is 5* wasp THAT bad? i mean, really?

2

Comments

  • Polly_P1
    Polly_P1 Posts: 99 Match Maker
    2* black widow is a far better ap stealer than 5* wasp.  

    2* wolverine does 2k less damage than her black pain index. And he at least has a true heal.  

    There are numerous 3* that do more damage than her “sting”

    she he herself does not go invisible. 

    She does have high health and I like the thought of call the swarm but it is really hard to get more than 4 swarm tiles on the board. Even with her support equipped. 
  • BoyWonder1914
    BoyWonder1914 Posts: 884 Critical Contributor
    edited July 2018
    BlackBoltRocks said:
    Hope steals a bunch of AP; turns a teammate invisible; and uses Leech Life with the strength of a Caterpie. 
    This made me laugh much harder than I expected to lol. 

    The fact that Janet Van Dyne was pretty bad when she came out as well, and is now a pretty fun mid-tier characater gives me hope. 

    EDIT: Pun not intended
  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2018
    Straycat said:
    I thought she might be underrated because a defense oriented support character is just not built for speed. And slow=bad on the forums. But then I remembered that OBW is maybe the best 2*, and has basically the same kit. Steal ap, burst heal, extra match damage. So in conclusion, she is not good enough at her support job to warrant how little damage she does.
    Speed IS important in mpq.  Speed means better scores in pvp and pve.  Rating slower characters poorly is not a "trendy" choice by these forums, it's a reflection of the way the game works.

    And obw is a bad comparison.  For 8ap she can steap as much as 18ap (!). And it's predictable.  She also extends enemy CDs, and has excellent offensive potential via double-dipping on strikes.  Wa5p does does none of those things.
  • Dormammu
    Dormammu Posts: 3,531 Chairperson of the Boards
    BoyWonder1914 said:
    The fact that Janet Van Dyne was pretty bad when she came out as well, and is now a pretty fun mid-tier characater gives me hope. 
    I think 4Wasp is actually a top tier support character at the 4-star level. Not to be nitpicky because your point is excellent.
  • TheHungryPet
    TheHungryPet Posts: 229 Tile Toppler
    edited July 2018
    Straycat said:
    I thought she might be underrated because a defense oriented support character is just not built for speed. And slow=bad on the forums. But then I remembered that OBW is maybe the best 2*, and has basically the same kit. Steal ap, burst heal, extra match damage. So in conclusion, she is not good enough at her support job to warrant how little damage she does.
    I dare say that I get more utility out of OBW than 5* Wasp. Key difference here is that the extra damage is treated as a separate hit. Double-dip strike tiles ahoy!

    @Polly_P1 stated, her AP is better, too. Plus added utility of extending enemy CD tiles.
  • Straycat
    Straycat Posts: 963 Critical Contributor
    Vhailorx said:
    Straycat said:
    I thought she might be underrated because a defense oriented support character is just not built for speed. And slow=bad on the forums. But then I remembered that OBW is maybe the best 2*, and has basically the same kit. Steal ap, burst heal, extra match damage. So in conclusion, she is not good enough at her support job to warrant how little damage she does.
    Speed IS important in mpq.  Speed means better scores in pvp and pve.  Rating slower characters poorly is not a "trendy" choice by these forums, it's a reflection of the way the game works.

    And obw is a bad comparison.  For 8ap she can steap as much as 18ap (!). And it's predictable.  She also extends enemy CDs, and has excellent offensive potential via double-dipping on strikes.  Wa5p does does none of those things.
    Yes, speed is important, but I think its weighted too highly sometimes. But my point was that she is not poorly rated because of speed, it is because she is bad.  OBW and her do have similar kits, but one is clearly better. If they were trying to make a 5* support character that fits a role like OBW, they failed.
  • TheHungryPet
    TheHungryPet Posts: 229 Tile Toppler
    Straycat said:
    Vhailorx said:
    Straycat said:
    I thought she might be underrated because a defense oriented support character is just not built for speed. And slow=bad on the forums. But then I remembered that OBW is maybe the best 2*, and has basically the same kit. Steal ap, burst heal, extra match damage. So in conclusion, she is not good enough at her support job to warrant how little damage she does.
    Speed IS important in mpq.  Speed means better scores in pvp and pve.  Rating slower characters poorly is not a "trendy" choice by these forums, it's a reflection of the way the game works.

    And obw is a bad comparison.  For 8ap she can steap as much as 18ap (!). And it's predictable.  She also extends enemy CDs, and has excellent offensive potential via double-dipping on strikes.  Wa5p does does none of those things.
    Yes, speed is important, but I think its weighted too highly sometimes. But my point was that she is not poorly rated because of speed, it is because she is bad.  OBW and her do have similar kits, but one is clearly better. If they were trying to make a 5* support character that fits a role like OBW, they failed.
    I second that. Wasp's kit is just awful, there's not a single ability that stands out that either provides damage (numbers too low), board shake (too cumbersome and too expensive), AP manipulation (inconsistent) or other mechanics that impact the outcome of a battle in a meaningful way.
  • Warbringa
    Warbringa Posts: 1,336 Chairperson of the Boards
    Maybe the strategy is if we make the new 5* character really bad, people will forget about the Gambit nerf and think he is still awesome. As pointed out in an above post, this means Doc Ock and Banner just got  a buff since they are no longer the worst 5*!
  • Dragon_Nexus
    Dragon_Nexus Posts: 3,701 Chairperson of the Boards
    She reminds me a lot of web tile characters before we started getting chjaracters like Gwen and Miles. Special tiles designed to boost a singular character and only that character with no way of also generating them with other characters so synergise.

    Maybe when two more 5*s come out that utilise swarm tiles she'll be useful...
  • Phumade
    Phumade Posts: 2,661 Chairperson of the Boards
    Dragon_Nexus said:
    She reminds me a lot of web tile characters before we started getting chjaracters like Gwen and Miles. Special tiles designed to boost a singular character and only that character with no way of also generating them with other characters so synergise.

    Maybe when two more 5*s come out that utilise swarm tiles she'll be useful...
    i wondered about thoress and the charged tile mechanic as well.  it seemed like well over a year before we saw chars that purposely used and syngerized with that tactic.  I hope its not another year before we see and expansion on that wasp/tentacle tile mechanic.
  • JHawkInc
    JHawkInc Posts: 2,609 Chairperson of the Boards
    Dragon_Nexus said:
    She reminds me a lot of web tile characters before we started getting chjaracters like Gwen and Miles. Special tiles designed to boost a singular character and only that character with no way of also generating them with other characters so synergise.

    Maybe when two more 5*s come out that utilise swarm tiles she'll be useful...
    That's what I've been thinking. It's a shame that Ant-Man and Janet don't already use Swarm Tiles, because that would make Hope more useful. As-is, she's got a niche mechanic that could be fun, but 5's are too rare to be "toys" like that, and it doesn't help that it appears to be a crapshoot for making these gimmicks competitive (Ock's reactor, Banner's transformation, Wasp's swarm tiles, even Strange's Eye and Phoenix's and iCap's revives, which are iffy gimmicks on otherwise solid characters).

    (and as a side note, while I don't want to overwhelm people with Spiders, I keep hoping we'll get Scarlet Spider or 2099 or Superior or Anya or Mayday or even a Limited Spider-Ham, with different color combos, so there are varieties of ways to use web tiles; I'm even a tiny bit grumpy that Eddie's Venom doesn't use them, even if it were just counting them for the purpose of his green ability)
  • jredd
    jredd Posts: 1,398 Chairperson of the Boards
    • i guess the next question is: hoard until she's out, or try to at least get her covered on the chance she gets a rework and becomes better?
  • uberhamster
    uberhamster Posts: 96 Match Maker
    jredd said:
    • i guess the next question is: hoard until she's out, or try to at least get her covered on the chance she gets a rework and becomes better?
    Indeed. One thing that I always have on my MPQ survey responses is that if they just say that they're looking at a character's performance it'd go a long way toward helping us plan and reducing stress from uncertainty.
  • Richyyy
    Richyyy Posts: 305 Mover and Shaker
    How many 5* reworks have we seen for ones that were too worthless rather than too good? Yeah, I wouldn't hold your breath.
  • Rogue4Lyfe
    Rogue4Lyfe Posts: 43 Just Dropped In
    Her Black power (Pain Index) is the only power that deals damage.

    Overall, she's not great. I wish somdays she could be a bit better, by reducing power cost or deals more damage.
    And all those "Call The Swarm" tiles makes literally non-sense.

    She is not as great as 4* Wasp (Janet Van Dyne). Janet is a true bright spot. 
  • Gold_Dragon
    Gold_Dragon Posts: 101 Tile Toppler
    Idk. I’m having a hard time finding a team that would go with her. Her wasp tile mechanic is hers and hers alone. So it’s difficult to build a team around her. 

    It’s weird that Call of the Swarm destroys the wasp tiles she just created. 

    I wouldnt be averse to keeping the wasp tiles on the field and destroying the tiles around them. 
  • Polly_P1
    Polly_P1 Posts: 99 Match Maker
    Gold_Dragon said:
    Idk. I’m having a hard time finding a team that would go with her. Her wasp tile mechanic is hers and hers alone. So it’s difficult to build a team around her. 

    I have paired her with Lumber Cap hoping that between her blue and his purple I could control AP.

    i have also tried Madusa and carnage with madusa set to 5/4/4. That way when ever a friendly attack tile is matched wasp can make a swarm tile as long as it heals her. (Her black passive)

    both at best - kind of worked. 

    I am am going to try vulture, with the goal to get to 30 blue AP so I can fire blue all in one turn to see if I can actually get more than 6 swarm tiles out
  • Phumade
    Phumade Posts: 2,661 Chairperson of the Boards
    Polly_P1 said:
    Gold_Dragon said:
    Idk. I’m having a hard time finding a team that would go with her. Her wasp tile mechanic is hers and hers alone. So it’s difficult to build a team around her. 

    I have paired her with Lumber Cap hoping that between her blue and his purple I could control AP.

    i have also tried Madusa and carnage with madusa set to 5/4/4. That way when ever a friendly attack tile is matched wasp can make a swarm tile as long as it heals her. (Her black passive)

    both at best - kind of worked. 

    I am am going to try vulture, with the goal to get to 30 blue AP so I can fire blue all in one turn to see if I can actually get more than 6 swarm tiles out
     Curious,  are you testing in pvp or pve?  and do you have any carol supports active?  thanks for going to the effort.  EVen with bad chars its usually pretty obivious what they were going for.  Hopefully, you'll figure out a decent way to play her

  • Alex502
    Alex502 Posts: 184 Tile Toppler
    Its like they said Wa5p could look like her movie counter part, but she wasn't allowed to do anything like her movie self. She should be able to shrink herself, as that's her own key power, and the fact that they gave her a swarm focus when she didn't use that in the movie at all. Seriously. Make her steal AP and a/s/p tiles, make her go invisible to change her powers, and god help us make her nuke do real damage without destroying the tiles you worked so hard to make. The whole function is just terrible, and doesn't align with how she was in the movie. Antman does all the things he should, and 4* Wasp is super kick ****. Hope should be a step up and above what Janet can do, but instead she's seriously one of the worst new characters in a long time. Not a fan of Emma Frost, either, but at least she feels like a 4*.

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