Is there a name for those easy teams in PVP when you hit 800 or so?

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LavaManLee
LavaManLee Posts: 1,286 Chairperson of the Boards
in MPQ General Discussion
Curious what we call these teams.  I play SCL10 PVP.  There are the seed teams in PVP, and then you fight a bunch of teams around your own level for a long time.  Then, around 800 points or so, I seem to fight teams that aren't seed but definitely aren't powerful.  Like BRB/Kitty/Polaris but all at level 350.  Or Sabretooth/Polaris/Grocket at 325.  They seem to be worth around 25 points or so.  I fight those teams for a while and then when I get to around 900, the more powerful teams show up.

Was wondering if those teams had a name or if they are just random teams that appear. 

Also, for the first time ever, I found those teams in SimShield.  I got to around 1800 or so and then really easy teams showed up and I could get to 2000.
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Comments

  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,260 Chairperson of the Boards
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    They're not cupcakes. The reason you're seeing those teams is because you have broken through the MMR for a short period. This happens when the game runs out of targets in your range so its just offering whatever matchups it can find, I'm not sure how they're chosen but they're usually much weaker indeed.

    As soon as the game can find normal matchups, you won't see them anymore.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    "Cupcakes" is a very specific thing that isn't this.  Cupcakes are intentionally bad teams put out right before you shield to give your friends an easier match.  It's not done nearly as much as it used to be.  

    On the original question:   I don't know if there's a name for this phenomenon but it's how the matchmaking algorithm works.  No one knows exactly how it works but here are the rough details:

    When you skip a node, the game looks for your next fight by applying filters in cascading order.

    1.  Unshielded players
    2.  A filter here removes fights that are deemed too hard for you to win.
    3.  Players with similar points to you in this event.
    4.  Players with a similar roster to you (note that this has nothing to do with the team you're currently using, it's your roster).

    When you start an event, your score is low and the game can easily find many players who fit all of these criteria.  As you move up in points, there are less players fitting all the criteria, so the game begins to ignore certain filters, from the bottom up.

    So once you've climbed above most of the players around your roster strength, filter #4 will be phased out and you'll start seeing teams weaker than your roster that have points near yours.  Once those teams are exhausted filter #2 will eventually be removed.  Filter #1 can never be removed.
  • supergarv
    supergarv Posts: 408 Mover and Shaker
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    I only know the next group after the one you refer to, those are „seals“. You club them, and you get 1-4pts. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

    I personally (5* MMR at a lvl 480 average or so) only get seed teams, then „normal“ teams until I get to like T2 of my bracket or more than 1200pts, and then its seals only, unless someone with >1000pts comes up to be unshielded.

    Then again, I‘m S2 CL10 which is a barren wasteland; the 75 or so players within my MMR, which I nearly know by heart. Its like hitting family. Day after day after day. No, this is not socially awkward.

    Anyhow. Make up a name! Snacks, Poorsouls, Encores, Medians, Neighbors, Catchmes, Guilty Matchers…..
  • SaltnPeppa
    SaltnPeppa Posts: 306 Mover and Shaker
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    Do you really need to label something?   Call them whatever you want.  It's all ones and zeroes.
  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 2,939 Chairperson of the Boards
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    As a 4* player (~320 for my highest level characters) I see the same thing at 800 points.
    I call them 'Scooby Snacks' because I gobble them up as fast as I can to get to 900.
    KGB
  • Rod5
    Rod5 Posts: 585 Critical Contributor
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    Seal-bashing is a legitimate point-building activity. If you share the love no single player’s score gets too badly affected, and you’d only do it in the first 12-18 hours of an event anyway.
  • Beefhammer69
    Beefhammer69 Posts: 58 Match Maker
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    They’re definitely not grills because they’re usually some sort of synergistic 4*/mixed 4&5* team, they’re technically not seals because they’re usually worth between 20-40 points. I refer to them as walrus/walrii. Good source of easy points in the 800-1000 range. 

    Also, you keep mentioning that you play CL10 PVP in like every post/comment but that still doesn’t change the fact that it has no effect on the teams the game shows you. That’s based on your MMR and your MMR only. 
  • LavaManLee
    LavaManLee Posts: 1,286 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2021
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    Beefhammer69 said:
    Also, you keep mentioning that you play CL10 PVP in like every post/comment but that still doesn’t change the fact that it has no effect on the teams the game shows you. That’s based on your MMR and your MMR only. 
    Is this a documented fact?  And very sorry to upset you by mentioning it as I thought it was worthwhile.  There are many people (like my alliance mates) that I never, ever ever see so thought it has something to do with my slice and my CL10.  I could definitely be incorrect and thought mentioning what Level I play was helpful.  But it might have no bearing.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I noticed that too and they have pretty high points like 60-70. If you are fast enough, you can beat them thrice before they "disappear".  It makes hitting 1200 a breeze.
  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,009 Chairperson of the Boards
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    LavaManLee said:
    Beefhammer69 said:
    Also, you keep mentioning that you play CL10 PVP in like every post/comment but that still doesn’t change the fact that it has no effect on the teams the game shows you. That’s based on your MMR and your MMR only. 
    Is this a documented fact?  And very sorry to upset you by mentioning it as I thought it was worthwhile.  There are many people (like my alliance mates) that I never, ever ever see so thought it has something to do with my slice and my CL10.  I could definitely be incorrect and thought mentioning what Level I play was helpful.  But it might have no  no bearing.
    Yes this is a documented fact.  I have ally mates who play slc 9 and 8 with similar rosters to mine and I can que them up playing in scl 10 and they can que me.  Scl has no effect on who you can see or who can see you, if it did I wouldn't be able to que up 1 star and 2 star teams playing in low scl's when I break MMR.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    CL does not affect matchmaking in any way.  The end time you choose does though.  You can only fight players who chose the same end time as you.

    The different end times became like leagues as soon as they were introduced, and they play very differently from each other.  So which end time you're in definitely *is* relevant information if you have a PvP question, but CL is not.
  • LavaManLee
    LavaManLee Posts: 1,286 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Thanks!  That makes sense then.  So the slice matters but the CL does not.  I learn something every day.
  • Sekilicious
    Sekilicious Posts: 1,766 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Ok so slice matters, I understand that. What are the best slices to play? I play slice 4 since I like the 10pm local end time but things dry up with about 8 hours left once I hit about 750 pts and I’m stuck hitting suboptimal targets worth 25-30 pts. This is after several skips. 
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 4,915 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I play in slice 2 and you probably should not pick that one.  It's not nearly as bad as it used to be but it's still pretty bad compared to the others.

    I really don't know what the other slices are like these days, but I'm sure someone else can speak to that.
  • revskip
    revskip Posts: 966 Critical Contributor
    edited May 2021
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    Slice 1 and 4 have elevated scores so there are more points available but placement is much harder.  Slices 2 & 5 are pretty dry on points but 1200 will get you top 5 usually and 1500 is usually good for #1.  Slice 3 is a little more points than 2 & 5 but still lower scoring compared to 1 and 4.  
  • Sekilicious
    Sekilicious Posts: 1,766 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited May 2021
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    Good to know. My last PvP in SCL9 the #1 player had 1300 pts. I generally don’t pay attention but thought that was an aberration. Good to know it is the general rule.
  • acescracked
    acescracked Posts: 1,197 Chairperson of the Boards
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    revskip said:
    Slice 1 and 5 have elevated scores so there are more points available but placement is much harder.  Slices 2 & 4 are pretty dry on points but 1200 will get you top 5 usually and 1500 is usually good for #1.  Slice 3 is a little more points than 2 & 4 but still lower scoring compared to 1 and 5.  
    You've got 4 & 5 mixed up. 4 is the highest scoring slice with 1. 5 is the lowest scoring slice with 2.

    Higher scoring slice good for getting 900/1200 bad for placement.
    Lower scoring slice bad for getting 900/1200 good for placement.
  • revskip
    revskip Posts: 966 Critical Contributor
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    acescracked said:
    revskip said:
    Slice 1 and 5 have elevated scores so there are more points available but placement is much harder.  Slices 2 & 4 are pretty dry on points but 1200 will get you top 5 usually and 1500 is usually good for #1.  Slice 3 is a little more points than 2 & 4 but still lower scoring compared to 1 and 5.  
    You've got 4 & 5 mixed up. 4 is the highest scoring slice with 1. 5 is the lowest scoring slice with 2.

    Higher scoring slice good for getting 900/1200 bad for placement.
    Lower scoring slice bad for getting 900/1200 good for placement.
    You are absolutely right.  My bad.   

    Should never type anything out before coffee,  lol.  I'll edit now. 
  • acescracked
    acescracked Posts: 1,197 Chairperson of the Boards
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    revskip said:
    acescracked said:
    revskip said:
    Slice 1 and 5 have elevated scores so there are more points available but placement is much harder.  Slices 2 & 4 are pretty dry on points but 1200 will get you top 5 usually and 1500 is usually good for #1.  Slice 3 is a little more points than 2 & 4 but still lower scoring compared to 1 and 5.  
    You've got 4 & 5 mixed up. 4 is the highest scoring slice with 1. 5 is the lowest scoring slice with 2.

    Higher scoring slice good for getting 900/1200 bad for placement.
    Lower scoring slice bad for getting 900/1200 good for placement.
    You are absolutely right.  My bad.   

    Should never type anything out before coffee,  lol.  I'll edit now. 
    No worries. I'm a typo genius so I know...heh
  • Tanglefoot
    Tanglefoot Posts: 146 Tile Toppler
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    saw this 
    "When you skip a node, the game looks for your next fight by applying filters in cascading order.

    1.  Unshielded players
    2.  A filter here removes fights that are deemed too hard for you to win.
    3.  Players with similar points to you in this event.
    4.  Players with a similar roster to you (note that this has nothing to do with the team you're currently using, it's your roster)."

    the only thing true here is #1.

    2 - I am a mid-3* player, with only 1 character over level 200. I regularly get fights offered to me where the LOWEST level on the enemy team is 300+, and they have 2 5* each with multiple covers. The chances I can win a battle against a level 300 5* Carnage with all colors, a level 327 kitty with all colors, and a level 355 Apocalypse with all colors is exactly 0%. so not true.

    3. I regularly see enemies that I cannot find on the list of scores, at all. Perhaps, as someone mentions above, they are getting similar scores in other slices and I just cannot see them. I was watching this last night. I was #3 in a PvP, and like 150 points ahead of #4. Both #1 and #2 in rankings were unshielded, and neither ever appeared in my PvP in 15 battles, as I caught up to and passed them. By the time I finished, #4 was about 200 points behind the new #3, but I never saw the other two players I passed, but I skipped a TON of other enemies with monster teams. I am not convinced your score has ANYTHING to do with PvP matching.

    4. Absolutely not true. I have skipped 12-15 opponents before seeing another 3* character, The total levels of my entire team cannot exceed 600 - I just don't have the roster. I rarely see enemy teams where the total levels of the enemy team are lower than maybe 1,000 at best, and often see levels totaling over 1100. That regularly pits me against players with fully champed 4* rosters, when I don't even have a single maxed 3*. so the roster has nothing to do with MMR.

    MMR is a mystery.

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