Fix X Force Wolverine

thedarkphoenix

Anyone with healing in a one on one fight without someone else with healing can win.  xf4 isn't super bad like say Winter solider..but he's still pretty bad 

Dormammu

Winter Soldier > XFW

Dormammu

I don't know who Busthustler is, but I say go with that. 

Jaedenkaal

Dormammu said:

I don't know who Busthustler is, but I say go with that. 

And never look back

Maybe he meant Bulkhuster.

thedarkphoenix

Dormammu said:

Winter Soldier > XFW

  

No way

Warbringa

XFW still has a viable build but his powers need to be increased.

Black - bring back a partial AP drain, maybe not the insane level it was before but how about 1-4 AP depending on the cover level
Green - significant damage increase needed as the board shake is way over valued since there are a ton of better board shake and damage abilities compared to his
Yellow - Make it so he gains health back every time the tile counts down and fortify the tile initially at level 5 cover - so instead of all the health coming back when tile expires, you gradually get the health back every turn

Dormammu

Jaedenkaal said:
Maybe he meant Bulkhuster.

The first character I thought of for 'Busthustler' was Mockingbird. 

Dartmaster01

Just give his green strike tiles and make his yellow a passive heal. Boom! Done.

Vold

Healing for XFW needs to be by CD because of the attack feature should an enemy match it.
it represents his self preservation instinct like how Rogue gets stab when waking him by accident.

so making it passive is not a good idea as it takes away what makes that Wolvie unique,

healing per round with the countdown, I'm ok with that.

Dormammu

Vold said:

Healing for XFW needs to be by CD because of the attack feature should an enemy match it.
it represents his self preservation instinct like how Rogue gets stab when waking him by accident.

so making it passive is not a good idea as it takes away what makes that Wolvie unique.

I disagree with you, but I like your explanation of it. Though, I sure hope my XFW isn't napping on me when we're in the middle of a match!

himatako

I'd say bringing back the AP drain won't be too powerful at this point, especially now that they reduce his black's damage. Maybe instead of draining everything, just drain 1 AP per destroyed tile? (1 - 3 covers start with 1 AP for every 2 destroyed tiles or something)

As for green and yellow, I like Warbringa's idea here.

Warbringa said:

XFW still has a viable build but his powers need to be increased.

Black - bring back a partial AP drain, maybe not the insane level it was before but how about 1-4 AP depending on the cover level
Green - significant damage increase needed as the board shake is way over valued since there are a ton of better board shake and damage abilities compared to his
Yellow - Make it so he gains health back every time the tile counts down and fortify the tile initially at level 5 cover - so instead of all the health coming back when tile expires, you gradually get the health back every turn

DAZ0273

throughsilver said:

Dayv said:

I still like XFW.  He was my first maxed four star (you know, back when it was him, basically unusable Invisible Woman, and Nick Fury*), and Ive used him at nearly every version of his power set from his worthless originals to the current version.


* I have been playing this game way too long.

You and me both! Fury was a complete boss at that time. And 3* Mags was the scariest character for me to fight. 

Also: XFW black after casting XFDP pink will always be a barrel of laughs. 

DAZ0273 said:

Vold said:

I just beat Cyclops classic with Wolverine X-Force on Deadpool daily though he was not champ yet.

had to boost him though, lol

two tries then manage to win.

this is my second final section of DDQ I manage to win due to my lack of Required characters 

I lost twice to Cyclops before third time the charm and my XFW is champed, Lol! I had 2 bad boards but even so, that just shows how bad he can be!

Just for an opposite perspective, I have a champed XFW and beat Cyclops first go, making a point of finishing on 100% health

Oh don't get me wrong, I agree that is perfectly doable, my struggles were mostly down to bad luck, AI red cascades and no black tiles. Third time I trounced Cyclops.

jamesh

Milk Jugz said:

I found it amusing that the level 270 3* Cyclops had more health than my level 295 4* Wolverine

IIRC, he's still a victim of the nerf of healers a while back, where they increased the health of all but a few characters.  They subsequently corrected it a bit by increasing the health of some Wolverine variants but left 4* as is.

That was a bit of a strange decision given he has the least reliable healing power out of all variants.

Jaedenkaal

jamesh said:

Milk Jugz said:

I found it amusing that the level 270 3* Cyclops had more health than my level 295 4* Wolverine

IIRC, he's still a victim of the nerf of healers a while back, where they increased the health of all but a few characters.  They subsequently corrected it a bit by increasing the health of some Wolverine variants but left 4* as is.

That was a bit of a strange decision given he has the least reliable healing power out of all variants.

Nah, none of the Wolverines have had their health boosted since then. Unless you mean X-23, who was released with better health than Patch and X-Force. 2* Wolverine has better than average health, but... who cares?

jamesh

Jaedenkaal said:

jamesh said:

Milk Jugz said:

I found it amusing that the level 270 3* Cyclops had more health than my level 295 4* Wolverine

IIRC, he's still a victim of the nerf of healers a while back, where they increased the health of all but a few characters.  They subsequently corrected it a bit by increasing the health of some Wolverine variants but left 4* as is.

That was a bit of a strange decision given he has the least reliable healing power out of all variants.

Nah, none of the Wolverines have had their health boosted since then. Unless you mean X-23, who was released with better health than Patch and X-Force. 2* Wolverine has better than average health, but... who cares?

Back when they did the health increase (April 2015), Wolverine and Daken had the same health.  Some time after that, they increased 2* and 3* Wolverine.  I can't remember when it was exactly though: maybe when they introduced Enemy of the State?

sambrookjm

If you're going to be using XFW, the only special tile users you should be using with him are ones where you don't mind if they're destroyed by his abilities.  (XFDeadpool, obviously!)  If he doesn't team up well with Medusa because he destroys her special tiles, then don't use him with Medusa.  Given the sheer number of Medusa users I see in the PvP events, that might be hard for some people, but it is an option!  ;-)

I like the idea of the green being a targeted ability.  If you want to "fix" is, you could give it the 3/5 Star Lord caveat that it leaves friendly tiles alone?  Doing extra damage for special tiles destroyed is way to similar to Carnage's green.

The yellow healing tile being fortified is nice idea, but I like the "Create a countdown tile each turn that heals X health" idea better.  And keep it true healing, not burst healing!  (If you want to copy someone else's ability for this one, make it Wasp's, where if the enemy matches it, they take damage.)

TheHungryPet

I think he could easily be fixed with just a few adjustments:

X-Force: Make it generate AP. Just compare to 3* Storm who pays 10 green AP, destroys 14 random tiles and gets AP for it.  Surely the improved efficiency (8 green AP for 15 destroyed tiles) would be justified, we're talking 3* vs. 4*

Surgical Strike: Fine as is

Recovery: Make the countdown tile fortified at higher levels. Also, instead of healing everything after it resolves, change the mechanic so it heals a smaller chunk every turn instead of all at once.

Jaedenkaal

jamesh said:

Jaedenkaal said:

jamesh said:

Milk Jugz said:

I found it amusing that the level 270 3* Cyclops had more health than my level 295 4* Wolverine

IIRC, he's still a victim of the nerf of healers a while back, where they increased the health of all but a few characters.  They subsequently corrected it a bit by increasing the health of some Wolverine variants but left 4* as is.

That was a bit of a strange decision given he has the least reliable healing power out of all variants.

Nah, none of the Wolverines have had their health boosted since then. Unless you mean X-23, who was released with better health than Patch and X-Force. 2* Wolverine has better than average health, but... who cares?

Back when they did the health increase (April 2015), Wolverine and Daken had the same health.  Some time after that, they increased 2* and 3* Wolverine.  I can't remember when it was exactly though: maybe when they introduced Enemy of the State?

EoTS predates the health change by quite a lot; also, Patch and 3* Daken still have the same health.

Druiz23

I am all for a re-work of XForce.  He was nerfed way too strongly.  With all of the 4 stars out there now that not only do tons more damage than he does (for way cheaper AP costs) and have tons more health, it just isn't fair to have him so weak.  He needs a huge health increase (HUGE).  He also needs to do far more damage with green.  I also think the black should be bumped up slightly (like a 50% increase) to be on par with everyone else in the game.

talleman

Im fine with a buff. Champed him last week