Roster Slot Sale

killahKlown

Vhailorx said:

killahKlown said:

There are those of us that carefully structure our roster slots and don't go overboard with duplicate characters.  I wouldn't want to see my hard work be for nothing by having less thoughtful players being rewarded with a roster slot sale to further encourage their slot hoarding ways.  Wisely structuring your roster is part of the game strategy.

Just say NO to roster slot sale

Troll post is troll-y.

There is literally no downside for players if in-game resources cost less. 

speak for yourself

And it's not cool to label people as a troll just because their opinion differs from yours.  Can people no longer have a discussion without immediately attacking the other side?  Grow up man.

NotBAMF

Your take is based on whatever the exact opposite of empathy is. It's basically "nuts to other people if they are suffering because I did something different than they did, so they deserve it". At best it's trolling to get the reactions you are; at worst it's intentionally cruel and spiteful to others for no real reason to be. 

pheregas

And it's not cool to label people as a troll just because their opinion differs from yours.  Can people no longer have a discussion without immediately attacking the other side?  Grow up man.

This is how politics work in this country.  Why would the internet be any different?  

Warbringa

killahKlown said:

Rhipf said:

killahKlown said:

There are those of us that carefully structure our roster slots and don't go overboard with duplicate characters.  I wouldn't want to see my hard work be for nothing by having less thoughtful players being rewarded with a roster slot sale to further encourage their slot hoarding ways.  Wisely structuring your roster is part of the game strategy.

Just say NO to roster slot sale

You do realize that a roster slot sale would benefit you as well. You may not need slots for duplicate characters but unless you only have 3 slots and rotate characters in and out of those slots you will eventually need a new slot. I don't see how having a sale on slots diminishes your "hard work" or "wisely structur[ed]" roster.

I don't spend my HP frivolously.  I play until I have no health packs and then take a break.  I don't use a bunch of HP on shields in PVP.  I play for top HP rewards.  I've adapted my game around not wasting HP so that I can have some when I do need a roster slot for new releases.  Why should other people who can't manage their HP properly be rewarded with a bail out? 

There is no advantage to not having the roster slot sale from a superior player's perspective, which is what you have established that you are in your posts. Everyone's price would be less for roster slots.  It saves you resources, in fact, if you say you are so superior in managing your HP, then you should actually be in a position to take even more advantage of this than most players by buying more roster slots at a discount compared to the less superior players. If you are afraid other players will outspend you and gain an advantage in the game....guess what they are doing so with or without a roster slot sale, so why would you not want a sale that you can benefit from?

fight4thedream

***Mod note: Removed posts for inappropriate comments. Please refrain from throwing labels at such as "troll" or "white knight" as it does nothing to add to the discussion and is simply used as a means to belittle someone else's ideas. 

If you disagree with someone and think it worth your time to engage in a discussion then do so but stick to the issues being discussed. Otherwise, I advise to simply move on to more worthwhile or enjoyable things. Any further derogatory comments will result in the closure of this thread and issuing of a warning. Thank you.

pheregas

Nick441234 said:

killahKlown said:

I'm not sure you speak for the entire MPQ community

What sort of person wouldn't want a roster slot sale? - Mod note: Original comment was removed  for being inflammatory but will let pheregas' comment in response to it stand as it is quite insightful. The original quote has been edited. - fight4thedream

There is a subset of person who want everyone to work for something the way they did so that everything is on a "fair" playing field.

While I agree that picking yourself up from your bootstraps is character building, it can be argued that it is not a one to one comparison.

An early poster cited the decrease in HP overall in the game, which means by anti-inflation, HP is scarcer than it used to be.

So the "bootstraps" method of progress isn't quite appropriate as the resources early players used to buy slots is unavailable to current players.

There are many real life reasons why bootstrapping is simply an archaic way to do things if you want to give newer players a leg up to be more competitive.  After all, as older players retire, newer players have to have the opportunity to step in and fill that void, otherwise the 1% stays at the 1% and newer player advancement ceases (which one could argue would be further detrimental to the game.)

That being said, there are real feelings involved with working and progressing your roster only to see newer players slingshot their way ahead of the game.  I remember feeling this way when the 5* meta shifted considerably.  I had the meta players, then suddenly I didn't, but newer players had the same access to the new meta as me, which means the field got more competitive.

This was, of course, frustrating, but I just shifted my world view and ultimately was happier knowing that the community as a whole was most likely happier with the state of the game than just me.

Granted, I'm not an economist.  These are my opinions.  As such, they are mine and you may have different ones.  That is also cool as long as you don't yuck my yum.*



*Don't "Yuck my Yum" is an expression my wife says at home to my children.  I have no idea where it comes from.  However, it means don't ruin someone else's experience if it has no bearing at all on my own.

killahKlown

And it's not cool to label people as a troll just because their opinion differs from yours.  Can people no longer have a discussion without immediately attacking the other side?  Grow up man.

This is how politics work in this country.  Why would the internet be any different?  

Ha!  True true

Warbringa

pheregas said:

Granted, I'm not an economist.  These are my opinions.  As such, they are mine and you may have different ones.  That is also cool as long as you don't yuck my yum.*



*Don't "Yuck my Yum" is an expression my wife says at home to my children.  I have no idea where it comes from.  However, it means don't ruin someone else's experience if it has no bearing at all on my own.

Let me give some on the forums the economist point of view which adequately summarizes why the view against roster slot sales is illogical.  This is also a rare case where the economist view is actually also the real world way in which anyone thinking logically would look at this.


The assumptions: 

Roster slots = milk (real world example)
HP = money (real world example)
You are superior to your neighbor in managing your resources

In the real world, you have saved up $5.  You need to live and milk is the main thing you need to live and grow to do so.  Milk drops to from $2 a gallon to $1.80 a gallon.  You are mad because now your neighbor, who only has $4 saved up can buy milk for $1.80 a gallon and saved 20 cents. Never mind the fact that you are also saving 20 cents.  Never mind the fact that you will be able to use that 20 cents more efficiently than your neighbor.  Never mind that if all your neighbors die because the price of milk is higher you most likely won't be able to buy any more milk since no one is going to ship milk to just you (or if they will your milk is now $10 a gallon and you are still dead).

This is the exact conversation we are having put into real world economic analysis.

killahKlown

Warbringa said:

killahKlown said:

Rhipf said:

killahKlown said:

There are those of us that carefully structure our roster slots and don't go overboard with duplicate characters.  I wouldn't want to see my hard work be for nothing by having less thoughtful players being rewarded with a roster slot sale to further encourage their slot hoarding ways.  Wisely structuring your roster is part of the game strategy.

Just say NO to roster slot sale

You do realize that a roster slot sale would benefit you as well. You may not need slots for duplicate characters but unless you only have 3 slots and rotate characters in and out of those slots you will eventually need a new slot. I don't see how having a sale on slots diminishes your "hard work" or "wisely structur[ed]" roster.

I don't spend my HP frivolously.  I play until I have no health packs and then take a break.  I don't use a bunch of HP on shields in PVP.  I play for top HP rewards.  I've adapted my game around not wasting HP so that I can have some when I do need a roster slot for new releases.  Why should other people who can't manage their HP properly be rewarded with a bail out? 

There is no advantage to not having the roster slot sale from a superior player's perspective, which is what you have established that you are in your posts. Everyone's price would be less for roster slots.  It saves you resources, in fact, if you say you are so superior in managing your HP, then you should actually be in a position to take even more advantage of this than most players by buying more roster slots at a discount compared to the less superior players. If you are afraid other players will outspend you and gain an advantage in the game....guess what they are doing so with or without a roster slot sale, so why would you not want a sale that you can benefit from?

I am not a superior player.  You assume too much.  My roster sucks.  I do not place well in pvp or in pve.

I do not spend money on HP.  What I do is manage my rewarded HP intelligently.  Why would I want any kind of sale to happen that would allow my competition who do not manage their resources wisely to benefit in a way that I would not?

Vhailorx

MPQ (and economics) is not a morality play.  sometimes benefiting everyone equally, even those who didn't behave 'correctly,' is actually better for everyone. 

Scolding the spendthrift 'losers' who 'waste' their resources while lording your massive hoard over the plebes is a pointless enterprise.  You gain no effective advantage over other players by being 'smart' with your HP, because your competition will always consist of players who either deploy their resources as well as (or better than) you, or just spend enough $ to overcome any efficiency deficit.  You are preening your feathers over something that offers you no benefit.  And you are figuratively cutting of your own nose to spite your imaginary opponents face.

Warbringa

killahKlown said:

I am not a superior player.  You assume too much.  My roster sucks.  I do not place well in pvp or in pve.

I do not spend money on HP.  What I do is manage my rewarded HP intelligently.  Why would I want any kind of sale to happen that would allow my competition who do not manage their resources wisely to benefit in a way that I would not?

I only read what you are posting, I made no assumptions about your roster.  

killahKlown

Vhailorx said:

MPQ (and economics) is not a morality play.  sometimes benefiting everyone equally, even those who didn't behave 'correctly,' is actually better for everyone. 

Scolding the spendthrift 'losers' who 'waste' their resources while lording your massive hoard over the plebes is a pointless enterprise.  You gain no effective advantage over other players by being 'smart' with your HP, because your competition will always consist of players who either deploy their resources as well (or better) than you, or just spend enough $ to overcome any efficiency deficit.  You are preening your feathers over something that offers you no benefit.  And you are figuratively cutting of your own nose to spite your imaginary opponents face.

Why is Losers in quotes?  Nobody called anyone a loser.

pheregas

This is a fascinating conversation.  It really is.

Has anbody here not had the option to participate in a roster slot sale before?  If the answer is yes, then you too should be given that option.

If the answer is no, then that was an opportunity granted to you that was not granted to the newer player.  If you chose not to participate, then that was your choice.

I find it illogical not to afford the same choice to others at a different time.  Since there is no in-game mechanic to offer an individual a timed roster slot sale (and nor should there be for exploitative purposes), offering it the the community as a whole is as good as it gets.

One can hoard tokens (and many do.)  One can redeem tokens as they go (as I usually do.)  But while I'm waiting for Prof to vacate Latest, I'm sitting on tokens and CP.  Consequently, my HP supply is critically low.  Even if a sale were to happen today, I'd unlikely be able to participate.  If I could participate, I certainly would as the looming 2k HP per slot tax draws nearer and nearer.

But maybe the next sale around I would/could participate.  Opportunity, choice, and timing.  My play style is no better or no worse than yours and I should be allowed to play this game as I see fit, even if it is suboptimal in some regards (I'm looking at you CL10 discussions).  If you are morally offended by someone saving 20% off fake game currency...  Well...  That seems like something that can easily be gotten over.

killahKlown

OJSP said:

killahKlown said:

I do not spend money on HP.  What I do is manage my rewarded HP intelligently.  Why would I want any kind of sale to happen that would allow my competition who do not manage their resources wisely to benefit in a way that I would not?

Well.. I see what you're saying. I have some spare HP too and I haven't bought any roster slots in weeks (or even months?). I have 265 slots and I've been selling my lvl 266 3*s and 370 4*s to roster my new 4*s and 5*s. I only keep some maxed 3*s and 4*s, but I don't particularly have a problem selling them if I already have their duplicates.

The thing is, I would appreciate a roster slot sale too, because that means I'd get to buy more at a cheaper price. In the last sale, I bought 7 at the cheaper price (and I sold some characters too, so I had a few more additional empty slots). I just filled them with MBWs and other 1*s and replaced them with new characters later. You could do the same to benefit from the sale. If others need to buy the HP to take advantage of the sale and do so, then it's good business for the developers too.

If they have a sale now, I can buy at least 10 slots (more if I sell some of my maxed 2*s and 3*s) without spending any money. 

I appreciate your ability to see it from both sides.  Thank you.

Chameleon

killahKlown said:

Rhipf said:

killahKlown said:

There are those of us that carefully structure our roster slots and don't go overboard with duplicate characters.  I wouldn't want to see my hard work be for nothing by having less thoughtful players being rewarded with a roster slot sale to further encourage their slot hoarding ways.  Wisely structuring your roster is part of the game strategy.

Just say NO to roster slot sale

You do realize that a roster slot sale would benefit you as well. You may not need slots for duplicate characters but unless you only have 3 slots and rotate characters in and out of those slots you will eventually need a new slot. I don't see how having a sale on slots diminishes your "hard work" or "wisely structur[ed]" roster.

I don't spend my HP frivolously.  I play until I have no health packs and then take a break.  I don't use a bunch of HP on shields in PVP.  I play for top HP rewards.  I've adapted my game around not wasting HP so that I can have some when I do need a roster slot for new releases.  Why should other people who can't manage their HP properly be rewarded with a bail out? 

Well, my point is that the nerfed the amount of HP we get in the game recently.  That has lead to some players quitting and it is certainly hurting the newer players on a greater scale.  These players are managing their HP just as you do.  I'd suggest that they be given more roster slots than we were when we started but I'm willing to bet that your response to that would be negative, too. 

Chameleon

killahKlown said:

Warbringa said:

killahKlown said:

Rhipf said:

killahKlown said:

There are those of us that carefully structure our roster slots and don't go overboard with duplicate characters.  I wouldn't want to see my hard work be for nothing by having less thoughtful players being rewarded with a roster slot sale to further encourage their slot hoarding ways.  Wisely structuring your roster is part of the game strategy.

Just say NO to roster slot sale

You do realize that a roster slot sale would benefit you as well. You may not need slots for duplicate characters but unless you only have 3 slots and rotate characters in and out of those slots you will eventually need a new slot. I don't see how having a sale on slots diminishes your "hard work" or "wisely structur[ed]" roster.

I don't spend my HP frivolously.  I play until I have no health packs and then take a break.  I don't use a bunch of HP on shields in PVP.  I play for top HP rewards.  I've adapted my game around not wasting HP so that I can have some when I do need a roster slot for new releases.  Why should other people who can't manage their HP properly be rewarded with a bail out? 

There is no advantage to not having the roster slot sale from a superior player's perspective, which is what you have established that you are in your posts. Everyone's price would be less for roster slots.  It saves you resources, in fact, if you say you are so superior in managing your HP, then you should actually be in a position to take even more advantage of this than most players by buying more roster slots at a discount compared to the less superior players. If you are afraid other players will outspend you and gain an advantage in the game....guess what they are doing so with or without a roster slot sale, so why would you not want a sale that you can benefit from?

I am not a superior player.  You assume too much.  My roster sucks.  I do not place well in pvp or in pve.

I do not spend money on HP.  What I do is manage my rewarded HP intelligently.  Why would I want any kind of sale to happen that would allow my competition who do not manage their resources wisely to benefit in a way that I would not?

"would allow my competition who do not manage their resources wisely to benefit in a way that I would not"
But.. you *would*.

fiirst

killahKlown 

I am not a superior player.  You assume too much.  My roster sucks.  I do not place well in pvp or in pve.

I do not spend money on HP.  What I do is manage my rewarded HP intelligently.  Why would I want any kind of sale to happen that would allow my competition who do not manage their resources wisely to benefit in a way that I would not?

The reason do we need slot sales is we do play competitively.....not against only with players...but "dilution".

If you dont ride a car...it isnt mean that we should not have the road in the town, right?


p.s. never spend money for the game neither ,now i almost finished rostering all 4s.
It really pain to passed 3s land
(took almost 1 year).

So, i totally support to have slot sales to help newer player to get all 3s to get 10hp via ddq .

Nick441234

pheregas said:

Nick441234 said:

killahKlown said:

I'm not sure you speak for the entire MPQ community

What sort of person wouldn't want a roster slot sale? - Mod note: Original comment was removed  for being inflammatory but will let pheregas' comment in response to it stand as it is quite insightful. The original quote has been edited. - fight4thedream

There is a subset of person who want everyone to work for something the way they did so that everything is on a "fair" playing field.

I could agree, if the person disagreeing couldn't benefit from the deal too. For instance, if it was a roster sale for only new players. 

Pongie

As much as I would like to see a sale, my HP balance is down to 650 (from over 10k a couple of weeks ago). All those offers worked and my smallish stash was spent. Normally would have built it back up fairly quick but I ran out of slots from the last sale and had to purchase 2 more recently too. 

crackninja

I am looking forward to the next roster sale, but I do think this is an interesting topic so I wanted to add my 2 cents...
I completely agree with the idea that if I view my hp management as a competitive advantage and/or skill that sets me apart from my competitors then it totally makes sense for me to be against a roster slot sale.  For those that want to go the economics route...I'll avoid the details and point you to game theory concepts where I am relatively better off vs others even when we collectively are worse off.  This game is a competition, so in this scenario I believe i "win" by not having the sale.
Coincidentally, I feel one of my edges is my patience to wait for things like roster slot sales and then go all in, so I haven't paid full price on a slot in years.