play threshold for meaningful roster progress in 5* tier

Vhailorx_2

I am semi-retired now.  I play ddq daily, and grind about 1/2 of pve events for the cp.  I no longer care to grind for placement or hop for PvP prog rewards.  Even that is a fairly substantial time commitment.  30-90 minutes per day depending on CL.

I have a modest 5* roster of 7 champs, with a several more classics heartbreakingly frozen at 10-11 covers. I have 40+ 4* champs (none above 320), and every character rostered.

It has basically become impossible for me to make meaningful progress on my roster.  I do not collect cp/LTs fast enough to fully cover new 5*s.  Thor and AA left the pool at 11 and 10 covers respectively.  GR has 8.  JJ has been heartbreakingly frozen at 6 for more a month despite my best efforts.

No single new 4* champ could really make an impact on my roster because of the vast gulf between the 4* and 5* tier.  I rarely use even awesome 4*s like carol, medusa, blade, and gamrocket. (Maybe a good new 3* or 4* battery would see some regular action?)  But other than that I am have basically been playing with the same 7 5*s over and over since I champed gambit in January.

In order to get more 5* champs. I think I would have to start (1) playing more, at least 1-2 hours a day to really grind PvP and pve, or (2) hoard for 6+ months (and miss out on several new 5* releases) and then pull LTs for 3 new 5* champs (noticeably less efficient now that CS cover swaps are dead), or (3) spend very heavily in buy clubs to supplement my cp income.

TL;DR: Once a player is established in the 5* tier, only new 5* champs will substantively affect that player's mpq experience.  And the threshold for routinely covering new 5*s is actually quite high.  Even a steady 60 minutes of play a day (or $ equivalent) isn't enough to come close.

I don't really know if this is a problem. If someone like me was able to make significant roster progress at my play levels, then true grinders would be making duplicate 550s. On the other hand, I have generally enjoyed mpq for years but basically feel like I am being squeezed out the game by the unyielding play requirements necessary to actually change my play experience. 

Am I alone in feeling this way? Is there any possible solution that demi could implement?

Lopan15

I am in the samr boat as you.  I only have 4 champed 5* (no Gambit or Thor) and all 4* from between 285-330 except the last 3.  I grind PVE to full progression and was only hitting PVP yp to around 300 until this newest change which has me going for the 10 CP in PVP.  So thats roughly 110 CP a week.  Thats either 4 pulls from latest or 5 pulls from classic.  I do get a couple LTs a week from champ levels and DDQ.  Since I cant cover a new 5* before they rotate out (usually around 5 or 6 covers when they rotate out) and with the 4* recombine meaning i probably wont cover a new 4* anytime soon, i feel like you do where the little progress i make doesnt really do anything for my gameplay or roster.   It is such a slow incremental build (which the glacial pace of supports still doesnt make look faster by comparison) that I’m basically on autopilot for now until I get bumped out of being able to enter SCL 7 at which time I will probably stop playing PVE events that require a latets 5* and move to a casual alliance. 

smkspy

No you are not. I'm in the same boat. 6 fives (plus a Phoenix that eventually need it) champed.

8 other fives at 10-11 covers...feeders for some but my highest 4 is only 322. Most of those won't help even if champed: Doc Ock, OML, Banner, CW Cap. 

I have every 4 champed but the last three releases...good luck finishing those. I am past the 4 star tier 100% at this point.

Even if I champ a classic, and I have with Spidey and DD, champ rewards will never happen in a meaningful way.

Their is no way for me to make meaningful forward progression with my five star roster and progression with my four star will move at a snail's pace because of dilution.

shobi6669

You are *not* alone.  I am very similar I suspect.  Around day 1560.  8 five star champs, but highest is only 453.

I think some people like me were content to "languish" in four star land as I did not have many 5s (or at least not good ones) at 13 covers.  What tipped the balance for me personally was the feeders they have been doing.  I have enough higher 4-stars that all of a sudden 2-3 5 star covers started popping into my queue.  It seemed like a total crazy waste to sell them just to remain in the 4-star tier (which I was enjoying, but had been in for a long time) so I figured this was a sign, and decided to throw caution to the wind and started champing them as this happened.

What that caused for me, was a complete screeching halt to PVP, where I am routinely pasted and struggle to get to 600 points.  Before I was never one to get to 1200 as it was too much work and too many shields, but I could easily get to 900 with my fourstar roster.  Not so anymore.

I guess the hope for us is to take advantage of the wins based system to get more covers and CP out of PVP?

My other dim hope is that they accelerate the feeders reveal.  I kind of hoped they would have already done this, in that I thought the 5-star feeders were a signal, but it is pretty random so far and it has not been enough to let me further champ any five stars.(since some of the feeders have been of newer characters who I do not yet have far enough along to cause any of the free instant covers to show up).

For the record my 8 5-star champs are a random grouping: Daredevil, Strange, Goblin, Black suit Spidey, Thanos, OML, Panther, and Surfer.  I have 7 more at either 12 or 11 covers, so it would not take a lot, but it seems like RNG has not been on my side of late.  Already have 3 or 4 "saved" 5 star covers, so maybe in the very long term that system will help me, but I am like you and I am not sure what there is left to do to progress.

And if the *only* answer is: grind more play more hoard more, then that is not exciting.

Hence why I am also semi-retired now.

Hopefully someone reading this in the same boat has some new plan of action  or some words of encouragement, because I really love this game, but I am feeling pretty bored and burned out.

Cheers!

grenadier

I've been feeling stalled out for a while now, and I'm a tier lower than you guys.  I have all but one 3* champed, numerous 4* champs, and a smattering of 5*'s with a few covers each.  I'm thinking those 5*'s may have been a mistake, but they are there now.

Anyway, with playing 1-2 hours a day, I just feel like I never seem to make much progress unless I get a lucky drop somewhere.  I've got a 2* farm going, which mostly feeds my champ levels on 3*, but there doesn't seem to be a clear way to me to progress more on 4* and 5*.  PVP seems a like a dead end most of the time, though I do like the wins based system.   PVE is hit or miss, and also the grind is simply getting boring when there is so little progression to keep me going.  

Is it just us, or is this really a problem with the game?  

If it is me, any suggestions on where to spend my time to get some 4* and 5* covers moving more quickly?

BoyWonder1914

I feel this way as a 4-star player as well. I've been treading water for the past 2-3 months now just champing 3-star dupes, as everyone but the latest 3 4s and Dino/Howard are champed. My Jubilee was at 5/5/2 so a Bonus Hero didn't give me good odds, and the Widow covers just weren't dropping - and this is before the brought in full dilution. So now my progress in the 4-star tier is stalled heavily as well. I can't really count on champ levels like I used to, because the distribution of them is no longer focused. Sure it's nice that I'm moving along the folks that have been stuck under 280 forever, but it was also quite nice having a stable of 4s that I knew was getting to 300+ before they left "latest" status. Even if its the same character with the same powers, there's a rather drastic difference between a Medusa at Lv. 289, and a Medusa at Lv. 340........the latter I've been skipping entirely this boosted week in PVP  . The rewards are so much better at those higher levels, allowing you to level/champ others faster, and because of power creep these characters are also usually pretty good. 

On another note, I've got 4 5-stars ready to champ that I refuse to pull the trigger on: Gambit, Goblin, Surfer, & Black Suit Spidey. 

If I EVER get a 5-star Bonus Hero again, these guys are 1 cover away: DareDevil, Cap (1st Avenger), Iron Man

Not exactly the best looking stable to come out of the gates with, especially considering the nerf Gambit is due for. This has been this way for a while though, and why I was thus determined to just try to build my 4-star farm up, and work on 3-star dupes so that those covers/rewards could keep rolling in. 5-star characters are still the end game, but without a more reliable way of getting them covered, I don't feel too inclined to try to move up. I can make T10 in PVE events just fine without 5s, and I'm not subjecting myself to the horrors of 5-star PVP until I've got a better selection of guys that aren't screwed from the powercreep. 

shadowyoshi

This is why I quit recently. I had no 5* champs and had no interest in hoarding to get to the 5* tier. Combine that with the return of full dilution and I was looking at not champing a single 4* or 5* character for 3-6 months.

And with that it became time to depart.

smkspy

shadowyoshi said:

This is why I quit recently. I had no 5* champs and had no interest in hoarding to get to the 5* tier. Combine that with the return of full dilution and I was looking at not champing a single 4* or 5* character for 3-6 months.

And with that it became time to depart.

And that's a huge problem with the game Imo. I know 5s are the so-called "end-game" but when you reach that end game, there is zero reason that you shouldn't be able to advance in it without reliance on RNG or paying your way forward.

ETA: I understand the rng aspect (even think it's somewhat necessary) for LL, but concerning classics there is zero justifiable reason for people in our situation not to be able to earn classic 5s. People at our level don't pull classics, therefore all those old 5s are only worth being 5* essentials and the champed ones remain static at whatever level they currently are.

justsing

smkspy said:

shadowyoshi said:

This is why I quit recently. I had no 5* champs and had no interest in hoarding to get to the 5* tier. Combine that with the return of full dilution and I was looking at not champing a single 4* or 5* character for 3-6 months.

And with that it became time to depart.

And that's a huge problem with the game Imo. I know 5s are the so-called "end-game" but when you reach that end game, there is zero reason that you shouldn't be able to advance in it without reliance on RNG or paying your way forward.

ETA: I understand the rng aspect (even think it's somewhat necessary) for LL, but concerning classics there is zero justifiable reason for people in our situation not to be able to earn classic 5s. People at our level don't pull classics, therefore all those old 5s are only worth being 5* essentials and the champed ones remain static at whatever level they currently are.

It would be cool if they added another Legendary store (call it Featured Legends) that included 3 random Classic 5*s and rotated every month/season. It’d be like what we get for new 5* releases but as a permanent store with rotating 5* options.

smkspy

justsing said:

smkspy said:

shadowyoshi said:

This is why I quit recently. I had no 5* champs and had no interest in hoarding to get to the 5* tier. Combine that with the return of full dilution and I was looking at not champing a single 4* or 5* character for 3-6 months.

And with that it became time to depart.

And that's a huge problem with the game Imo. I know 5s are the so-called "end-game" but when you reach that end game, there is zero reason that you shouldn't be able to advance in it without reliance on RNG or paying your way forward.

ETA: I understand the rng aspect (even think it's somewhat necessary) for LL, but concerning classics there is zero justifiable reason for people in our situation not to be able to earn classic 5s. People at our level don't pull classics, therefore all those old 5s are only worth being 5* essentials and the champed ones remain static at whatever level they currently are.

It would be cool if they added another Legendary store (call it Featured Legends) that included 3 random Classic 5*s and rotated every month/season. It’d be like what we get for new 5* releases but as a permanent store with rotating 5* options.

Yeah, only way I would even consider pulling from it though would be if the odds were greatly increased. It's hard enough for us to cover latest, still wouldn't be much incentive to cover older 5s at the same draw rate...speaking as someone that does not hoard and is able to consistently pull without waste (except for 5s now that swaps are over).

broll

The fix is 6* tier being the new rarity and open up 5*s a lot. That will open up progression for most unless they have all 5*s champed/max champed.  Open up a new tier every 2 years once dilution starts setting in and bets start stagnating. 

smkspy

Devs really messed up making 5s so over-powered at their release. They should have been like 4s were to 3s. A stronger tier, but not so over-powered that when they wanted to release a 5 tier it wouldn't break the game like a 6 tier would do now.

sirwookieechris

They should announce .5* characters. Very weak on their own, but can be combined with existing teams to support them. All of their abilities are passives. Make it so if you combine a .5* with a normal hero that they have a relationship with in the comics you get an extra bonus ability.

They can call them “reinforcers”

Projectus2501

Devs should read this post. It's full of players that are very useful to the game but will probably leave it because they just can't keep up .Many of us will be in the same boat one day...

wymtime

To give the OP time commitment from myself who plays CL9 PVE and to 1200 PVP each event.  I have 15 5* champed and a handful at 390 waiting on covers.  I do the opening of PVE in about 45-50min and can close the sub in about 45-50min so I play just over 90min of PVE a day.  I then play PVP for 1/2 hour one night tp get to 500ish points then an hour to push to 1200.  So overall I play competitively 2-2/12 hours a day finish top 20-50 in PVE, top 10 PVE alliance since I play essentially, top 25 PVP.  I hoard my LT and CP to only pull latest and will typically get 120+pulls every 6 weeks and have been able to cover all new 5* since pre-gambit this way.  I also split up when I play so PVE works in the morning and PVP normally in the evening DPDQ on the pot.  
‘To keep progressing at the highest level you can’t just play casually you are roster is too high.  If you just get progression CP in both PVE and PVP you can probably get to 300 pulls every 3rd 5* release or you can wait 6 months till you get 300LT and only use CP on classics.  If you also want just play more PVE and use your 4* and go down a CL or 2.  The most important thing is to enjoy the game, but remember how much time you put into the game will determine how fast you progress.

Daiches

sirwookieechris said:

They should announce .5* characters. Very weak on their own, but can be combined with existing teams to support them. All of their abilities are passives. Make it so if you combine a .5* with a normal hero that they have a relationship with in the comics you get an extra bonus ability.

They can call them “reinforcers”

I like this idea. But they seem too strong. Can we make them very unobtainable, so people want to play hard to chase them? Maybe make the best ones available to maybe a dozen people after a season of work?
We can always implement a way to level them later.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

thedarkphoenix

There needs to be championing to max level of 550 for now. Meaning 1-5 stars can champion up to 5 but it would take Significantly more iso to level a 1 to 5 and significantly more cp and luck with covers to get a 5 to 550. The 1-4's should get the match damage of 5's but still get the power increase on the abilities.


There needs to be something to constantly do while leveling up. and rewards should be consistent 

rixmith

I agree that the inability to get any better is a problem. I have 12 5*'s between 450 and 463 (only Thor is above 454). With doing 7 clears on PVE for a t50 or t20 placement, hitting 1000 in PVP, doing Lightning Rounds, hitting 2000 in Shield sim, DDQ, Shield Trainings and supporting the game with VIP, I can barely get new 5*s champed before they rotate out. 

I hoard for 6 weeks and then pull until enough to champ whoever is leaving Latests. And it has usually required cover swaps to get that character champed. Most of the time it completely wipes out my hoard. And then I start again for the next 6 weeks. 

That's a LOT of play plus $10 a month to barely keep up. And now without the 1:1 cover swaps, I may have to make hard choices about not champing someone if the covers don't fall right. Which will be very disheartening.

Daredevil217

With 5* being the end game/unicorns that the developers wanted them to be, shouldn’t they be hard to obtain? Should you be able to play casually, not spend, and still champ them? Honest question. Once I sell off some Gambit covers, I’ll have only 4 max-covered 5s. And I’ve been playing 1300+ days. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say that if you want to play casually you aren’t going to get the very best characters in the game. They need to give incentive to grind and spend.  It’s ultimately what got you the 5* you do have (well, that and hoarding). And saying “I’m burnt out and don’t want to do it” is fine, but I also wouldn’t expect to get the rewards either.

Could always join me in the 4* tier. Plenty of room for casuals and it has much more variety. Though with dilution being what it is, you stand to cover 5s at a much faster rate. So scratch that. 

sirwookieechris

Daredevil217 said:

With 5* being the end game/unicorns that the developers wanted them to be, shouldn’t they be hard to obtain? Should you be able to play casually, not spend, and still champ them? Honest question. Once I sell off some Gambit covers, I’ll have only 4 max-covered 5s. And I’ve been playing 1300+ days. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say that if you want to play casually you aren’t going to get the very best characters in the game. They need to give incentive to grind and spend.  It’s ultimately what got you the 5* you do have (well, that and hoarding). And saying “I’m burnt out and don’t want to do it” is fine, but I also wouldn’t expect to get the rewards either.

Could always join me in the 4* tier. Plenty of room for casuals and it has much more variety. Though with dilution being what it is, you stand to cover 5s at a much faster rate. So scratch that. 

The removal of latest 12 for 4* hurts new players but it’s not that bad for existing 4* players. If you are solidly in the 4* tier you can get 1-5 covers for a new character when they first come out. Between boss event releases and win based pvp, it is easier than ever to guarantee a few covers for a new character. Maybe you won’t have them champed in less than a month, but it will still happen faster than a 5* unless you are purposefully hoarding LL tokens. Even then, by the time you have the 400+ LL tokens, that new hero probably had a second pve event and you could be up to 3-7 covers without ever opening a token.