Direction of this game

wereotter

The problem becomes, at least for me, is that every event being PvP these days means that you basically face off to the same deck over and over.... regardless of what secondary objectives an event pots out.

I can't even bring myself to do Training Grounds even most days because I'm so sick of always playing against Tamiyo and Sarkhan. PvE events you might say also are pretty dull because the events never change... but at least it's 6-9 different decks that never change compared to every training grounds match being a copy past of the same deck.

Also over the years I've never been able to trust other players of this game to not make decks that are just there to troll opponents. That does not make for a fun game, and is the number one reason I've hated PvP events.

I say all this because it's interesting that most if not all the other posts are all vying for more PvP events that just have different objectives or no special nodes, but for me, that won't fix the primary problem which has been other players of the game.

Bil

I agree with everything in the OP, and i have been feeling like this since a while now.

I'm fine with being casual and swap a bunch of gems here and there, but the thrill and the trust are definitely gone for now.

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jtwood

wereotter said:

The problem becomes, at least for me, is that every event being PvP these days means that you basically face off to the same deck over and over.... regardless of what secondary objectives an event pots out.

I can't even bring myself to do Training Grounds even most days because I'm so sick of always playing against Tamiyo and Sarkhan. PvE events you might say also are pretty dull because the events never change... but at least it's 6-9 different decks that never change compared to every training grounds match being a copy past of the same deck.

I hate to say it, but I don't ever see this changing. It's an aspect of paper Magic, it's here, too, and I think the only way it's ever different is if there's a "limited" version of the game like paper drafts. It's just natural for power to coalesce over time. This is even true outside of Magic, as well. Natural order/human nature sort of thing.

Maybe they should rando-ban things from time to time.

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tiagotomar

Machine said:

Hi @Brigby,
I finally have some time to write this post. I have been wanting to write it this weekend, but this new event has eaten a lot of my time. Other players haven beaten me to it, but still  I would like to discuss the direction this game is seemingly taking. There are several topics that need attention.
1) Duration of events. The Great Tournament is yet another 5 node coalition event that runs for three full days. The community has given feedback regarding duration of events over and over and again, this was ignored by the developers of this event. Most players have a hard time completing their nodes during Mondays as they have to work. I even had a team mate who announced he would quit after he found out that TGT also takes three full days (in combination with the horrible rewards *see 2)) Pair this with The Elderspark running next weekend, haunting players with back to back 3 days weekend events. Is this the new standard? If not, why did the developers choose for this setup?
2) Rewards. Self-explanatory if you look at the individual rewards for TGT. Why are the rewards so laughable for a THREE day event? With the slower format, a five node event takes A LOT of time. This investment should be returned / rewarded or players will lose motivation to play. Just playing for the sake of the team is not proper motivation. Topic 1) and 2) should be in balance or it will hurt the sustainability of the game. Can you explain why these improper individual rewards have been maintained, even after all the player feedback from the last event with the same reward structure (I think it is Ravnica at War)? Don't forget that a lot of players have families, kids, friends and other social activities 
3) In what way is the VIP system affecting the decisions that are made when designing new events? Right now, it seems to me (I'm only speaking for myself now) that this game is heading to a pay 2 win direction. Can you give a statement on that?
I honestly believe that this game has a lot of potential, but as you can see on the other two* posts that have been created regarding the new event and its rewards, you see that the player base is engaged, but also concerned. I hope this post also reflects my concern. People should be rewarded for their effort. This is more like a punishment.
* these two posts are what I'm talking about:
https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/80618/tgt-feedback#latest
https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/80597/the-great-tournament-rewards#latest
I hoped that the new set and the new event would rejuvinate players but you seem to have reached the opposite. It's a shame that players quit the game over the poor design and reward decisions made, even though the community has given ample feedback.
Note that I haven't touched the topic of bugs, because a lot of players in my team, including myself, have encountered the same bug that soft lock the game when activated gems that change gems to other colors / loyalty gems freezes the game. This has also been reported in the bug section of this forum. It is severe enough to patch this game asap.
I'm looking forward to your response. Thanks in advance.
Cheers!

Hello there Machine!

I agree with everything you said, why not open a poll to know who agrees with only a two days event Saturday and Sunday and with only have 3 nodes!?

You have my vote!!!

bk1234

starfall said:

madwren said:

starfall said:

Kinesia said:

One thing that hasn't been mentioned that I noticed in the Grand Tournament is that the special nodes HELPED meet the objectives and do both objectives together on some nodes.

e.g. Create food and gain life. The objectives already go together naturally and the special node gave you mana whenever you created food, speeding up what might otherwise be a slower deck.

That node in particular tho is very slow, partly because of the extra streamers that appear on the screen whenever a player plays food and loses 2 life (loses 2 life! what a meagre effect to have such an impact on speed of play!), and partly because of the lag caused by having multiple food in play.

Food is my least favorite mechanic in some time... There's nothing wrong with it in theory, but in practice it combines the worst aspects of Fabricate (lag and slow play) and Energize (small number of playable cards exist with the keyword)

The "we want you to play food, but will do 2 damage to you" is a really odd decision. If you want to show off your new mechanic, why diminish the effect by making each food (in effect) give 1 life?

Mind you, the pointless complexity on this node is nothing compared to the node effects in the Fblthp event!!

But node effects are so cool, aren’t they??? 

Isn’t that why they’re in every single event?

Every one. 

#NoEventLeftBehind

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bk1234

starfall said:

bken1234 said:

starfall said:

madwren said:

starfall said:

Kinesia said:

One thing that hasn't been mentioned that I noticed in the Grand Tournament is that the special nodes HELPED meet the objectives and do both objectives together on some nodes.

e.g. Create food and gain life. The objectives already go together naturally and the special node gave you mana whenever you created food, speeding up what might otherwise be a slower deck.

That node in particular tho is very slow, partly because of the extra streamers that appear on the screen whenever a player plays food and loses 2 life (loses 2 life! what a meagre effect to have such an impact on speed of play!), and partly because of the lag caused by having multiple food in play.

Food is my least favorite mechanic in some time... There's nothing wrong with it in theory, but in practice it combines the worst aspects of Fabricate (lag and slow play) and Energize (small number of playable cards exist with the keyword)

The "we want you to play food, but will do 2 damage to you" is a really odd decision. If you want to show off your new mechanic, why diminish the effect by making each food (in effect) give 1 life?

Mind you, the pointless complexity on this node is nothing compared to the node effects in the Fblthp event!!

But node effects are so cool, aren’t they??? 

Isn’t that why they’re in every single event?

Every one. 

#NoEventLeftBehind

Well then for goodness sake let's start a poll here and get them stripped out of the game! If nobody likes them, and they take time to code, removing them from the game would be a win win.

Done https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/80709/special-supports#latest

Nalthazar

I like the general direction of the design of the events and the cards. I don't like the direction of the rewards for the more time consuming events. 

I like that with standard rotations and with how the cards have been designed, it feels like there is a lot of balance in the game in standard. I am going to ignore legacy for this conversation. As there is a heavier emphasis on standard in this game, I am going to focus on that. There are a lot of cards that have been coming out that feel very powerful and there has been a lot of synergy between cards that have come out lately that makes me want to play with them and try out different deck ideas. Ultimately that is what I want from the cards. I want them to feel powerful and I want to feel compelled to use different cards for different things. It keeps me excited to get new cards and play with them when I get them.

With the events, I feel that the objectives incentivize me to use newer cards that I wouldn't necessarily use day-to-day because they aren't quite as strong as some of the other meta decks I have come up with. It keeps the game fresh for me to play with a larger array of cards and attempt to complete objectives that require me to think more about how I am playing than to just pop out the biggest baddy or combo that I can and win a match in 2 minutes or less. It makes me want to chase a larger variety of cards too. I actually like the permanent support idea too when it is implemented in a way that compliments the nodes. For example: if there were permanent supports in the War of the Spark events that made it so that Partner or Proliferate cards did something else that was very powerful or cool, then I would actually have more of a reason to use those cards in those events apart from just the objectives and I would look forward to the periodic dynamic gameplay that those interactions would create. For example if a permanent support from a node that required partner made it so that I would fetch the next vanguard from my deck every time I played a card with partner and gave it half/full mana, or if a Proliferate card play gave all of my Vanguards 5 loyalty or reinforced my creatures, I would be totally into that. When they first started implementing the permanent supports, my favorite event and favorite node in the game became the one where there was a permanent support that made it so that Lannery Storm's ability was permanently active with treasures. I thoroughly enjoyed stacking the support with Lannery herself and getting hugely powerful pirates. I was always excited to play that event and that node.

With all of that being said, I don't actually play any of the War of the Spark coalition events anymore unless I am making a video on them to help other players who want to play in them earn perfect scores. I don't personally feel that the value from the rewards from those events are worth the time investment. I would rather just play my daily events throughout the week and the other events that they have going on at the same time as the Coalition events to earn my rewards. Much less time for greater rewards and it still keeps me logging in every day. With how the new Eldraine rewards appear to be, I doubt that I will play any of the Coalition Eldraine events past the first running of them either. They take a lot of time and even if I did play in each of the runnings of the event, I would still probably need to play each one of them all the way until the next set releases to earn enough pinkies from just playing those events to open one elite pack, or to buy one vanguard from FBLTHP. Why do that? 

I think that for changes going forward, we probably don't need super drastic sweeping changes, but a few simple changes. There still needs to be an incentive to buy things in the game. With a game that produces the amount of new content that this one does without having a cost attached to big updates, players need to spend money to keep the updates coming and the game running. I think that progression rewards should roughly mirror the M20 PvE event progression rewards in Platinum. Include some yellow Mana Crystals in the progression. Somewhere between 60-100. Throw in more pink Mana Jewels. Somewhere in the 40-60 range. The rewards for Coalition success are probably fine honestly. Even with just that, players will feel more compelled to play the Coalition events. Ultimately it is the existence of Coalitions that keeps this game running. Having other people to talk with and play with and share excitement and to commiserate with is what keeps players logging in and playing even if they are ready for a break. If players lose the incentive to play in Coalition events, it will take away from that community and then players will find it easier to walk away from the game. I know a lot of players in my Coalition to stayed playing for months or even a year longer than they would have otherwise because they loved the community of a group and they were afraid that leaving the game would lose them the community we built.

Furthermore on the reward front, I think that the reward structure of events should change in PvP too. Rewards should be based on the number of points you score, not your place in the event. It is too easy to earn a perfect score in most of the events based on how the game is set up to make the 1-5 brackets work at higher levels. There should be a reward for earning a perfect score, and that reward should mirror the current rewards for perfection (minus War of the Spark and Eldraine rewards). Then there should be a range from lost one objective to lost x number of objectives for the second tier, and so on and so forth. Those rewards would mirror the current rewards for the existing brackets (minus War of the Spark and Eldraine rewards). I play in all too many events where there is no 6-25 bracket because of how many perfect scores there are. I've even had events run that didn't have the 26-50 brackets or the 50-100 brackets because of this.

Additionally it would be cool if there was an achievement system in the game that unlocked simple cosmetics. It could be a portrait that went around your Planeswalker image (think diablo 3), more full art cards, or titles that would appear to other players. They could be unlocked by your Coalition earning a certain place in an event or a certain number of points, or even simple ones like full participation. For earning perfection in events you could earn the portraits, titles, or full art cards. Things that wouldn't make the rich richer exactly, but things that would make them feel like their efforts still earned them something they could show off. Reward participation and more players will participate I think.

Anywho, that is my 2 cents. Sorry that was so long.

Boogeyman

Nalthazar said:

Anywho, that is my 2 cents. Sorry that was so long.

That wasn't 2 cents, that was a dollar

Nalthazar

Boogeyman said:

Nalthazar said:

Anywho, that is my 2 cents. Sorry that was so long.

That wasn't 2 cents, that was a dollar

I valued myself at 2 cents. You value me at a dollar. I'm coming up in the world!

Rasalghul

Playing this game starts to be like playing Chess with the white but after a few moves you end up N steps behind not knowing why.

Please don’t try to transform this game into the 21st century classic.

Theros

It has been around 3 months since I stopped playing. I just couldn't keep up with the grind. The time commitment the games requires is no longer doable for me, it doesn't matter how low or good the rewards are. When you start taking breaks from dumb events or the game, it becomes increasingly difficult to come back.

The first straw that broke the camels back was the duration of the events into Mondays. I can no longer go through the trouble to clears them nodes on Monday  when there is work and what have you.

Weekends are supposedly days when most people get to rest or get some free time to do whatever. Is MTGPQ deserving much of that time on weekends? It could be due to age but I can no longer afford much of my free time to orbit around this game.

On top of being unreasonably grindy, we are bombarded with absurd objectives that require us to dumbdown our decks causing longer games. Is this Octagon's philosophy of challenge and deck building skills? They can be more creative than that.

The bugs and freezes are thing we had to bear with for years.

I'm grateful for our community on slack and I'm still around but not in game. I will return when things improve

Just my 2 cents

Kinesia

Those in America talking about events bleeding into Monday...
In Australia we have ALWAYS faced that but no-one has ever listened.

_Now_ our events end on early Tuesday morning, meaning we need to not sleep properly on a work/school day just to finish.

Time HAS to become less important. Solutions have been floated forever, why hasn't anything been done before now? Why are things _worse_?
Start events half a day earlier (So they start friday night for Australia for example), have huge amounts of max charges and stop generating charges at least 12 hours before event end.
That makes things workable for every single person in the world and is theoretically pretty easy to code, the only thing that isn't possible in the current system is skipping the last node and that's a single if/then statement somewhere.

With the worldwide audience there is zero excuse for not making allowances for this AGES ago.

FindingHeart8

Kinesia said:

Those in America talking about events bleeding into Monday...
In Australia we have ALWAYS faced that but no-one has ever listened.

_Now_ our events end on early Tuesday morning, meaning we need to not sleep properly on a work/school day just to finish.

Time HAS to become less important. Solutions have been floated forever, why hasn't anything been done before now? Why are things _worse_?
Start events half a day earlier (So they start friday night for Australia for example), have huge amounts of max charges and stop generating charges at least 12 hours before event end.
That makes things workable for every single person in the world and is theoretically pretty easy to code, the only thing that isn't possible in the current system is skipping the last node and that's a single if/then statement somewhere.

With the worldwide audience there is zero excuse for not making allowances for this AGES ago.

Unfortunately I'm not sure if they're going to make any drastic changes at this point.  Everything that didn't already have a template, likely has a template now so probably just mild tweaks here and there from this point forward.