Debate: Let's Un-nerf Bishop!

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DAZ0273
DAZ0273 Posts: 9,628 Chairperson of the Boards
edited 16 March 2024, 09:18 in MPQ General Discussion

With X-Men 97 upcoming and Bish being part of the team this seems a good time to bring him back to his glory days!

We have 5* characters who are stun immune and we have RiRi who can turn one stun with boosts a d we have Omega Red who can damage even when stunned, so what more do we need? Bishop could also be very handy against all those Jane's out there if you are having trouble with them!

Time for fun, time to stun!!!!

Debate: Let's Un-nerf Bishop! 47 votes

YES For the Future, make it so!
34%
JangoLoreAkatoshPunisher5784bonny79mdreyer93DAZ0273Scofiejp1skittledaddyMrcl25ThisisClemFandangoCarnifexEienRyuuScorpion201DomitronasZarqa 16 votes
NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more
48%
PorkBellykillercoolIridiousentrailbucketUNC_SamuraiCHRISJNillusionist_KADaredevil217CodexJezequelThe Viceroy ReturnsZalastabluewolfJaGoBorstockjustsingSt_Bernadus658_2HuracanDolorOmegased 23 votes
Stunned!!!! Other
17%
TheVultureBowgentleGrimSkaldfight4thedreamGodzillafan67TimemachinegoWilliamK1983CASSIDYFROST 8 votes
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Comments

  • Scofie
    Scofie GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,129 Chairperson of the Boards
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    YES For the Future, make it so!

    He's pretty terrible as he is. Maybe make him usable rather than reinstate the previous levels of menace.

  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 9,628 Chairperson of the Boards
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    YES For the Future, make it so!

    But the menace was fun!!!!

    He seriously needs something doing he is just horrible.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Stunned!!!! Other

    No.
    Rework him.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    No.

    Well, maybe, on one condition. That power was broken because it had a numeric threshold (when anyone else would take X damage, Bishop jumps in front, generates AP etc). All those powers need to be fixed, including Valkyrie and...um...some others, I think?

    Change it to a percentage of health and the power is probably ok. They've done some stuff like this since the Bishop/4cap nerfs and all those powers are fine. Characters should never get worse as you level them.

  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 9,628 Chairperson of the Boards
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    YES For the Future, make it so!

    Is it still broken when we have decent counters though?

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Stunned!!!! Other

    @DAZ0273 said:
    Is it still broken when we have decent counters though?

    Yes.
    Two wongs don't make one right.

  • fight4thedream
    fight4thedream GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,920 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Stunned!!!! Other

    I'm in favor for the stun fun, but as @entrailbucket has pointed out, his old ability would need adjustment for Ascension; otherwise there would be less stun fun. But definitely hoping they do something cool for the X-Men '97 revival. I love that show.

    Along similar lines, I also think we should un-nerf Gambit while we are at it.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Stunned!!!! Other

    @entrailbucket said:
    No.

    Well, maybe, on one condition. That power was broken because it had a numeric threshold (when anyone else would take X damage, Bishop jumps in front, generates AP etc). All those powers need to be fixed, including Valkyrie and...um...some others, I think?

    Change it to a percentage of health and the power is probably ok. They've done some stuff like this since the Bishop/4cap nerfs and all those powers are fine. Characters should never get worse as you level them.

    Thing, Xfool come to mind.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    @DAZ0273 said:
    Is it still broken when we have decent counters though?

    Yes. We had counters before too, and they were somewhat useful against Bishop but awful against everybody else.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    @fight4thedream said:

    Along similar lines, I also think we should un-nerf Gambit while we are at it.

    He can have everything but the passive AP drain. That power can't exist (as we saw with Chasm) -- it just shuts down way too many characters.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Stunned!!!! Other

    Gambit is fine now, it's a good rework.
    Run him when boosted, he's awesome.

  • Scorpion201
    Scorpion201 Posts: 57 Match Maker
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    YES For the Future, make it so!

    Yes un-nerf bishop, if their not going to nerf mighty Thor, un nerf bishop..

  • Bzhai
    Bzhai Posts: 440 Mover and Shaker
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    He doesn't even need a stun to be good, there are so many ways to represent his powers. He can have increased match damage, healing, temporary invulnerability or resistance to charged tiles.

  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 2,939 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Wouldn't unnerfing Bishop just mean that he'd be used to fuel Kang teams for very fast Away wins?

    KGB

  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 9,628 Chairperson of the Boards
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    YES For the Future, make it so!

    @KGB said:
    Wouldn't unnerfing Bishop just mean that he'd be used to fuel Kang teams for very fast Away wins?

    KGB

    Is that a problem? Bishop was always more about defence, no?

  • Borstock
    Borstock Posts: 2,547 Chairperson of the Boards
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    He can't have the old blue generation. Now that you can ascend 4's, you really want to fight him and Polaris doing their thing?

    I was against the nerf because both him and Polaris could be one shot by 5 match damage. They became irrelevant once the 5* tier beefed up. Now that they can both be 5's too, that would be a nightmare. He can keep the stun. But he can't be a battery like that again.

  • kuntilanak
    kuntilanak Posts: 52 Match Maker
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    Hell NO!!! The current meta teams are all geared towards fast/ free AP generation and do continous damage aka winfinite to breeze through. The old iteration of bishop and 5Gambit will make the fast/free AP generation going supernova. Imagine the sea of MThor, bishop and 5Gambit... my roster was nowhere competitive back during their menacing years, but i can definitely picture the nightmare that follows if they have their old self back.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    @DAZ0273 said:

    @KGB said:
    Wouldn't unnerfing Bishop just mean that he'd be used to fuel Kang teams for very fast Away wins?

    KGB

    Is that a problem? Bishop was always more about defence, no?

    There are enough autowin Kang teams on offense that I don't think Bishop would contribute to that particular problem.

    And yes, he was mainly a problem on defense. You'd want to structure your team so that there was only one active blue power, and it was Bishop's stun. I imagine you could brew up some pretty unpleasant stuff that fit that criteria with today's characters (imagine your entire team stunlocked for 5 turns with Omega Red and Hulk on the other side, for example).

  • CHRISJN
    CHRISJN Posts: 105 Tile Toppler
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    No, better dont..A rebalance maybe..

    I would love OML to be rolled back on his prime days and see how he can do with recently new high level toons.

    Also Gambit maybe? Wait I sold him by the time they nerf him, and champed him again after few years. So i am open with that option also.

  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,305 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 17 March 2024, 14:25
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    NO General Reserves at maximum, cannot absorb any more

    @CHRISJN said:
    No, better dont..A rebalance maybe..

    I would love OML to be rolled back on his prime days and see how he can do with recently new high level toons.

    Also Gambit maybe? Wait I sold him by the time they nerf him, and champed him again after few years. So i am open with that option also.

    The utter embarrassment of OML’s health when boosted…I hope release a real 5* (Jackman) Wolverine later this year..