-10%?
  • mpiter
    mpiter Posts: 77 Match Maker
    shardwick said:
    I just think it's a bit silly to knock Gamora on her health when she has more health at 450 than almost all of the 5* characters in the game at the same level.

    Most 5* meta characters have a mechanic to compensate their relative low health: cheap true healing (Okoye), speed to destroy (Kitty with a good partner), lots of protect tiles (BRB + Polaris), or damage reducer (Wanda).  Without such a mechanic, I do not think that the extra HP of Gamora in comparison to the average 5* will allow her to sustain as long as the aforementioned characters.  That is why I think she is fragile and she might cost a lot of health packs in comparison to the current meta.
    And depending on your Okoye's level Odin would probably tank all colors over Okoye except for black.
    I plan to use an under-leveled Odin to let Okoye (level 450) tanks her colors, exactly like under-leveled half-Thor. I just want a meat bag to take a few hit to let Okoye survive a little bit longer in the PVE 10 challenging node.  No needs to champion him.
    If Gamora's yellow is as good as I think it will end up being then yeah it'll be big against Wanda or BRB teams.
    She looks more efficient than I thought according to videos. You must be right.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 7,012 Chairperson of the Boards
    TheRiddler said:
    entrailbucket said:
    Polares said:
    entrailbucket said:
    I think you just need to treat her black power as "do x damage for 6ap" and ignore the countdown tile completely. 

    The rate on it isn't awful for 6ap, at least compared to the normal 5*.  If you compare it to the good 5*...well, don't compare anyone to the good 5*.
    You are probably right, but that is exactly what you don’t want in a power. We want reliable powers, powers we can predict and we know when we will be able to trigger them (mostly). So yeah, definitely not great :(
    Oh, you can predict it! 

    It'll predictably do 10,000 damage or whatever for 6ap, every time you cast it, and the countdown tile will reliably do nothing at all, ever. 

    It's about half as good as Colossus black, assuming Colossus is in front when you cast it (he is).

    Electro's black at 8 AP does 20k outright and then another 18k if the TU tile stip is met.
    On a serious note. What odds would you say that countdown tile has of going off? You have to get it up to 10 (it goes down 1 each round on its own) which normally should take several turns. It can get matched away or destroyed. Once you get to 10 then the character you cast it on has to fire a power before it gets matched away or destroyed.
    I say 5-10%?
    In PvP?  0%.  I cannot imagine *ever* seeing it go off against any of the teams I'd use her against.

    In PvE there's a higher chance since goons spam so many powers, but you'd only use her to mitigate damage reduction.  I guess the rock guys make protect tiles?

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