Most Broken Card

13

Comments

  • morgue427
    morgue427 Posts: 783 Critical Contributor
    sometimes sarcasm can be hard to tell in writing but i think you MAY have let yourself be known fiddler
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,731 Chairperson of the Boards
    Not every f2p player is at the bottom either.  That's the perk of the random-esque aspect of the packs.  You can't just "buy" all the good cards and assemble your unbeatable deck. 

    That's the aspect of booster-crafting that I'm afraid of, that it'll allow the players who are willing to spend thousands of dollars on this game to make those unbeatable decks.  Yeah it'll be great for Octagon in the short term, but once all the non-whales stop playing...
  • IM_CARLOS
    IM_CARLOS Posts: 640 Critical Contributor
    GR is a thread like any other creature on the list, but it's a one shot. Baral (pre-nerf) instead was a enabler of broken winning machine. Post-nerf he is 'just' strong, but not broken.

    New perspective is the most broken card today. It enables or at least boosting the new winning machine. And it's just a rare, so easy to get. At least greg can't cycle cards. NP would get a nerf a day later. 

    Nothing on the list is really broken and can't be handled or just outrace.

    I only fear GR or Oliv it matches with objectives like xx or less damage. 
  • IM_CARLOS
    IM_CARLOS Posts: 640 Critical Contributor
    FindingHeart8 said:
    I'm a bit confused as why New Perspectives is even being considered by some players as overpowered.  Yeah, with the right other cards you (and only you) can go infinite, but the process is long and tedious, and only fits as a good last-resort technique to taking on overpowered bosses.  Like stated above, the AI can't abuse it...and I'm very thankful they can't use cycling.
    With the right cards or just the right PW. Try Nissa3 with NP, Mentor and 8 other cycler. Easy to reach ultimate and game on turn 3. Nearly same for kiora.
    Dovin needs drake haven (and AP) for speed win, bur get cast out to seal the board and tezz2 or nicol can use faith instead.

    NP nets you at least 3 cards for 5 mana. That's awesome by its own. But  combined with more or less useful cycler it nets you dozens of mana every turn, fetch the silver bullet in your deck, ramp up your loyality (mentor) and soon ends the game.

    The problem is not that greg did not cycle. The problem is you have to cycle to be competitive. Was the same for baral before nerf. More like work than play. 
  • Hottwhyrd
    Hottwhyrd Posts: 8 Just Dropped In
    I have exactly none of these cards
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 0 Match Maker
    The comments on this thread have made me acutely uncomfortable about committing much more time to the game.
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,731 Chairperson of the Boards
    Drycha said:
    The comments on this thread have made me acutely uncomfortable about committing much more time to the game.
    how so Drycha?
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,731 Chairperson of the Boards
    IM_CARLOS said:
    With the right cards or just the right PW. Try Nissa3 with NP, Mentor and 8 other cycler. Easy to reach ultimate and game on turn 3. Nearly same for kiora.
    Dovin needs drake haven (and AP) for speed win, bur get cast out to seal the board and tezz2 or nicol can use faith instead.

    NP nets you at least 3 cards for 5 mana. That's awesome by its own. But  combined with more or less useful cycler it nets you dozens of mana every turn, fetch the silver bullet in your deck, ramp up your loyality (mentor) and soon ends the game.

    The problem is not that greg did not cycle. The problem is you have to cycle to be competitive. Was the same for baral before nerf. More like work than play. 
    I'm not debating that it's an amazing card, just that the AI makes poor use of it's potential.  Cycling decks generally revolve around a lot of dead cards, generally an easy win.

    The only time I've ever lost to a cycling deck since its first release is when it was used with the new Bolas planeswalker, but that was because...obviously...the new Bolas is fairly OP.
  • Kinesia
    Kinesia Posts: 1,621 Chairperson of the Boards
    See I use NP but _don't_ cycle with it. It's so broken that outside the niche it's _meant_ to have, it's _still_ an awesome card for card draw and mana for _playing_ things. That's not meant to be true. It putting mana on cards instead of reducing cycling costs directly was a huge implementation flaw.
  • bk1234
    bk1234 Posts: 2,924 Chairperson of the Boards
    [MOD MIC ON] Just a friendly reminder to stay on topic and keep the conversation constructive. [//MOD MIC]
  • babar3355
    babar3355 Posts: 1,128 Chairperson of the Boards
    Can we throw Prism Array in the mix of insanely under-costed for the effect?
  • blacklotus
    blacklotus Posts: 589 Critical Contributor
    edited December 2017
    wickedwitch74 said:
    New Perspectives is ridiculous. It's an 5 CC engine, which draws you three cards and provides more mana gains over the life of a game than just about any other card.

    Paired with Drake Haven, you can have a huge flyer in only a couple of turns.

    Paired with Faith of the Devoted, you can recover from an early beating and blow someone away fairly quickly.

    Even just for non-cycling card draw, it costs less than "Tezzeret's Ambition".

    It takes over the meta-game. It allows a player to cycle through his deck for secondary conditions. It lets low-level walkers dominate matches they have no business winning.

    The only reason it isn't Public Enemy #1 is that the AI can't use it.

    It's seriously broken, and at Rare, its a lot more prevalent. 
    I beg to differ. it's the relatively easy to acquire cards like NP and the old Runaway Carriage that allows new players to be competitive early into the game and retain their interest. There is a reason why mtgpq has a bad retaining rate among new players: steep learning curve, difficult to win with basic cards and poor drop rates for those better cards. Most of the common cards are trash. 12 mana to cast a 2/2 critter with berserk, when your starting pw has only +1 on his on-color match and -2 on off-colors?

    Like you said, a NP using AI does not affect the difficulty for players to win the game because it is too dumb to use it properly. However, it allows players with a small card collection to win easier. And that is always a good thing. A game that causes players to lose too often does not them for long.
  • tfg76
    tfg76 Posts: 258 Mover and Shaker
    Don't really agree that the AI can't use New Perspectives. NP is the best card drawing card out there, even if you disregard cycling. Even without Drake Haven et al, NP would be awesome to simply play with cards like Shefet's monitor, Striped Riverwinder, and so on, simply for value.

    By the same logic, I picked Baral as the best card out there. It's cheap, draws you cards and lets you play others efficiently. Cards like Deploy are certainly more powerful, but are easily disrupted by discard or simply just faster decks. Deploy also relies on you having other awesome mythics like pig or Olivia to really take advantage.

    I don't think there are any blue decks out there that wouldn't benefit from NP or Baral, disregarding secondary event objectives.

    That being said, the AI can actually play Deploy, Pig and Olivia to awesome effect, and as such they are perhaps in a greater need for nerfing.
  • tfg76
    tfg76 Posts: 258 Mover and Shaker

    I would also point out that there are a lot of totally unusable rares, mythics, and masterpeices that should probably be buffed for balance.

    Hear hear! And commons and uncommons too!
  • Machine
    Machine Posts: 857 Critical Contributor
    Machine said:
    Behold the Beyond. That card is an insane engine that completely messes up the status quo. I also agree with @spadpl that nerfing old cards is not really necessary. We have legacy and standard events for a reason. Also, most of them can be dealt with pretty easily.

    OK, let me rephrase that... OMNISCIENCE! My opponent just cast it and before I could blink my eyes I was dead even with full life. Can't see the AI do that with New Perspectives...
  • babar3355
    babar3355 Posts: 1,128 Chairperson of the Boards
    tfg76 said:
    Don't really agree that the AI can't use New Perspectives. NP is the best card drawing card out there, even if you disregard cycling. Even without Drake Haven et al, NP would be awesome to simply play with cards like Shefet's monitor, Striped Riverwinder, and so on, simply for value.

    I agree with much of what you said but can only assume you haven't pulled Pull from Tomorrow?  That is the strongest draw card in the game.
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,731 Chairperson of the Boards
    I agree with much of what you said but can only assume you haven't pulled Pull from Tomorrow?  That is the strongest draw card in the game.
    You beat me to that point babar3355, and yes Pull from Tomorrow is an amazing card, especially when you're discarding an embalm card or flip-spell :)
  • Drewster
    Drewster Posts: 116 Tile Toppler
    DtG + HUF = :D

    I really do think live pvp is a goal for development with balancing old cards on their list of objectives to accomplish.
  • IM_CARLOS
    IM_CARLOS Posts: 640 Critical Contributor
    babar3355 said:
    Can we throw Prism Array in the mix of insanely under-costed for the effect?

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