Gambit sell back price: Looking at the true value

Warbringa

Spudgutter said:

So, just to clarify;

You have been around long enough to see strong, ubiquitous characters nerfed over the years, some with little to no compensation. 

You were also around to witness the buy back rate for OML, who had a similar store, and similar arguments were made about the value of the store.  

Then, when you saw a strong character coming inbound, with all that previous knowledge, decide to work, play and spend hard to get him to a level that 99% of the playerbase cannot even fathom.

You then precede to take advantage of this great and all powerful character to maintain your position through more and more rewards, both from the champ levels of said character as well as the placement rewards, for months on end.  

And when the character was finally nerfed, and compensation is offered, not only do you disregard past knowledge of previous offerings, you post about it, and argue against the logic put forward by other users.

Is that a good recap, or did i leave anything out, like maybe calling out the the guy who marked your post as spam, instead of just sending him a PM?

I think there is middle ground in this debate.  

They did hit him with the nerf stick too hard.  They could have made him a decent 5* along with JJ, Okoye, Thor, etc with not quite all the downgrades on him where he is now maybe mid tier at best. 

To criticize someone for going for a good character is also asinine since that is a major part of why most people play the game, to get a better roster and win.  To be displeased by a nerf that impacts one's roster disproportionately compared to others is expected.

For the OP, yeah the deal is not great with dilution but it is take it or leave it.  The devs just don't know how to nerf properly or don't care do so (for various motivations).  It is a risk of the game, buyer's remorse.  As Spudgutter pointed out you did benefit tremendously from Gambit while he was an MPQ god so it is fair to view the sell back rate as taking that in mind.  The only thing that you can do to show your displeasure in a meaningful way is to not spend money on the game.  That decision is up to you though.

Spudgutter

Warbringa said:

Spudgutter said:

So, just to clarify;

You have been around long enough to see strong, ubiquitous characters nerfed over the years, some with little to no compensation. 

You were also around to witness the buy back rate for OML, who had a similar store, and similar arguments were made about the value of the store.  

Then, when you saw a strong character coming inbound, with all that previous knowledge, decide to work, play and spend hard to get him to a level that 99% of the playerbase cannot even fathom.

You then precede to take advantage of this great and all powerful character to maintain your position through more and more rewards, both from the champ levels of said character as well as the placement rewards, for months on end.  

And when the character was finally nerfed, and compensation is offered, not only do you disregard past knowledge of previous offerings, you post about it, and argue against the logic put forward by other users.

Is that a good recap, or did i leave anything out, like maybe calling out the the guy who marked your post as spam, instead of just sending him a PM?

I think there is middle ground in this debate.  

They did hit him with the nerf stick too hard.  They could have made him a decent 5* along with JJ, Okoye, Thor, etc with not quite all the downgrades on him where he is now maybe mid tier at best. 

To criticize someone for going for a good character is also asinine since that is a major part of why most people play the game, to get a better roster and win.  To be displeased by a nerf that impacts one's roster disproportionately compared to others is expected.

For the OP, yeah the deal is not great with dilution but it is take it or leave it.  The devs just don't know how to nerf properly or don't care do so (for various motivations).  It is a risk of the game, buyer's remorse.  As Spudgutter pointed out you did benefit tremendously from Gambit while he was an MPQ god so it is fair to view the sell back rate as taking that in mind.  The only thing that you can do to show your displeasure in a meaningful way is to not spend money on the game.  That decision is up to you though.

I agree about the nerf being overboard.  That wasnt the point of my post or this thread.  

I never criticized him for going after a strong character. Heck, i am chasing strong characters myself.  I'm just pointing out that we should not be surprised when they get nerfed.  That displeasure is expected and met with camaraderie.

The forum is full of posts of people who are not lucky enough to have hoarded at the correct time, or get a good distribution of 5* covers, etc.  Those are the people that will receive my sympathy.  

whitecat31

I agree that this is not the best or ideal deal.  At the same time, it is better than anything else they have ever done when it came to a character nerf.  Considering their history of giving far less than equitable returns, I was expecting to keep Gambit, like almost everybody else.  When I saw what I thought was an "equitable" deal for the first time ever, I jumped on it.
Now as a person who does not have every five star covered, I got lucky, in that not one of the 34 covers I got were wasted. Roughly 20% went to desired characters. Many went to others that I just said "meh". Many went to filling holes.
On that note, It will actually allow me to champ and/or fully cover + level five different 5 stars (After I get the ISO), that I would most likely have never champed/max leveled. This is because, I am a legendary token hoarder type where I blow the wad on the three latest (which is how I got Gambit).  So this actually will help me in the future with PVE essential nodes. Otherwise those five star characters are garbage for PVP, which is what I feel Gambit has become. Hence, why I sold him.  Sadly, I will also most likely spend 250 command points to buy Gambit back, for the essential node reason, unless they do their due diligence and make four star Rogue into Gambit's feeder. 
Now granted, Gambit in my opinion,  is no longer Apex tier, top tier, or even middle tier.  But he is still above the low tier of Banner and Doc Ock, and of course leaps and bounds above the new bottom tier that is the disaster that is 5 star Wasp. So I can understand why some might keep him, but I see him as the money pit, that I have to sadly walk away from.  


On another note, this might change my saving patterns. I might just horde Legendary tokens for the latest, and save the command points for the five star gambling casino that is the classics. 
It really depends on what the new five stars shape up to look like. Will they be as bad as Wasp, although not sure that is possible, or will they be the next Okoye?

One last thing it did lower my match making rating a tiny bit since Gambit was my second highest character. 

Warbringa

I agree about the nerf being overboard.  That wasnt the point of my post or this thread.  

I never criticized him for going after a strong character. Heck, i am chasing strong characters myself.  I'm just pointing out that we should not be surprised when they get nerfed.  That displeasure is expected and met with camaraderie.

The forum is full of posts of people who are not lucky enough to have hoarded at the correct time, or get a good distribution of 5* covers, etc.  Those are the people that will receive my sympathy.  

Agreed with what you have stated Spudgutter, perhaps I misinterpreted the comments on why he obtained Gambit as a bit caustic.  I may have read them out of context of the whole post and they stuck with me a bit (which I do from time to time).  I agree with your main two points in that the history of the devs in nerfing is pretty awful and shouldn't be a surprise and that the people who have a legitimate beef (compared to a lot of our minor beefs here on the forum) are those who get awful RNG, which can be a simple function of timing in this game. Especially when you find out that RNG isn't really true RNG and is preset to some degree. 

Pongie

JohnnyStacks said:

I now have 4 5* Champs (PP, AA, DD, BB).

You’re going for as many pairs as possible? Just missing SS, GG and JJ. 

Jaedenkaal

Pongie said:

JohnnyStacks said:

I now have 4 5* Champs (PP, AA, DD, BB).

You’re going for as many pairs as possible? Just missing SS, GG and JJ. 

And Bruce Banner

grunth13

You bought a Ferrari,  used it for 9 months,  got hot chicks to like you because of your car,  went to all the nice parties because people thought you were rich because of your car,  got to enter the exclusive clubs because you drove up in your car, and now Ferrari has downgraded it to a Lexus and you are mad, knowing that Ferrari is allowed to do that if it wants because it did that to its previous model last year (it turned that car to a Toyota so you are making out better btw).  On top of that you want them to take your car and give you a new Ferrari...tsk tsk.  Not how it works.

LifeofAgony

These analogies can go the other way too - I bought the neat little thing called stock in a company called Apple.  Somehow I bought it for less than I’m selling it for.  How is this possible since all of you seem to think nothing in the world can be sold for more than the original sale price.

Wonder if this domicile I purhcased will appreciate in value either.

grunth13

LifeofAgony said:

These analogies can go the other way too - I bought the neat little thing called stock in a company called Apple.  Somehow I bought it for less than I’m selling it for.  How is this possible since all of you seem to think nothing in the world can be sold for more than the original sale price.

Wonder if this domicile I purhcased will appreciate in value either.

Because that's the definition of an investment where the value can go either way.   This game is a product that has that has no real value or always goes down in value.   There is no limit on how many can own it, etc.

Spudgutter

LifeofAgony said:

These analogies can go the other way too - I bought the neat little thing called stock in a company called Apple.  Somehow I bought it for less than I’m selling it for.  How is this possible since all of you seem to think nothing in the world can be sold for more than the original sale price.

Wonder if this domicile I purhcased will appreciate in value either.

Show me again where he could have sold his gambit to another player (not roster selling, keep it on topic) for a profit or for tokens or other characters. 

Due to power creep, *every* character loses some value.  If they don't, they get nerfed.  This discussion happens after every nerf, the only surprise is that people continue to be surprised by this fact.

thedarkphoenix

The only real losers in this situation are the people that might have recently got gambit and champed him, you made it 5 land got to play and be viable for a bit and then its taken away.

if you've had a couple seasons gambit after the "nerf" you had it really good in pvp and pve so you kind of got your money's worth. 

I still think he's strong, but slow... 

marshall

Had Gambit been released as is now back then, he'd have dominated the meta behind Thor until JJ came along.

He self-accelerates and can dish out potentially 30k. More than other older 5*and better than Archangel and GR for sure. Plus he can somewhat de-claw OML, symbiotes, muscle etc

I don't use him anymore because... power creep, similar to Panthos, OML+PHX, DD+anything. I think a 1:1 exchange is not bad, depends on your luck.

JohnnyStacks

Pongie said:

JohnnyStacks said:

I now have 4 5* Champs (PP, AA, DD, BB).

You’re going for as many pairs as possible? Just missing SS, GG and JJ. 

Ha, my SS and GG are both at 12 covers, too...so...could be soon! JJ on the otherhand is much farther away, unfortunately...

Mattjimf

Surely the whole benefit of the buy back tokens is that they are all 5* and nothing else?  Had they just given out LL tokens for the buy back would that have been better?

Tony_Foot

grunth13 said:

You bought a Ferrari,  used it for 9 months,  got hot chicks to like you because of your car,  went to all the nice parties because people thought you were rich because of your car,  got to enter the exclusive clubs because you drove up in your car, and now Ferrari has downgraded it to a Lexus and you are mad, knowing that Ferrari is allowed to do that if it wants because it did that to its previous model last year (it turned that car to a Toyota so you are making out better btw).  On top of that you want them to take your car and give you a new Ferrari...tsk tsk.  Not how it works.

I spent 100k on a Ferrari and while I was sleeping they lifted the engine out and replaced it with a 1litre Ford Focus engine. To say sorry they have offered me 13 pieces from 15 other random cars.

nigelregal

I think if they just made it so other characters can now use red/purple he would be fine. You can run him 5/3/5 and maybe get lucky to generate some red and purple ap to help another ally. The problem is his red does so little damage that you sacrifice a good red user for the chance to do some damage. 

Or maybe even being able to choose where the 3 purple countdown tiles go on the board. 

If the black countdown tile was able to be fortified he would be usable as well. 

I will likely not sell him even though he is my highest level character. I didn't spend any money to get him I just got lucky with LL pulls from a large hoard. I have all the worst 5* at very low cover counts and would probably not feel so great if I pulled a bunch of covers for them. The only way my game changes is if I get Okoye covers but it's likely I get little to none of her if I sell gambit. 

Straycat

LifeofAgony said:

These analogies can go the other way too - I bought the neat little thing called stock in a company called Apple.  Somehow I bought it for less than I’m selling it for.  How is this possible since all of you seem to think nothing in the world can be sold for more than the original sale price.

Wonder if this domicile I purhcased will appreciate in value either.

As you pointed out, your stock and real estate appreciated in value. Gambit didn't, he specifically got worse.

Tony_Foot said:

I spent 100k on a Ferrari and while I was sleeping they lifted the engine out and replaced it with a 1litre Ford Focus engine. To say sorry they have offered me 13 pieces from 15 other random cars.

You spent 100k on random pieces for cars that happened to make a Ferrari. And they gave you a months warning they were coming to do it. So you had some time to go joyriding

ZeroKarma

Spudgutter said:

LifeofAgony said:

These analogies can go the other way too - I bought the neat little thing called stock in a company called Apple.  Somehow I bought it for less than I’m selling it for.  How is this possible since all of you seem to think nothing in the world can be sold for more than the original sale price.

Wonder if this domicile I purhcased will appreciate in value either.

Show me again where he could have sold his gambit to another player (not roster selling, keep it on topic) for a profit or for tokens or other characters. 

Due to power creep, *every* character loses some value.  If they don't, they get nerfed.  This discussion happens after every nerf, the only surprise is that people continue to be surprised by this fact.

Actually there are many cases of people selling their Gambit and roster. I don't know if they made a profit though. 

Spudgutter

ZeroKarma said:

Spudgutter said:

LifeofAgony said:

These analogies can go the other way too - I bought the neat little thing called stock in a company called Apple.  Somehow I bought it for less than I’m selling it for.  How is this possible since all of you seem to think nothing in the world can be sold for more than the original sale price.

Wonder if this domicile I purhcased will appreciate in value either.

Show me again where he could have sold his gambit to another player (not roster selling, keep it on topic) for a profit or for tokens or other characters. 

Due to power creep, *every* character loses some value.  If they don't, they get nerfed.  This discussion happens after every nerf, the only surprise is that people continue to be surprised by this fact.

Actually there are many cases of people selling their Gambit and roster. I don't know if they made a profit though. 

I literally asked to exclude roster selling.  My understanding is that it is against the TOS, regardless if it is only rumored to have happened or if it actually happened.  That way, it keeps it apples to apples. 

Selling an entire roster is not the equivalent of just the character, first off.  Secondly, *if* it did happen, you honestly think the person who bought a roster paid the same amount that the original buyer put in?  If anything, it proves my point that the value constantly goes down...

fmftint

Tony_Foot said:

grunth13 said:

You bought a Ferrari,  used it for 9 months,  got hot chicks to like you because of your car,  went to all the nice parties because people thought you were rich because of your car,  got to enter the exclusive clubs because you drove up in your car, and now Ferrari has downgraded it to a Lexus and you are mad, knowing that Ferrari is allowed to do that if it wants because it did that to its previous model last year (it turned that car to a Toyota so you are making out better btw).  On top of that you want them to take your car and give you a new Ferrari...tsk tsk.  Not how it works.

I spent 100k on a Ferrari and while I was sleeping they lifted the engine out and replaced it with a 1litre Ford Focus engine. To say sorry they have offered me 13 pieces from 15 other random cars.

You didn't buy anything,  you leased it. And now the lease has ended and new lease terms apply.