Is it time to do a purge of inactive coalitions?

span_argoman

Why not have a separate ranking based on how many points the coalitions scored for the past 30 days? Also restrict the random search to coalitions which have at least scored one point in the past 30 days to avoid dead coalitions. I think 30 days is a long enough window to determine whether an entire coalition is inactive.

Also there should be an option for players to takeover inactive leaders. Although a leader can designate someone to take over them, I believe there isn't any avenue if the coalition leader disappears. Perhaps there could be an option where if the coalition leader is inactive for 21 days, the coalition members can apply to be the coalition leader and the player with the highest coalition score gets the post 24 hours after the first application.

I agree that dead coalitions are probably like clutter in a room. They obscure active coalitions and players from finding each other unless additional tools are employed or a lot of effort is put in.

FindingHeart8

Gunmix25 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

bken1234 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

I see what you're saying in that there's a lot of clutter (aka the rubble of dead coalitions scattered across the land) but I'm not sure if that qualifies as a broken system.

If I was a new player, not trying to start my own coalition, and looking to join another...I would try to find the highest level coalition that has an open spot.  Perhaps if players could scroll through all the lists, see which ones have openings, and when players last logged into the coalition, perhaps that would solve the problem.

A dead coalition is going to sink to the bottom of the ranks, so new players should be able to catch on pretty quickly that if they don't want to join a dead coalition, to seek a higher ranking coalition.  This should be an intrinsic pursuit, as you don't play this game to intentionally have a low score lol.

I adding making the leaderboard scrollable -- however it still creates the problem of having to pick and choose. Also I know for a fact there are several top 100 alltime coalitions that are completely abandoned. So should a player hop into one of those and have to spend 2 weeks playing to figure out no one else is there? Or should active coalitions at rank 105 not get top 100 designation because completely dead teams are cluttering up the leader board?

Again though, I don't think that'll be an issue for long.  An inactive coalition will not be increasing its score, while all the active coalitions will be catching up and surpassing it.  It'll sink to the bottom and be forgotten with all the other dead coalitions.

An inactive coalition won't be participating in events, so a rank 105 not being in the top 100 would only lose out on bragging rights, and only temporarily.

Going beyond that though, purging would just be a temporary solution.  Players can still make and abandon coalitions.  We would, eventually, get back to where we are here.

I guess a better question is this. If you've a room full of clutter... do you simply keep adding to it and call it controlled chaos because you know how to look for something within it? Is it okay for someone who has no clue of the disorganized manner in which everything is placed and technically being reallocated (as various new coalitions die off or fresher ones gain rank) to find what they are looking for, just because it's better to leave alone? I personally don't think that is a good idea

The whole visual about tagging an active coalition without any actual narrowing perimeters is similar to painting a few leaves pink in a huge pile of leaves. In order to find them you've got to put in a little effort to toss about some unpainted leaves ( the dead coalitions) in order to find the live ones. And then hope they have room. 

Any game needs a maintenance clearing. In Mobsters the Devs put out a notice over 30 days. You saw it when you logged in, you saw it randomly when you switched between screens. The message simply stated that clan leaders were required to turn on the new "active" button. Which lasted 3 months. In which it needed to be reactivated sometime during the 4th month. We had been told to contact them if say a leader quit without transferring power to avoid the clan from being removed from the system in the 5th month. It worked beautifully and allowed new players to see only active clans upon starting the game. 

Mtgpq needs a bit of clean up. Personally I expected something like this to have happened ages ago. As long as D3 and okatagon implement safety protocols that buy players some time to ensure their coalition is still alive and well... the whole process has my blessing.

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

James13

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

I don't see why simply remaking one would be a big ask?  You could even name it the same since it wouldn't exist anymore.  In the scenario where it was removed due to inactivity there's no active player in it anymore anyway...  So you wouldn't be reconnecting with anyone by becoming the only warm body in the dead coalition.

FindingHeart8

James13 said:

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

I don't see why simply remaking one would be a big ask?  You could even name it the same since it wouldn't exist anymore.  In the scenario where it was removed due to inactivity there's no active player in it anymore anyway...  So you wouldn't be reconnecting with anyone by becoming the only warm body in the dead coalition.

Yeah...I'm coming around to seeing where you guys are coming from the more we discuss this.

I had originally come to mtgpq with friends I knew in real life and I started a coalition that we all joined, but yeah if you don't keep in contact with with your crew outside of mtgpq then rejoining a dead coalition (unless you're the leader and can boot all the inactives) is kinda pointless.

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

bk1234

FindingHeart8 said:

James13 said:

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

I don't see why simply remaking one would be a big ask?  You could even name it the same since it wouldn't exist anymore.  In the scenario where it was removed due to inactivity there's no active player in it anymore anyway...  So you wouldn't be reconnecting with anyone by becoming the only warm body in the dead coalition.

Yeah...I'm coming around to seeing where you guys are coming from the more we discuss this.

I had originally come to mtgpq with friends I knew in real life and I started a coalition that we all joined, but yeah if you don't keep in contact with with your crew outside of mtgpq then rejoining a dead coalition (unless you're the leader and can boot all the inactives) is kinda pointless.

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

If it were me, I would be more unhappy if I returned to a dead coalition and couldn't find an active one. 

Coalitions prizes are really important, especially to new players who don't have standard cards. Lots of boosters and stuff to be earned. 

Brigby

I'm certainly no developer, so I'll be frank in admitting I have no clue if it works this way, but it'd be a pleasant surprise if removing inactive coalitions also causes the game to perform search functions much quicker, since the database no longer needs to retain information on old coalitions.

FindingHeart8

bken1234 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

James13 said:

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

I don't see why simply remaking one would be a big ask?  You could even name it the same since it wouldn't exist anymore.  In the scenario where it was removed due to inactivity there's no active player in it anymore anyway...  So you wouldn't be reconnecting with anyone by becoming the only warm body in the dead coalition.

Yeah...I'm coming around to seeing where you guys are coming from the more we discuss this.

I had originally come to mtgpq with friends I knew in real life and I started a coalition that we all joined, but yeah if you don't keep in contact with with your crew outside of mtgpq then rejoining a dead coalition (unless you're the leader and can boot all the inactives) is kinda pointless.

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

If it were me, I would be more unhappy if I returned to a dead coalition and couldn't find an active one. 

Coalitions prizes are really important, especially to new players who don't have standard cards. Lots of boosters and stuff to be earned. 

Is it really that difficult to find an active coalition?

I'm not saying this as a challenge, I'm just curious.

Gunmix25

FindingHeart8 said:

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

I can too but to be honest, how is this any different from say a live coalition situation?

-Leaves without saying anything or goes inactive

-Comes back months later and find that they can't use any of their cards

-Their coalition kicked them out for in-activity.

-"Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else"

Virtually the same scenario exists.

I guess the question boils down to the lesser of two evils. @brigby made a good point though about cleaning up the data to speed things up... 'cause well I certainly don't want my coalition searches to be like H2 receiving loyalty from a 55 stack of tokens.

"Hmmm I wanna join a Coalition..." *hits search*

45 minutes later the circle is still spinning compiling a list.

"Did the game freeze or what???"

bk1234

FindingHeart8 said:

bken1234 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

James13 said:

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

I don't see why simply remaking one would be a big ask?  You could even name it the same since it wouldn't exist anymore.  In the scenario where it was removed due to inactivity there's no active player in it anymore anyway...  So you wouldn't be reconnecting with anyone by becoming the only warm body in the dead coalition.

Yeah...I'm coming around to seeing where you guys are coming from the more we discuss this.

I had originally come to mtgpq with friends I knew in real life and I started a coalition that we all joined, but yeah if you don't keep in contact with with your crew outside of mtgpq then rejoining a dead coalition (unless you're the leader and can boot all the inactives) is kinda pointless.

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

If it were me, I would be more unhappy if I returned to a dead coalition and couldn't find an active one. 

Coalitions prizes are really important, especially to new players who don't have standard cards. Lots of boosters and stuff to be earned. 

Is it really that difficult to find an active coalition?

I'm not saying this as a challenge, I'm just curious.

I believe I have thoroughly answered this in my pervious posts — with test data on both the coalition side and the player side. If you don’t believe me; I challenge you to make an alt and try for yourself. 

FindingHeart8

bken1234 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

bken1234 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

James13 said:

I don't like the idea of a timer being attached to anything, but overall I do get what you're saying.

I'd still argue though that, as stated by many players past, coalitions are one of the foundations that keeps bringing people back to mtgpq.  Returning players should be able to necro their coalition.  It's bad enough 90% of their cards are going to be obsolete for standard, we don't need to alienate them further.

A good compromise would be an active button that if you don't click within a time period, then your coalition is removed from the search engine entirely and stays that way until the active button is clicked.  This would remove any inconvenience of dead coalitions to new or searching players.

I don't see why simply remaking one would be a big ask?  You could even name it the same since it wouldn't exist anymore.  In the scenario where it was removed due to inactivity there's no active player in it anymore anyway...  So you wouldn't be reconnecting with anyone by becoming the only warm body in the dead coalition.

Yeah...I'm coming around to seeing where you guys are coming from the more we discuss this.

I had originally come to mtgpq with friends I knew in real life and I started a coalition that we all joined, but yeah if you don't keep in contact with with your crew outside of mtgpq then rejoining a dead coalition (unless you're the leader and can boot all the inactives) is kinda pointless.

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

If it were me, I would be more unhappy if I returned to a dead coalition and couldn't find an active one. 

Coalitions prizes are really important, especially to new players who don't have standard cards. Lots of boosters and stuff to be earned. 

Is it really that difficult to find an active coalition?

I'm not saying this as a challenge, I'm just curious.

I believe I have thoroughly answered this in my pervious posts — with test data on both the coalition side and the player side. If you don’t believe me; I challenge you to make an alt and try for yourself. 

err...I think you missed the "I'm not saying this as a challenge, I'm just curious," part of my post

I'll pass on the secondary account, I hardly have enough time to keep up with the events with my current.  I'll get feedback from my friends who just started playing though.

FindingHeart8

Gunmix25 said:

FindingHeart8 said:

Still, could see returning players being like "Wait...I can't use any of my cards in events now and I got booted from my coalition??  Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else."

I can too but to be honest, how is this any different from say a live coalition situation?

-Leaves without saying anything or goes inactive

-Comes back months later and find that they can't use any of their cards

-Their coalition kicked them out for in-activity.

-"Tinykitty this game I'm gonna play something else"

Virtually the same scenario exists.

I guess the question boils down to the lesser of two evils. @brigby made a good point though about cleaning up the data to speed things up... 'cause well I certainly don't want my coalition searches to be like H2 receiving loyalty from a 55 stack of tokens.

"Hmmm I wanna join a Coalition..." *hits search*

45 minutes later the circle is still spinning compiling a list.

"Did the game freeze or what???"

Holy tinykitty it really takes that long to search?  What is this dial-up??

I haven't done a search in a while, but I don't remember it taking that long.  However, if it really is that bad I could certainly see more motivation for bken1234's purge.

MTG_Mage

I can see if there was a purge it would alienate, confuse and anger a lot of players.

Instead how about a seasonal coalition score which would reset at each new set release.
So every every 3 months all seasonal coalition scores reset to zero and competition will be intense.

Overall scores would still be tallied and that ranking would still exist, but only the seasonal score will matter for events and prizing. 

The search function will only search coalitions active since the start of the season.

Blazer

I left the game for about 3 months during Amonket and I was in a top 50 coalition and didn't think I would return so I don't even remember the name of that one, but came back and have been happy. It took me all of 20min to find 4 other top 500-100 coalitions when I came back and am currently in a top 100 casual one (sometimes top 50 when we all play). The problem we're having is finding new players who actually play and not just join and do nothing.

bk1234

Blazer said:

I left the game for about 3 months during Amonket and I was in a top 50 coalition and didn't think I would return so I don't even remember the name of that one, but came back and have been happy. It took me all of 20min to find 4 other top 500-100 coalitions when I came back and am currently in a top 100 casual one (sometimes top 50 when we all play). The problem we're having is finding new players who actually play and not just join and do nothing.

But you came back a little less than a year ago? It was easy to find an active team then. Even 6 months ago it was easier. 

Blazer

bken1234 said:

Blazer said:

I left the game for about 3 months during Amonket and I was in a top 50 coalition and didn't think I would return so I don't even remember the name of that one, but came back and have been happy. It took me all of 20min to find 4 other top 500-100 coalitions when I came back and am currently in a top 100 casual one (sometimes top 50 when we all play). The problem we're having is finding new players who actually play and not just join and do nothing.

But you came back a little less than a year ago? It was easy to find an active team then. Even 6 months ago it was easier. 

Actually I've only been in my current coalition for 4 months, I was in a 20,000th something when I came back with only 4 members until I was able to get a decent standard set of cards to compete at a high level again and didn't play as much during HOU. If it is really as bad as your saying in the last 4 months imagine what it might be like in 4 more, yikes. Added search features seems like a easy fix though (e.g. only see top 500 coalitions, only coalitions active in past month, only ones with one spot open...) 

James13

MTG_Mage said:

I can see if there was a purge it would alienate, confuse and anger a lot of players.

Instead how about a seasonal coalition score which would reset at each new set release.
So every every 3 months all seasonal coalition scores reset to zero and competition will be intense.

Overall scores would still be tallied and that ranking would still exist, but only the seasonal score will matter for events and prizing. 

The search function will only search coalitions active since the start of the season.

Why do you think that would be?  Anyone who actually plays the game within the last, say, 3 months, would be fully unaffected?  And would only even see anything has happened when looking for a different coalition.

I'm genuinely puzzled why it would anger anyone to wipe long time inactive coalitions from the database.  Note, this is NOT players.  The ghost town of abandoned coalitions.  Inactive accounts would still be there, inactive.

ManiiNames

We advertised on reddit, brand new coalition filled within two days.  Scored a 23rd last weekend in our first attempt.  Without reddit, IDK.  In game search is poor.

span_argoman

ManiiNames said:

We advertised on reddit, brand new coalition filled within two days.  Scored a 23rd last weekend in our first attempt.  Without reddit, IDK.  In game search is poor.

Yeah, I think we can mostly agree that the in-game search is lacking. Which is why we're trying to come up with ideas on how to improve the in-game coalition search function so that people don't have to go to an external tool like Reddit or the official forums to find active coalitions/players.

It's like having to come to the official forums to find an opponent before being able to play a PvP match in-game or risk having multiple invalid matchups.

MTG_Mage

Since you can make a coalition of one just for yourself, they should at least purge all 1 person coalitions since you can just remake it with the push of a button. This would clear out what I would guess would be most coalitions and that should really help the search function. Just do an in game announcement first.

joerginger

Why should 1-person coalitions be purged? This thread is about purging inactive coalitions, not ones with only one member.