That is the least of the problems. The best supports are NOT available to PvE players. You have to rank in PvP to get them. Anybody who grabs those supports from PvP will have a 5*, and it will severely outrank anything PvE players have. There are maybe 10 high quality PvE supports and 6 of them come from PvP.
So unless you were super lucky to get a 5* Chimichanga / Royal Talon Support / Support of the color you need...then you are at a disadvantage. AND you have no path to work to change that.
Its a **** system, and they have not told us how they will change it.
The only 'stone' that's really good is the Power Stone. The rest I could care less about because they aren't that much better than anything else you can get support wise.
I got the R3 Reality stone like many others here from when they gave it out for posting. Yet other than level it up, I've never equipped it to anyone because it's not as good as my Chimichanga for generating Red AP.
I think the supports people really care about are the ones that give +X AP at the start of battle so you can win on turn 1 or 2. None of the Stones gives that.
KGB
@entrailbucket said: @Belphegor666 said: @entrailbucket said: @Yepyep said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10. I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10. CL in pvp does not change the teams you see. You'll have the same fights in 10 that you have in CL 1. Scores are higher in 10, though. I have no idea where t25 is these days, I've played in 9 for a year now. Pretty sure 1,200 will get you T25 most events, or very close in CL10. 1200 will often get you t5 in slice 2, but...you're probably not going to get to 1200. The scoring difference between slices is night and day, especially if you're comparing 2 or 5 (the lowest) to 1 and 4 (the highest). The thing is (for OP's question) PvP placement rewards pale in comparison to progression rewards. Most players are much better off choosing slice 1 or 4, even if your placement suffers, because scoring 1200+ is SO much easier. So you're saying I'll get lower scores in 2 and 5? And I'm assuming this is the same for every CL. Good to know for the next season. For me the priority is the 5* shards, if I can get t50(60 shards) or t25(80shards) I'll be satisfied. For progression I usually go for the wins(50) over the score but I still try to get as high as possible for placement. In CL9 I've been averaging 830-900 and I've maintained t10 for months. I also noticed the difference in progression is slight. Considering this, what is the best way to move forward? In PvP, the opponents are the same no matter what CL you choose. It's not like PvE where enemies get harder as rewards increase. So you should always play the highest PvP CL you have access to (except in very rare cases that apply only to people who coordinate in PvP -- for example, you prenegotiate a #1 finish in a particular bracket). I recommend most players choose either the first or fourth end time. These slices have significantly more players who score significantly more points, which makes it much easier to reach max progression. If you move from s5 to s1, you'll see a huge difference. Even if the end time is inconvenient for you, one shield can solve that problem for a relatively small amount of HP.
@entrailbucket said:
@Belphegor666 said: @entrailbucket said: @Yepyep said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10. I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10. CL in pvp does not change the teams you see. You'll have the same fights in 10 that you have in CL 1. Scores are higher in 10, though. I have no idea where t25 is these days, I've played in 9 for a year now. Pretty sure 1,200 will get you T25 most events, or very close in CL10. 1200 will often get you t5 in slice 2, but...you're probably not going to get to 1200. The scoring difference between slices is night and day, especially if you're comparing 2 or 5 (the lowest) to 1 and 4 (the highest). The thing is (for OP's question) PvP placement rewards pale in comparison to progression rewards. Most players are much better off choosing slice 1 or 4, even if your placement suffers, because scoring 1200+ is SO much easier. So you're saying I'll get lower scores in 2 and 5? And I'm assuming this is the same for every CL. Good to know for the next season. For me the priority is the 5* shards, if I can get t50(60 shards) or t25(80shards) I'll be satisfied. For progression I usually go for the wins(50) over the score but I still try to get as high as possible for placement. In CL9 I've been averaging 830-900 and I've maintained t10 for months. I also noticed the difference in progression is slight. Considering this, what is the best way to move forward?
@Belphegor666 said:
@entrailbucket said: @Yepyep said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10. I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10. CL in pvp does not change the teams you see. You'll have the same fights in 10 that you have in CL 1. Scores are higher in 10, though. I have no idea where t25 is these days, I've played in 9 for a year now. Pretty sure 1,200 will get you T25 most events, or very close in CL10. 1200 will often get you t5 in slice 2, but...you're probably not going to get to 1200. The scoring difference between slices is night and day, especially if you're comparing 2 or 5 (the lowest) to 1 and 4 (the highest). The thing is (for OP's question) PvP placement rewards pale in comparison to progression rewards. Most players are much better off choosing slice 1 or 4, even if your placement suffers, because scoring 1200+ is SO much easier.
@Yepyep said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10. I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10. CL in pvp does not change the teams you see. You'll have the same fights in 10 that you have in CL 1. Scores are higher in 10, though. I have no idea where t25 is these days, I've played in 9 for a year now. Pretty sure 1,200 will get you T25 most events, or very close in CL10.
@Yepyep said:
@Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10. I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10. CL in pvp does not change the teams you see. You'll have the same fights in 10 that you have in CL 1. Scores are higher in 10, though. I have no idea where t25 is these days, I've played in 9 for a year now.
@Bowgentle said:
@Belphegor666 said: @Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10. I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10.
@Bowgentle said: @Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP? Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10.
@Belphegor666 said: @Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend. The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP?
@Dogface said: Personally, I've never understood SCL9. The increase in rewards compared to SCL8 was minimal for more work. Not like the reward hike from SCL9 to SCL10. Maybe I had been hanging a bit too long in SCL8, but eventually I skipped SCL9 to go directly to 10 and never gone back. Having to clear fewer nodes, albeit more difficult, is a godsend.
The advantage of 10 over 9 in PVE is clear but what about in PVP?
Depends. How highly do you value 4* covers, and can you get t5 or better in CL9 If you can reliably get t5 in 9 then it's better. Those 2 4* covers every pvp are nice. Of course if you value 5* shards higher, the equation might change, depending on whether you can get t25 or higher in CL10.
I've been getting t10 for months and recently I'm getting t5 in CL9, I doubt I'll be able to get t25 in CL10. Do you get more points in CL10 and what are the scores generally in t25? I also don't think I'll be able to get 50 wins in CL10.
CL in pvp does not change the teams you see. You'll have the same fights in 10 that you have in CL 1. Scores are higher in 10, though. I have no idea where t25 is these days, I've played in 9 for a year now.
Pretty sure 1,200 will get you T25 most events, or very close in CL10.
1200 will often get you t5 in slice 2, but...you're probably not going to get to 1200.
The scoring difference between slices is night and day, especially if you're comparing 2 or 5 (the lowest) to 1 and 4 (the highest).
The thing is (for OP's question) PvP placement rewards pale in comparison to progression rewards. Most players are much better off choosing slice 1 or 4, even if your placement suffers, because scoring 1200+ is SO much easier.
So you're saying I'll get lower scores in 2 and 5? And I'm assuming this is the same for every CL. Good to know for the next season.
For me the priority is the 5* shards, if I can get t50(60 shards) or t25(80shards) I'll be satisfied. For progression I usually go for the wins(50) over the score but I still try to get as high as possible for placement. In CL9 I've been averaging 830-900 and I've maintained t10 for months. I also noticed the difference in progression is slight. Considering this, what is the best way to move forward?
In PvP, the opponents are the same no matter what CL you choose. It's not like PvE where enemies get harder as rewards increase. So you should always play the highest PvP CL you have access to (except in very rare cases that apply only to people who coordinate in PvP -- for example, you prenegotiate a #1 finish in a particular bracket).
I recommend most players choose either the first or fourth end time. These slices have significantly more players who score significantly more points, which makes it much easier to reach max progression. If you move from s5 to s1, you'll see a huge difference. Even if the end time is inconvenient for you, one shield can solve that problem for a relatively small amount of HP.
So, I just completed my first SCL10 pvp in s4 managed to get 850 rank 21, I suspect it will drop by the end. I'll try s5 next time to see if it's less competitive.
S5 scores a lot lower than s4, but you'll get massacred unless you're running a top tier team.
Okay 4 it is
You could try S1. We're a friendly bunch, in general. I hear there's even LINE rooms. Not that I'd know anything about those.
Yeah, Definitely S1 Line room. Ask around and someone can get you into the room. They have lots of bracket flips so people are spread out and always climbing. Tell all your alliancemates that even if the timing isn't great based on your location. Its more points overall.
@Phumade said: Yeah, Definitely S1 Line room. Ask around and someone can get you into the room. They have lots of bracket flips so people are spread out and always climbing. Tell all your alliancemates that even if the timing isn't great based on your location. Its more points overall.
I'll try it out next pvp, I had already joined s5 in the beast one before seeing your replies. Message me the line ID if you know it. Need to get my footing before next season.
Now on to my first SCL10 pve, don't know how scary infinite pursuit is but I'll check the spreadsheet. At least I champed my Kang.
Getting into SCL10, I was expecting t100 at best but I actually managed t20 in IP. Its all thanks to Kang,Deathlok,Riri,IM5*. I know some events will curb my enthusiasm.
In PVP I found that 900 points got me t25 in s5, I'm currently finishing s2 but they seem similar in terms of less competition. I'm leaning more towards s5 though.. Thank you all for the advice.
What you reached should be your typical experience. Once you realize that T100 in CL10 is essentially the same as T20 you'll stop pushing so hard and just cruise to a T100 finish (that's what I do) for the 4* cover.
900 points in S5 gets me T25 roughly half the time (for that 4* cover). Some events you need closer to 1000 and others 850 range. It just depends on the boost list that week and who the 5* shards are for etc.
Hopefully some other players in the same situation will see this!
@KGB said: What you reached should be your typical experience. Once you realize that T100 in CL10 is essentially the same as T20 you'll stop pushing so hard and just cruise to a T100 finish (that's what I do) for the 4* cover. 900 points in S5 gets me T25 roughly half the time (for that 4* cover). Some events you need closer to 1000 and others 850 range. It just depends on the boost list that week and who the 5* shards are for etc. KGB
@KGB said: What you reached should be your typical experience. Once you realize that T100 in CL10 is essentially the same as T20 you'll stop pushing so hard and just cruise to a T100 finish (that's what I do) for the 4* cover.
But the extra cover and shards is still preferred. I'm sticking to s5 though, I hit a wall at 800 points in s2, but I think I read that's how mmr works at 800 points, not sure.
There's no magic numbers in matchmaking -- what you saw was a lack of good matches for you once you got to 800 points, at that particular time, in that slice. Most people play the same slice every event, and a lot of people play at the same times, too. So that 800 point wall might always exist for you in that slice, at that time, but there's nothing special about 800 points.
That's another bit of advice that can help folks who are having trouble with matchmaking -- if you can't find any good fights, try playing at an earlier or later time than you usually do, even if you're in the same slice. Eventually you'll find what works best for you.
@entrailbucket said: There's no magic numbers in matchmaking -- what you saw was a lack of good matches for you once you got to 800 points, at that particular time, in that slice. Most people play the same slice every event, and a lot of people play at the same times, too. So that 800 point wall might always exist for you in that slice, at that time, but there's nothing special about 800 points. That's another bit of advice that can help folks who are having trouble with matchmaking -- if you can't find any good fights, try playing at an earlier or later time than you usually do, even if you're in the same slice. Eventually you'll find what works best for you.
@entrailbucket said: There's no magic numbers in matchmaking -- what you saw was a lack of good matches for you once you got to 800 points, at that particular time, in that slice. Most people play the same slice every event, and a lot of people play at the same times, too. So that 800 point wall might always exist for you in that slice, at that time, but there's nothing special about 800 points.
Good to know, I'm usually able to push past the wall if I play 8hrs to finish. Playing in s2 messed up my timings and I played 6hrs to finish
If you're planning to go past 800 in the last 8 hours in s2, it won't end well.
@Bowgentle said: If you're planning to go past 800 in the last 8 hours in s2, it won't end well.
Now I know, this is my last s2, sticking to s5. I'm hoping boosted Wong will give me the extra push.
2,3,5 are brutal in the last 11 hours. Big rosters all pushing for prog/placement whatever. You really want to focus your play at the 30-14 hr mark. Yes, that means at least 2 shields. But you'll see its a much more relaxed climbing experience.
1,4 are much easier with respect to timing, but even there you'd be hard pressed to just start at the 8hr mark and climbing to 1200, unless you had either line assistance or a 500 roster.
The 30-14 hr mark is by far the easiest time to climb.
As someone who only plays the last two hours of s2 every event, purposely (to raise the MPQ difficulty level as high as possible), I wholeheartedly endorse this statement. Don't do it unless that's what you're going for.
@Phumade said: 2,3,5 are brutal in the last 11 hours. Big rosters all pushing for prog/placement whatever. You really want to focus your play at the 30-14 hr mark. Yes, that means at least 2 shields. But you'll see its a much more relaxed climbing experience. 1,4 are much easier with respect to timing, but even there you'd be hard pressed to just start at the 8hr mark and climbing to 1200, unless you had either line assistance or a 500 roster. The 30-14 hr mark is by far the easiest time to climb.
@Phumade said: 2,3,5 are brutal in the last 11 hours. Big rosters all pushing for prog/placement whatever. You really want to focus your play at the 30-14 hr mark. Yes, that means at least 2 shields. But you'll see its a much more relaxed climbing experience.
I always go for 50 wins so playing last day won't work for me. Also big rosters making their final plays usually works for me, I just let them climb so when I retaliate I get higher points faster. I also just play 1 node in the final hours and leave the other 2 for after I hit the wall. I would say this works 80% of the time. I think this is why s5 has been working for me for some time, in s4 I found that most people shield very early so less good matches for me, getting to 850 was very hard. In s5 I was able to push past 900 much easier.
One thing that's not clear at all to newer players, or those outside the community -- the slices aren't just end times. They're effectively leagues.
The history is relevant here. When the devs created time slices, there were just a few alliances that dominated the PvP competition. Those players fought against each other a lot. What ended up happening was that each group of top players claimed one of the time slices, and each slice developed their own sort of culture based on those players.
Over the years they've evolved and changed "ownership" a few times (barring s2, which is weird), but each slice is still essentially home to one or two groups of top players (some groups are much, much, larger than others) who set the culture and rough ground rules for what happens there.
In general, the players who "run" s1 and s4 are much friendlier and more collaborative than the players who "run" s2 and s5 (I'm so far out of the loop these days that I don't know who's in s3 anymore or what it's like). This isn't necessarily something that's obvious to newer players or less hardcore PvP players, but "more points" vs "less points" in a slice is absolutely noticeable for everybody.