PVP Meta Counter

WhiteBomber

Added to Page 1

For Polaris4, MThor5, BRB5 or Groot4 (basically any SAP spam team)

• ImmortalHulk5, MoonDragon4, anyone counter SAP or Immortal: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/CMgvidpABew

For MBaku4, Namor3, Chasm5 (kills most things)

• ImmortalHulk5, Moondragon4, Jubilee5: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/7-iLyV0t3bM![]

LennoxHC

@bbigler said:
Sorry to derail the topic, but how does everyone handle M'Baku(w/ Fanticar) + Namor3? First, here's what I'm seeing in PVP Pick-2 matchups:

I see that team a lot, and I have a pretty easy time with Kang + Darkveil. If you start with +2 teamup AP and +1 All AP, then you'll have the teamup AP needed to send M'Baku away on his first match and the Fantasticar won't fire. Also, I think winning via Kang's away condition is usually faster than the Darkveil + Shang Chi combo listed on the first page.

Sometimes I'll forego boosts because I'm feeling stingy and hope to get a teamup match on my first move. I use a rank 5 Destroyer Gun on Kang to get more teamup AP on a match. Kang is supposed to restore the teamup AP Darkveil uses, but this sometimes glitches. Getting up a reserve of 9 or so teamup AP provides enough backup against that.

I put a rank 5 Sp//dr on Darkveil to start with yellow AP to fire her yellow power. At rank 5, the Sp//dr has 80% chance of 6 AP at start for an average of 4.8 AP. That's more than the 100% chance of 4 AP from Krakoa. It's just my personal preference to take on some risk to start with more AP.

Firing Darkveil's yellow should build blue AP so you can fire Kang's blue when needed to finish a match. I also usually put the Refreshment Cart on the essential so firing Darkveil's yellow produces countdowns that will also fuel Kang's blue. And because this whole combo isn't reliant on damage, it works around M'Baku's damage resistance and can also work around Leapfrog shenanigans.

Starting with the boosts, the team wins almost every time. It's horrible on defense, but it works relatively quickly so you have a fighting chance against the retaliation storm.

WhiteBomber

@LennoxHC said:

@bbigler said:
Sorry to derail the topic, but how does everyone handle M'Baku(w/ Fanticar) + Namor3? First, here's what I'm seeing in PVP Pick-2 matchups:

I see that team a lot, and I have a pretty easy time with Kang + Darkveil. If you start with +2 teamup AP and +1 All AP, then you'll have the teamup AP needed to send M'Baku away on his first match and the Fantasticar won't fire. Also, I think winning via Kang's away condition is usually faster than the Darkveil + Shang Chi combo listed on the first page.

Sometimes I'll forego boosts because I'm feeling stingy and hope to get a teamup match on my first move. I use a rank 5 Destroyer Gun on Kang to get more teamup AP on a match. Kang is supposed to restore the teamup AP Darkveil uses, but this sometimes glitches. Getting up a reserve of 9 or so teamup AP provides enough backup against that.

I put a rank 5 Sp//dr on Darkveil to start with yellow AP to fire her yellow power. At rank 5, the Sp//dr has 80% chance of 6 AP at start for an average of 4.8 AP. That's more than the 100% chance of 4 AP from Krakoa. It's just my personal preference to take on some risk to start with more AP.

Firing Darkveil's yellow should build blue AP so you can fire Kang's blue when needed to finish a match. I also usually put the Refreshment Cart on the essential so firing Darkveil's yellow produces countdowns that will also fuel Kang's blue. And because this whole combo isn't reliant on damage, it works around M'Baku's damage resistance and can also work around Leapfrog shenanigans.

Starting with the boosts, the team wins almost every time. It's horrible on defense, but it works relatively quickly so you have a fighting chance against the retaliation storm.

You see MBaku and Namor is a pick 2 often? I'm not sure I've ever seen them in a pick 2, but I will add them to the list others are also experiencing this.

I will add the Kang team also. I personally don't run villains for the shear fact that I don't want to blow 3 boosts each match, but it is definitely a good team with boosts.

LennoxHC

The climb experience that @bbigler described closely matches what I see in pick 2 PVPs. Up to about 600 or so, I see plenty of random teams. From 600 to 1000, nearly everything I see with decent points available are JuggSam or M'Baku + Namor. KangVeil works well against both teams, but the retaliation wall usually prevents me from getting much past 900.

WhiteBomber

Added that team to page one with your info. I will look for that team and add to it myself if I see em.

icarusmonkey

@WhiteBomber said:
Added to Page 1

For Polaris4, MThor5, BRB5 or Groot4 (basically any SAP spam team)

• ImmortalHulk5, MoonDragon4, anyone counter SAP or Immortal: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/CMgvidpABew

For MBaku4, Namor3, Chasm5 (kills most things)

• ImmortalHulk5, Moondragon4, Jubilee5: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/7-iLyV0t3bM![]

I'm surprised more people don't mention Morbius when talking about countering Polaris and MThor. He works really well with MThor and is basically the anti-Polaris. Especially useful if you're not relying on SAP yourself. For a third I'll usually put ShangChi or, if the enemy team also has Chasm, I'll swap him for MK5.

Not sure what he's like ascended though. Anyone else?

bbigler

I think Morbius is the best SAP counter in the game, but ascension is a good idea.

icarusmonkey

@bbigler said:
I think Morbius is the best SAP counter in the game, but ascension is a good idea.

And not just SAP, as he'll also eat countdowns, repeaters, and even invisibility tiles, so Leapfrog is less of a pain.

bbigler

Since we've all been playing with and against JuggSam this past week, you can see the biggest problem in fighting them are the cascades from Copter. Even a 550 Electro can't repel firepower of that magnitude! My Electro & Elektra team does work well as long as the enemy doesn't get more than 1 cascade (and that's with the defense of Trap Tiles, Fantasticar, Leapfrog and Eros). Because of cascades, I had 2 back to back wipes, which is so frustrating. I did the Electro & Moonstone winfinite for a few wins, but that takes too long and makes you a target. It's like another Shang glass cannon team.

I'm thinking the best way to stop JuggSam is to either (on the 1st turn) stun one of them, send one of them airborne or away, or bring an Archer with Eros to directly nerf Juggs. But with that last one Sam can still build up strikes. There's also the BSSM solution.

This JuggSam team is becoming more and more prevalent in my MMR. I'm also seeing some Mephisto - Sam teams out there. Electro can't stop them and the damage and strike tile production ramps up quickly. For a healthy game, we need good counters to every killer team.

BriMan2222

@bbigler said:
Since we've all been playing with and against JuggSam this past week, you can see the biggest problem in fighting them are the cascades from Copter. Even a 550 Electro can't repel firepower of that magnitude! My Electro & Elektra team does work well as long as the enemy doesn't get more than 1 cascade (and that's with the defense of Trap Tiles, Fantasticar, Leapfrog and Eros). Because of cascades, I had 2 back to back wipes, which is so frustrating. I did the Electro & Moonstone winfinite for a few wins, but that takes too long and makes you a target. It's like another Shang glass cannon team.

I'm thinking the best way to stop JuggSam is to either (on the 1st turn) stun one of them, send one of them airborne or away, or bring an Archer with Eros to directly nerf Juggs. But with that last one Sam can still build up strikes. There's also the BSSM solution.

This JuggSam team is becoming more and more prevalent in my MMR. I'm also seeing some Mephisto - Sam teams out there. Electro can't stop them and the damage and strike tile production ramps up quickly. For a healthy game, we need good counters to every killer team.

Against them I used mthor with omnip city support and Polaris with krakoa support with plus all ap boosts and plus b/p ap boosts. With the support and boosts Polaris could stun jugg immediately and then the team is pretty toothless without him making matches and causing problem. I would try to make a blue match on the first turn to get the extra ap from omni city and hopefully stun the leap frog holder as well. If not able to do that, mthor blowing stuff up usually is able to clean up the invisibility tiles.