Hard counters and soft counters

124

Comments

  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited November 2014
    Add Octopus who is supposed to consist of counters and who thus fails as a core character, but eh;
    add thoughts on Surgical Strike since this ability is a darn good counter to a LOT of other skills/threats;
    add R62 updates on characters (mHawkeye/She-Hulk/etc).

    For the second next batch, 4* Thor and Devil Dino (?).
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    Ode to Surgical Strike which is not only an awesome core ability but is a direct counter to a ton of skills/characters.

    Examples to follow:
    Muscles and Thugs and Dons have 1000000 yellow CD and strike tiles out to get you? Surgical Strike to remove all yellow tiles/drain their yellow AP.
    Edit: Same for Pyros, Assassins, Snipers, Grenadiers, etc. with their huge damage green CDs.
    Black Panther, Invisible Woman and Captain America have used their yellow abilities and have yellow strike tile/Inivisibility/protect tiles out? Surgical Strike to remove all yellow tiles/drain their yellow AP.
    Bullseye has flooded the field with his protect tiles? Surgical Strike to remove all purple tiles.
    oBW, Moonstone, Loki and Deadpool out to get you on a board rich with purple? Surgical Strike to remove all purple tiles/drain their purple AP.
    Sentry is ready to Supernova you to smithereens? Surgical Strike to remove all red tiles/drain his red AP.
    Human Torch ready to use Fireball on you and charge 2 red for his next one? Surgical Strike to remove all red tiles/drain his red AP.
    Psylocke has spammed the board with her strong red strike tiles? Surgical Strike to remove all red tiles/drain her red AP.
    Classic Magneto is about to Magnetized Projectile you? Surgical Strike to remove all blue tiles/drain his blue AP. Also works if he has a partner with strongest red like Sentry/Thor/HT/Psylocke, etc.
    Doctor Doom is about to use Technopathic Strike on you and the board is filled with blue to boot? Surgical Strike to remove all blue tiles/drain his blue AP.

    The best part is this:
    Ares is about to Onslaught you? Well, why wait for him to give you green. Surgical Strike to remove all green tiles/drain his green AP AND charge your next X-Force.
    Patch has used Berserker Rage and has green strike tiles out or is about to use BR? Surgical Strike to remove all green tiles/drain his green AP AND charge your next X-Force.
    Hulk is very, very Angry and has flooded the board with green? Surgical Strike to remove all green tiles, drain his green AP and do massive damage AND charge your next X-Force.
    Enemy X-Force is about to X-Force/Surgical Strike you? Surgical Strike to remove all green tiles, drain his green AP AND charge your next X-Force.

    Et cetera, et cetera.

    Not everyone has a playable X-Force with 5 black covers.
    But you can still use even the 1 black cover since it removes ALL tiles of the enemy's strongest colour at base level and at cover one; besides, more joy for you in earning X-Force team-ups since you can use them more often than us X-Force owners icon_e_biggrin.gif
  • homeinvasion
    homeinvasion Posts: 415 Mover and Shaker
    Firstly can we have this as a sticky, I am always looking for it.

    Second Excellent work OP

    Third is a suggestion only, could you under each characters name suggest the one character that is the best counter? I would find that really helpful like this

    Patch
    Best counter: Loki
  • yogi_
    yogi_ Posts: 1,236 Chairperson of the Boards
    And perhaps a move to the Tips and Guides sub-forum...
  • OnesOwnGrief
    OnesOwnGrief Posts: 1,387 Chairperson of the Boards
    Which I believe I've stated twice in this very forum...
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited November 2014
    homeinvasion wrote:
    Firstly can we have this as a sticky, I am always looking for it.

    Second Excellent work OP

    Third is a suggestion only, could you under each characters name suggest the one character that is the best counter? I would find that really helpful like this

    Patch
    Best counter: Loki
    Will do, thanks.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited November 2014
    Added the brief lists keeping in mind that PvP/PvE choices are pretty much separate and you can have a greater variety in PvE (except you cannot do mirror comps in PvE).
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited November 2014
    To do: add 2* Miss Marvel, add Goddess of Thunder (she's kinda ready and everyone can play with her).
    Maybe add how displaying CD ownership affects CD specialists. (Woot! Bag-Man and 2* Captain and Moonstone get a nanogram of viability more, except that oBW still runs circles around them).
  • HailMary
    HailMary Posts: 2,179
    dat Ode to Surgical Strike icon_e_surprised.gificon_cool.gificon_e_biggrin.gif
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited November 2014
    Added 4* Thor, 2* Captain Marvel, inserted some vampiric goodness (Blade) ahead of time.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    Add how red-destruction skills hose Blade's passive, add Blade creating special tiles passively, add more on 2* Marvel (overwrites ALL tiles with yellow), add Mystique when she's released (stun, AP steal, colour conversion).
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    I think Mystique should be considered a counter to Thor. All of her skills weaken Thor significantly, and make it hard for him to charge up.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited November 2014
    Mystique is also now a viable counter to Sentry as well since 12 green AP is not the same as 7 green and is counterable. Ditto Patch, Punisher, Human Torch, Hulk, Ares, Juggernaut, Ragnarok, Mohawk and modern Storm.

    To do: the previous additions, edit Hood and Sentry parts...
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Thor4 seems like a hard counter to Sentry. Power Surge stuns him to delay pulling off his skills while flooding the board with charged tiles. Charged Tiles can't be overwritten by World Rupture, so that can reduce the amount of tiles generated. Smite adds a few more Charged Tiles and Striking Distance can convert up to 5 WR Tiles as well as Sacrifice if you have sufficient yellow covers of course. Charged Tikes also appear to disarm traps so this could be a soft counter to Fury & Daredevil
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited December 2014
    Updated with Blade, Mystique, Rocket and Groot, Goddess, Hood/Sentry balance (minor changes, the basis stays the same mostly), any insight on dealing with Goddess without your own is welcome (you did defeat her nodes in Gauntlet, didn't you?), ditto X-Force.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    To do: add how Anger can be countered by black tile wipeout (e.g. Surgical Strike against a Hulk team where Daken/Blade/Punisher have priority on match damage), add how Doom counters all blue skills, including 4or's, all blue special tile skills (mHawkeye, Beast, R&G, BP, etc.).
    Add friendly charged tiles disarming enemy traps and vice versa (just tested and confirmed).
    Rewrite Loki/Daredevil when details of their balance are known.
    Add Gamora.
    Add how Blade/Daken/optionally Doc Ock can completely hose squishy AP thieves like Hood/oBW/Mq with just passive strike tiles/attack tiles (also counters Doom's Demons and other red special tile users).
    Add R&G (TU), Doom (blue) to the tile wipeout category.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited January 2015
    Updated on Dec 26th.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    edited January 2015
    To do: add Doom's new purple power and its counters, add Luke Cage as he's released. Add that Loki's strongest colour is purple, not black.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    edited January 2015
    locked wrote:
    To do: add Doom's new purple power and its counters, add Luke Cage as he's released.

    Diabolical plot counters (so far)

    Occupy Purple Tiles, may overwrite/disarm potential traps ~ Mohawk/Modern Storm ~ Hailstones, Patch - Berserker Rage, Spider-Man - Spider-Sense, Elektra - Double Double Cross, Bullseye - Adamantium Bones, Blade - Keep Your Enemies Closer, Modern Hawkeye - Speedshot ~ to a lesser extent random tiles spam skills such as Classic Magneto - Coercive Field, Falcon - Bird Strike, Human Torch - Inferno

    Skills where you can place 1 or more tiles to reduce the number of available basic purple tiles, such as 2star Magneto, Grey Suit Widow, Captain America ~ EDIT: Grey Widow & 2Star Magneto use purple for their skill, but need to do strategic 4-matches to clear away the remaining purple tiles. Simply changing an existing hidden purple trap to blue or green probably won't disarm it

    all tile shatter skills & any skill that can reduce enemy purple AP reserve

    Soft counter: Colossus Immovable object to try to reduce the damage when it's unavoidable

    Still need to test how Invisible Woman - Force Bubbles locking down purple tiles behaves with Doom traps, but may be considered a hard counter. Will follow up once verified.
  • over_clocked
    over_clocked Posts: 3,961
    Miss Marvel can destroy any and all tiles, even friendly ones. I don't see why she couldn't blow up Doom's traps randomly. Or any other traps for that matter, and since TUp tiles are not colour tiles, I imagine she utterly destroys them instead of triggering as if on match, e. g. Ambush, Demolition.
    Thanks for your nice list.

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