Grand Experiment 2: Treading Water in the SCL 10 Post-Shardpocalypse

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  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Ok I'm confused about your end goal now.
    I thought it was to keep champing latest as you go.
    Now you're talking about pushing your 4s above 320, to generate enough pulls to... Keep up with latest.
    Which... You could do by pulling new 5s from Latest with your CP instead of spending on classics.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,206 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023
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    The treadmill has no "end" goal, just ways to keep your mind occupied to stop thinking about that stitch in your side. The original goal was to figure out if pulling exclusively from classic could let you keep pace. I think that's been pretty definitively proven at this point, quite awhile ago in fact. then it evolved into "how do i go about champing them all?" and I was working backward to get all the old 5s fully covered.

    Now that that is done, I'm curious what a roster needs to look like to be able to burn CP into Classic for a (relatively) high volume of completely RNG-based rewards that ought to equate to a reasonably even overall roster shape, and if that will output enough targeted shards + LTs to both stay current while growing my general roster average level in the background. Or if it won't, and I'll need to go back to just prioritizing all resources into latest until the three are covered.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Ok, you lost me somewhere in those 51 pages haha.
    Thanks for the tl;dr

  • Sekilicious
    Sekilicious Posts: 1,766 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023
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    @ThaRoadWarrior said:
    You only get 2 from the boss events if you are in an active alliance. I only got one from it, as I have from every boss event since our alliance has only hit alliance completion once ever under the old reward structure.

    I also think that 25 pulls/cover math is a bit optimistic, but I stopped tracking pulls awhile back so I couldn’t give you metrics to say otherwise definitively.

    I absolutely got a huge jumpstart from the retro feeders, and the at-launch feeders similarly have made a huge difference. That’s why I say Wong will be the real test since Abomination is also a new release.

    I will happily test if I can do it when Wong rotates in, though it will be the three after Wong that are the most vulnerable. I have all but a couple of meta characters champed anyways. I can probably live without mid-tier characters like Crystal, PX, Onslaught or Elektra being champed for the time being. I will change my mind if iHulk and Wanda end up in the same cp store before then though. Or if a trio equivalent to Kamala, mThor, and Chasm get released.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,045 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @Bowgentle said:
    Ok I'm confused about your end goal now.
    I thought it was to keep champing latest as you go.
    Now you're talking about pushing your 4s above 320, to generate enough pulls to... Keep up with latest.
    Which... You could do by pulling new 5s from Latest with your CP instead of spending on classics.

    You weren't here for the part where some idiot screamed at everyone for months about how classic tokens weren't bad or dumb and having high level old guys and an even roster was good in a post-boost world.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @ThaRoadWarrior said:

    Now that that is done, I'm curious what a roster needs to look like to be able to burn CP into Classic for a (relatively) high volume of completely RNG-based rewards that ought to equate to a reasonably even overall roster shape, and if that will output enough targeted shards + LTs to both stay current while growing my general roster average level in the background.

    You can try and fight RNG god and come with conclusions.
    However it's a totally subjective matter as depends on if you have the capability to grow up the roster through years and more importantly if you value those 20% bonus rewards more than making playable the latest characters.
    Personally, of course, I value the second option the most.
    There are really good characters there, specially mthor and riri, also the Infamous One, for to have or had them bigger than others.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,045 Chairperson of the Boards
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    But Jane and Chasm are both in Classics...

  • Sekilicious
    Sekilicious Posts: 1,766 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Bad was likely using them as an example and it got lost in translation a bit. Or will be very disappointed when he finds out that character he has been calling Thor is actually Arcade.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,206 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I took it that the point being made there was that just being all in on Latest always will get you a bigger set of "new" characters. However it does seem like Broken Circle are placing value on more of a living game where older characters get refreshed publicly or secretly, so to me it still feels "right" to have a fairly even growth rate for my whole roster rather than ensuring that older characters will definitely stay underwhelming by being both old and low level forever.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Let's hope their buffs will be more on the Surfer side than on the Iron man side.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2023
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    Usually they are on iron man team, it's understable.
    Gambit, iron man, cap america should be expected.
    SS and the hulk not.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,206 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @Bowgentle said:
    Let's hope their buffs will be more on the Surfer side than on the Iron man side.

    We can further hope that if they are "not good enough" that there is a possibility they'll just get adjusted again until they take.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @ThaRoadWarrior said:

    @Bowgentle said:
    Let's hope their buffs will be more on the Surfer side than on the Iron man side.

    We can further hope that if they are "not good enough" that there is a possibility they'll just get adjusted again until they take.

    Maybe after their initial pass, yeah.
    One would hope they'll iterate.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,045 Chairperson of the Boards
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    That's sort of what I hoped would happen for years, because I always thought it made sense to do things that way. I never really gave up that hope even though over the years, it became clear that it was probably silly.

    Anyway the point I was making (badly) was that if you want high level characters your only options are unhoard a ton into latest, spend a ton into latest, or pull classics over a very long period of time. The 3rd route is one that very few people choose to take but it's viable if you're patient.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,206 Chairperson of the Boards
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    it's defnitely how it is handled in things like fighting games, but their monetization model is much different than this, being based on people collecting little fragments of characters over very long periods of time.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
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    After all the time they are taking in order to rebalance the older characters just one time, I wouldn't expect they rebalance a rebalanced character who is not performing well.
    At least on the present century.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,206 Chairperson of the Boards
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    well, Old Dev Team for sure i'd agree with that. New Dev Team has already un-nerfed a couple characters that had been adjusted so far down they were basically dead, namely XFW and Wolverine. So I wouldn't say it's totally off the table personally, but i'm also not like holding my breath for it.

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
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    When they say they have the capacity for 3 rebalances per month I assume that's on top of daily business.
    So I assume once they're done with their first round through the whole roster, those 3 will go to the second round.
    Yes, extremely long term, if they include 4s, but... Possible.

  • Punter1
    Punter1 Posts: 725 Critical Contributor
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    @Punter1 said:
    I copied you and rostered all the 1*s after seeing your comment from Dec 7. Also figured I would have them done easily! Of those I didn't have already, Storm, Hawkeye and Venom finished, the latter just today. Spidey at 8 covers and Yelena just 3.

    3* Monkey already at 4/4/2 thanks to fave shards and boosted pull %

    Well took almost 2 months, but now got a 5/5 Yelena, so have as complete a roster as I have ever had.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,045 Chairperson of the Boards
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    @ThaRoadWarrior said:
    it's defnitely how it is handled in things like fighting games, but their monetization model is much different than this, being based on people collecting little fragments of characters over very long periods of time.

    So, I feel like I've ranted this everywhere before, but their monetization model is (and has been, since day 1) roster slots. That's the reason token dilution hasn't been fixed -- more dilution means lower tier players buy more slots. That's why the new release cadence is what it is, and will always be what it is. Very few players buy tokens or covers but a very very large group spends small amounts of money on roster slots.

    That's why it always made sense to me to buff the old guys. If some characters are way worse than others, players won't be as incentivized to buy slots for them.